Professing Christian Woman with Terminal Cancer Sues California for ‘Right to Die’

ODonnellSACRAMENTO, Calif. — A professing Christian woman from California who has been diagnosed with terminal cancer has sued state officials in her fight to end her life with a lethal dose of medication out of concerns that her natural death will be slow and painful.

“I’ve been a Christian my whole entire life and I am today,” Christy O’Donnell, 46, says in a video released by the group Compassion and Choices, which assisted Brittany Maynard surrounding her death in 2014. “I believe in God, I pray, and I have an entire support system that prays for me.”

O’Donnell, a single mother of a 21-year-old daughter, was diagnosed with stage four lung cancer last year, and while she obtained chemotherapy treatments to conquer the disease, the cancer spread to her brain. Doctors state that they are willing to try an aggressive concoction to help her beat the cancer, but O’Donnell fears what might happen if the treatment is unsuccessful.

“The most likely way that I’m going to die with the lung cancer is that my left lung will fill with fluid, I’ll start drowning in my own fluid,” she states in the video. “I spend an inordinate amount of time being afraid of the pain that I’m going to endure. All of that time that my mind spends thinking about that, I am not living.”

While O’Donnell says that she is afraid of dying in such a manner, she doesn’t really want her life to end and “would do anything to live.” She says that one of the reasons why she is seeking to end her life with a lethal dose of medication, in addition to fear of the pain, is not wanting her daughter to see her suffer.

“My biggest fear about my last moments on earth are that … I’m going to be in so much physical pain that it’s going to make my passing traumatic for me and traumatic for my daughter,” she said in a recent interview with Katie Couric. “And that the whole rest of her life, her last moments of looking at me, touching me, and hearing my voice are going to be a horrible, terrible memory that she’s going to have to carry, rather than it being a loving memory of me.”

O’Donell sued the state of California in May in her desire to be granted a prescription that she could take if she decides that her suffering is too great. She has also testified before the state legislature in support of the proposed End of Life Option Act (SB 128), which passed the California Senate last month 23-14. A vote is expected in the Assembly before September.

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Christian groups in the state have been strongly opposed to the bill, such as the California Family Council, which stated that the passage of the bill in the Senate demonstrated a defiance of “the concerns of thousands of medical professionals, disability rights advocates, and pro-life citizens.”

A report released earlier this year by First Things noted the recent rise in suicide in European countries that have legalized physician-assisted suicide.

“In those countries that have legalized euthanasia (Belgium, Holland, and Luxembourg) the numbers seeking the procedure are spiraling ever upward,” it explained. “In 2013 there were 1,087 cases of euthanasia in Belgium, up 27 percent on the figures for 2012, while 2012 saw a 25 percent increase on the numbers for 2011. In Holland, it has been estimated that 12.3 percent of all deaths are now via euthanasia.”

“[R]ecent incidents included one woman with an eating disorder, and another claiming to be suffering from tinnitus left behind two teenage children,” it continued. “Many living in countries where it is outlawed are now taking part in the macabre phenomenon known as ‘suicide tourism.’ So in Switzerland—where assisted suicide is permitted—the number of cases rose 700 percent within roughly a decade, having been boosted by foreigners making the journey to end their lives.”


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  • The Skeptical Chymist

    Whoever is responsible for the removal of the “Appeal to Heaven” flag from the Bradley County Courthouse is to be commended. The government should be neutral in matters of religion, and all who enter the courthouse should have no reason to think that their religious views will have any impact on the treatment they receive there.

    • morgan

      Agreed. The problem is the supernaturally-charged simply ignore laws and have no sense of fair play. It’s either dominance or revolt – fairness is not a word found in the bible.

      • The Skeptical Chymist

        It’s like dogs marking their territory.

      • David Cromie

        Nor are the words ‘intelligent/intelligence’.

    • Liz Litts

      They don’t know their REAL American history

      • DNelson

        How is that relevant?

      • Gene Schunek

        REAL American history? Have you never heard of the REAL Constitution?i

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Ha! You think even if there was a “real” one over the one we currently have, what makes you think they’d adhere to that one any better than they do to the one we have?

  • DNelson

    It’s just amazing to me that situations like this still come up. What were these folks thinking? How can it not be clear at this point that the government cannot endorse or promote any religion – Christian or otherwise?

    • Liz Litts

      Would you say that in 1776 before the Boston Tea Party?

      • DNelson

        Goodness no. I wasn’t alive then.

      • Nathan Marcy

        (The Boston Tea Party was in 1773)

    • bowie1

      That means no more Christmas tree!

      • DNelson

        Yet another example of the “War on Christmas”

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          …. in July. (Its close enough).

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Also, its Winter Solstice. Christmas usurped that holiday.

          Also, the tree has little to do with Christmas. Not sure how many Douglas Firs are found in the Middle East.

          • DNelson

            Saturnalia rules!

            Trees came from Germanic tradition.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I had forgotten about the Roman celebration of Satunalia. Thanks for that.

          • JG4

            Check out Celtic holidays…..

        • Ed Words

          It’s a Christian war on our Constitution.

      • weasel1886

        The Christmas tree is pagan

        • bowie1

          Probably. Maybe the atheists don’t know that!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Greensleeves is about a prostitute, and not about baby Jesus.

            Like many things that are “Christian” it was taken from the pagan beliefs that came before it. Just another hypocrisy.

          • bowie1

            Or…co-opted. I don’t recall singing that one in church so it may be a secular song sung at that time of year.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Its known as “What Child is This?” which is a direct rip off of the song Greensleeves.

          • bowie1

            According to sources I checked, the tune is the same, but the words are different. By now it is in the public domain so anyone can use that melody and/or words legally.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            You are correct, however I did not say anything about the legality of it.

            Most concepts in Christianity and throughout tje Bible was stolen from other cultures and religions. That is because it is created by man.

            So there is nothing original about the Bible that wasn’t claimed earlier about some other religion.

          • bowie1

            The Bible is the record of God’s people under the old and new covenant with special focus on the Israelites and the beginning of the church in the new covenant. Of course it touches on some of the other nations around it so some of the events may have been mentioned elsewhere and in some archaelogical finds. Other religions may have made similar claims – and still do – but none of the prophets lived a perfect life and arose from the dead. Even Mohammmed was murdered but he stayed dead.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            And? Your Bibles miracles and core events do not match with recorded history. What little that does only matches in generalities. Guess what. People don’t rise from the dead. Neither did Jesus. Those that believe one man who said others saw it are fools for doing so. Especially if someone made those claims to this day, would be ridiculed by the same people that believe this story.

            Why do you believe? Some are victims of upbringing and don’t know any better. Some cant live without some hope for the afterlife. Some are just gullible. Either way, there is nothing to point to that as a truthful conclusion. As long as you have no real evidence, you claims are as weak as the other religions. I would claim some religions are actually stronger because they don’t make as ridiculous claims.

          • bowie1

            The proof for his death was the medical symptoms of water and blood when the soldiers stuck in their sword to make sure he was dead, and the proof of his resurrection were the 500 witnesses afterward. But then do you have proof (eyewitnesses) of mankind’s purported transition (evolution) over millions of years? It seems to me you need to TRUST that it happened that way if you believe it happened that way. Maybe it is you who is gullible!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            1 witness that SAID 500 people saw it.

            Medical consistany proves that someone witnessed a person die on a cross, which was a common punishment at the time. Nothing about Jesus.

            Evolution is science. Until just a few years ago, Pluto was a planet. Now it is not. Science is self correcting. Religion is not. If evolution is wrong then prove the evidence for it is false. Hate to tell you though, that even if you succeed, you have done NOTHING to prove your God any more real.

          • bowie1

            New Living Translation
            “After that, he was seen by more than 500 of his followers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have died.” (1 Corinthians 15:6) You are mistaken. It is written that 500 of his followers saw him at one time – no hearsay, no passing along a few at a time. Of course you can choose to accept it or reject it at your own risk. I also reject the evolutionary scenario because it s based on hearsay, on speculation – the kind of thing that would not be accepted in a court of law. I actually apply more rigorous methods than many scientists.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            So the AUTHOR (which may also be hearsay of the supposed actual witness) of that particular book and chapter STATED that 500 PEOPLE saw it. Those 500 people were NOT making a statement in the Bible. That crap would be throw out as ridiculous in a court room.

          • Bluesman1950

            Saying that other people saw it is exactly hearsay!

          • Bluesman1950

            Do you have the names and sworn testimonies of all 500, or just the word of 1?

          • bowie1

            It doesn’t just say it happened but that it did happen, as a reporter might write up in a newspaper, but would he or she mention the names of all 500 people? The Bible has that type of reporting in other parts, with all the begats. (Also in response to Unrepentant Atheist).

          • Bluesman1950

            So if I tell you that 10,000 people saw me levitate, would that prove that it was true?

          • bowie1

            Perhaps, if I considered you to be a reliable reporter. If it was in one of the supermarket tabloids or a satirical site I might question it. There are reports in the mainstream media in which people have been saved miraculously, beating the odds, and I would need to trust they are telling the truth. It wouldn’t really matter in that case since it wouldn’t be a risk to my life if I questioned it.

          • Bluesman1950

            But it has as much credibility as the new testament, a work publicising, albeit in a confused and self-contradictory way, the alleged deity of its adherent’s leader.

            The new testament is an advertising piece, as reliable as the book of Mormon!

            ‘Beating the odds’ does not prove ‘miracles’. If I win the National Lottery, I will have beaten the odds, but it will be a perfectly natural and explicable event.

          • bowie1

            I suppose then you don’t trust the mainstream media then either? After all, they could be giving you a bill of goods?

          • Bluesman1950

            I’d want some pretty substantial evidence for people rising from the dead!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            A reporter would get witness testimonies and personal accounts to corroborate his stories. If the Bibles authors were modern day journalists their reputation would have already been ruined and they would be out of work.

            On top of that, it is well known that the accounts were written well after the events described. That would be like some writing about first account witnesses 80 years after the events occurred.

            Comparing the Bibles books to journalist accounts is a ridiculous comparison.

          • bowie1

            Isn’t that like getting a letter well after it is written since many of the NT books are correspondence to the churches and the new believers? The book of Acts starts for instance as “Dear Theophilus”, the book of Romans starts as “From Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus…” and so forth. It would make no sense to start that way if it was an account written much later on. Logic and Reason would affirm that it would have been addressed to the early churches.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Great tool to try and build credibility to create fake letters. Which makes me wonder if such a format of writing was even present during the time of JC.

            Even if you are some how right, and SOME of the books have SOME references to scripture, it says nothing of the credibility of the source material. Much of it was edited anyways so as to not contradict as much (did a horrible job of that).

          • bowie1

            What a load of hogwash! I think you’re just grasping at straws.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Why am I grasping at straws? Much of the Bible was compiled a hundred years after the events they depicted. Many parts they found were omitted or edited. Some was dictated from conversations that witnesses said they had and recounted YEARS after they occurred. There is nothing about the Bible that makes it a valid account of anything. There is zero cross referencing available for the major accounts that are present.

          • Thomas W. Yale

            Mohammad wasn’t murdered He died a natural death.

          • bowie1

            From what I read one of his wives poisoned him. However, he is dead and did not ressurrect from death.

          • Thomas W. Yale

            No, He fell ill and suffered for several days with fever, head pain, and weakness, and died on June 8, 632 in a house belonging to Aisha.

          • ArielMalek

            UA-if what you say is the basis of your belief in unbelief-then I applaud you for no one in their right mind-or heart -would believe in a faith like that.
            However, like most atheist caricatures of Christianity, your claims have absolutely no basis in reality, human experience or history. I would respectfully encourage you to explore the real Christianity-not the distorted picture fabricat
            ed by a bunch of grumpy old men like Richard Dawkins and such tale-spinners.
            Socrates said, “The unexamined life is not worth living.” Before you blithely discard the claims of Jesus Christ, you might consider what is really there-and the fact that while atheists have always been a tiny minority, billions of people throughout 2000 years of history have chosen to follow Jesus and even give their lives for Him-not religion-for in Him they found true love and life-which with all due respect you and I both know your heart is missing and longing for. Peace and God bless.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I don’t use Dawkins as a beacon of Atheism. Personally my heroes are more along the lines of Neil Degrasse Tyson, AronRa, and Penn Jillette (apologies for any misspellings of names).

            Can you explain to me what the real Christianity is? It seems that every Christian I talk to has a different opinion on what the Bible should be interpreted as. In my own exploration, I’ve had a preacher tell me its ok for people to kill if it is in the name of government (Evangelistic Christian), stare at me straight in my face and tell me my mentally disturbed friend just went to hell because she killed herself (Catholic), and lost my job because my boss (and weekend evangelist, I believe Protestant… not sure though) found out I was an Atheist, and that is just three quick examples.

            Place on top of that the teachings of slavery (Exodus 21, Leviticus 25 for Old Testament, 1 Timothy 6, Ephesian 6 for New Testament), genocide against the Canaanites, demanding child sacrifice of his followers (even if he didn’t go through with it), promotion of incest in multiple cases (technically we are all descendants of a several hundred year old Noah and his daughters according to the Bible), placing the Tree of Knowledge right next to his “children” who knew not what right and wrong were, then put a snake near by (or it wasn’t of him so it may be another that can influence reality? Polytheism?) to tempt them to eat it knowing that they didn’t know right from wrong. Wasn’t the snake the only one that told the truth? There is so much wrong with the Bible, that I end up off on tangents because there is no end to it.

            As for being misled, there are archaeological studies that show that the Isrealites were never slaves to Egypt, never wandered the desert, and were more likely to be Canaanites themselves but broke away. Kinda hard for Moses to lead a people out of a desert they were never in. Noah and his arc is a joke on physics and biology (and there is no proof of) and of all the places to build a religion your going to start it in the middle of uneducated town in the desert? I could write a book on this.

            While you criticized my “belief”, your main argument comes down to “but there are so many of us!?!” Well, the fact is Constantine made it the main state religion in one of the greatest empires in history, which did wonders for spreading it initially. The bigotry and hatred carried it from there as people who did not share the belief were slaughtered by religiously motivated armies, or burned at the stake as a symbol of religious dominance. When your religion achieved dominance, the regional disputes on belief differences took hold and you started killing yourselves in wars and internal conflict.

            If you were an Atheist, you had a choice, be quiet, feign belief or die horribly. Much like the Middle East now. Only genius forefathers who saw what happened when religion took power in other countries, had the foresight to put it in the constitution that everyone had a right to their beliefs. This protected everyone, Christians included (they were busy killing themselves in denomination feuds at the time).

            So looking back at the flawed book, and the flawed history of flawed morality, and you think that -I- am the one out of my right mind? If you look back on that, and think that is what we should strive to be, then I think you are the one that needs to revisit the condition of their mind and heart.

            To note, to support the comment you challenged.

            Christmas = Winter Solstice and is NOT Jesus actual birthday.
            Easter = Spring Equinox and is NOT the actual day of the resurrection.
            “What Child is This?” is ripped off from a song called Greensleeves (about a prostitute).
            The Christmas tradition of exchanging gifts was ripped off from a Germanic tradition.

            It goes on and on…..

          • ArielMalek

            Trying to recall the original lyrics to Greensleeves and as recall is more of love song-not to do with prostitute. But even if it was, -so what?- Christians just took the tune and adopted it for a Christmas carol with their own lyrics about Jesus-as song writers have done for millenia . Atheists with all due respect are quite lavish in throwing charges of “hypocrisy” against Christians when they are so often speaking out of their own religious ignorance and prejudice. A good look in the mirror on occasion might be wise before casting stones. 😉 God bless.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            The religious teach their followers to reject evidence and instead use faith. To me that is the definition of ignorance. Atheists don’t have a “lack of knowledge” (most don’t anyways), instead it is the evidence that exists that provides the information to come to the conclusion that God does not exist. You want to know what one of the biggest sources of evidence is that drives people toward Atheism? The Bible itself. I ENCOURAGE people to read it. THE WHOLE THING. Not just the pretty “baby Jesus loves you” parts.

            As for the song, that is fine as long as you don’t keep claiming how “original” your religion is.

        • ArielMalek

          Not at all. Sure pagans like the Druids had their ceremonies with trees etc. But that doesn’t make the Christmas tree pagan. As I recall it was Luther who decorated trees to honor Christ’s birth and the custom in Christendom continued.. Pagans also worshiped the sun, the moon and their own toe-nail jam-(:) ). Just because other people enjoy or have those things doesn’t mean they are submitting to pagan rites. As Christians, per Paul nothing is good or evil in itself-we can sanctify and redeem things for Christ’s sake. Jesus is Lord, not t he devil.

      • Lark62

        Millions of Christmas trees are sold annually. And that won’t change.

        Stop lying.

        The government simply can’t tell you that a Christmas tree is the proper form of worship. The government can’t say “we like christians best.”

    • Ed Words

      Someone once said, “People with irrational beliefs will do irrational things.”

      Don’t be ‘amazed’.

    • ArielMalek

      Sir you would be wise to read the true history and founding of our nation. The true and accurate record of history-as distinct from that one fabricated by revisionist atheists–is clear our Founders were overwhelmingly Christian and based on very freedoms and nation on Christianity and the Bible. Supreme Court and other governmental decisions clearly recognized this fact up until about the mid-1950s when radical activist judges without legal or historical precedent totally twisted and perverted the Constitution to make it fit their own twisted minds which were totally contrary to the Founders’ intents.
      Yes, the old Soviet Communist Constitution had separation of church and state that suppressed religious expression. But the so-called “unconstitutionality” of religious expression in our nation is merely the atheist form of judicial fairy-tales.
      But the Biblical notion of the sacredness of human will and conscience protected the rights of all-people of all faiths-and non-faiths; unlike atheist based nations such as in Communist nations-and as we are veering toward–which destroy liberties for all. For those desiring an atheist-based Constitution, We the People-the vast majority of whom are Christian (about 85% of total US population) prefer to retain our freedoms and would suggest those who don’t try living in atheist based nations such as North Korea, China or Cuba for 5-10 years and tell us how you like the fruit of your own beliefs. Cheers, have a good day.

      • DNelson

        “and based on very freedoms and nation on Christianity and the Bible.”

        Since the protections provided by the Constitution directly conflict with 7 of the 10 commandments, your statement is patently false.

  • Dave_L

    Actually, the Bible is foremost in teaching separation of Church and State. Since the New Testament, Jesus teaches his Kingdom is not of this world. So there is no such thing as a “Christian Nation”. Jesus however rules the nations today from Heaven. Separation of Church and State? Yes. Separation of State from Heaven? No.

    “….Jesus Christ, …..the ruler over the kings of the earth….” (Revelation 1:5, NKJV)

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      I see.

      So can you please stop fighting attempts to get God out of the pledge please? Oh… wait… case of hypocrisy again?

  • Tara

    In the end…….’every knee will bow, every tongue confess that He is Lord’…no amount of posturing or whining about Christian symbolism will ever change God’s will. Ever. The efforts of atheists are fruitless; God isn’t going anywhere and even if every thing on earth that represented Christianity was removed from the earth, guess what? He’s still going to be here; we’re still going to follow Him. Man’s wisdom is but foolishness compared to God’s and I feel fully and absolutely confident in Him.

    • Lark62

      Bow and confess to your heart’s content. Pray when you want, how you want, to whom you want.

      You can do that for the simple reason that no person may use the authority of government to direct you to honor, worship or acknowledge any diety. Unlike under the puritans, religious beliefs are left to the conscience of each person not dictated by authority.

      We all have a responsibility to keep religion free of government interference.

      • Ralph Oswald

        And conversely, keeping government and public policy free from religious interference.

        • Lark62

          Yes

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      …. except if he doesn’t exist. Which means you are all worshiping “a false idol” as your Bible would describe it.

      In the end we all die. That’s the only truth we can gleam from evidence about where life leads.

      • Tara

        in the end, if you’re right, we have nothing to lose, do we? If I’m right, we have our eternity to lose. I follow Him and believe in His son, Jesus, so I’m not worried about mine.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Not the only two conclusions to come to. You forget about all the religions for which you are a heathen for and the punishments they have planned for you for not believing.

          If you are right and a god exists, probability would imply that you are likely worshiping the wrong one if all odds are equal.

          • Tara

            I’ll take my chances……

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Good luck with that.

          • Tara

            ditto

        • David Cromie

          Reminds me of Pascal’s wager.

    • stop2wonder

      Question: if I posted some line from another holy book talking about how eventually everyone will come to worship that diety, would you take it to heart or be dismissive of it? When you understand why you would be dismissive of that one, then you will realize why a bunch of atheists will be equally dismissive of both.

      • Unrepentant Atheist

        That’s right. Ragnarok is coming and Odins Valkaries are going to pick warriors from the dead to help fight.

      • Tara

        It’s not being dismissive when one doesn’t follow something. I follow the God of Heaven, creator of the universe, author of the Bible….no one else.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Belief is fine until one declares it as truth to another.

          Then you must defend your claim.

      • FoJC_Forever

        The pertinent question is, why do atheists feel compelled to come to a Christian website, engage in “conversation”, then rage and whine about the Christian oriented answers and comments they read?

        Answer: You are antichrist and compelled by the Devil to harass Christians.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Why? Maybe it feels good to have a medium to speak out against the onslaught of “fantasy as reality” propaganda. Maybe I did a search on Google for “Atheist News” and it brought me here. Maybe there is hope that someone reading this exchange can see just how ridiculous the argument for a god of any kind sounds, and will actually work to make the world a better place instead of praying it would get better.

          I laugh when people cry “its a Christian website!” like this is private property like their church. You want to know why they don’t boot Atheists out of here? Because of the advertisement money. Even with all the holier than though articles, it still comes down to money. So gather up the sheckles, the “Christian community” has found another income source.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You’re like a sesame seed in someone’s dentures. You are somewhere you don’t belong and are only causing pain and discomfort.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Only to those that don’t want their precious fantasy disturbed. I don’t look to hurt or disturb anyone, however your beliefs hurt other people. Sad part, is most don’t even see it.

    • chiefwarrantofficer

      How presumpious that YOU would presume to ever ‘know’ the will of ‘god.’ You are merely pretending that whatever religious opinion you hold is the ‘one & only” way.

      • Tara

        no. I’m not. I’m going by the Bible. His word, which millions have read, as well as myself. No presuming. He is quite open about His will in there.

        • chiefwarrantofficer

          Again, you presume that the ‘bible’ version that you have chosen ‘to go by’ is the ‘real’ version over the hundreds of versions available around the world and is the one and only source of ‘truth.’ You presume that gives you some fact that is special to you.

          It does not and never has done so. Your religious opinions remain opinions.

          • Tara

            well, don’t most people follow/adhere to a certain philosophy/belief system that they presume is the right one? And I don’t presume I have some special facts…..God gave the Bible to everyone to read. I read it, and I believe it. That isn’t arrogance. It’s just a personal fact.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            It is your presumption that you are the only one who has the one & only explanation of that is right. It’s just a personal fact that YOU do not and never have spoken for anyone, much less God.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Correction: you don’t know the Will of God. Those of us who follow Jesus (the) Christ know the Will of God, because He reveals it to us.

            You are the one in presumption.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Oh. Please tell us. What is the will of God? Is it the spread of AIDS (and other venereal diseases) in Africa? Is it the devastation of Nepal? How about outrage and bigotry?

            I think you have an idea of what God wants because it is what YOU want, and you overlap your values and call it Gods work. Wasn’t pride a deadly sin?

          • FoJC_Forever

            No, AIDS, like all disease, is a result of Sin’s presence in the earth. You regularly engage in double-speak, which is proof of the hypocrisy and error in your heart and mind.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Please cite the Bible passage where AIDS is described as such. Nope…. doesn’t exists. That means you created that little piece of wisdom all on your own, or got it from someone like minded.

            Once again, you take your personal belief, and transform it to “God’s” actions.

            Your belief isn’t in God, it is in yourself. You just seek God’s authority to push it on to others.

          • David Cromie

            Along with earthquakes, E Nino-type devastation, and all sorts of other natural calamities?

          • FoJC_Forever

            The earth is groaning, yearning for the manifestation of the sons of God. There is a Day when it will be remade, free of Sin. When that Day comes, there will be complete Peace in the universe and on the earth.

          • David Cromie

            Where do you this gobbledygook from?

          • FoJC_Forever

            It is Truth. It is the Word of the Eternal God. He is Jesus (the) Christ.

          • David Cromie

            If this is the nonsense your favoured sky fairy imparts to you, it is about time you changed gurus, or came back to earth. It is all in your head.

          • George T

            Which will of god do you follow? The Southern Baptist, Episcopalian/Anglican, Catholic, Lutheran, Mormon, Calvinist, Methodist, Quaker, or something else?

          • FoJC_Forever

            You’re just fishing for personal information. Open a dialogue, engage, then ask questions apart from the subject at hand. Slick, but your methods are old and obvious.

          • George T

            No, I’m trying to find out which version of Christianity you’re preaching to us. …or are you one of those “non-denominational” people?

          • Tara

            you’ve certainly got the talking in circles thing down pat…lol. We’re at an impasse…..see ya.

          • David Cromie

            Religious ‘opinions’ are nothing more than superstitious rambling, brought on by self-deception out of mere ‘belief’ and a rather peculiar form of ‘faith’.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            Just evidence of wide spread mass hysteria.

        • FoJC_Forever

          Tara, chiefwarrantofficer is a troll. He’s simply baiting you and venting his anger.

          • Tara

            He just talks in circles, about something he knows nothing about. Weird…but whatever floats your boat….lol.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          So… what slaves do you own and what ethnicity are they. Just for transparency sake.

          Hope you didn’t hold on to any Hebrews longer than…. 6 years was it?

    • Ed Words

      I hope you’ve prepared your heart for the Supreme Court’s
      OK to gay marriage.

      • Tara

        I live in Canada. It’s been here for a long time.

    • Ed Words

      And so, too, will Allah and Jehovah be here. So many l-TRU religions.

      (Joan of Arc was also ‘absolutely confident in Him’).

      • Unrepentant Atheist

        I love that story. The hero, turned heathen, turned Saint.

        Proof that Catholic organization (not the average Catholic) will use whoever as they see fit without actually having some kind of “moral guidance”. Heck. Pope Pius used Hitler to try to protect Catholics while condemning Jews to die by the truckload.

    • lorrainie

      Amen!

  • Liz Litts

    How many kinds of stupid are these people???? This flag was first carried by the Sons of Libetry -Leading up to the Revolutionary war???? and of course(roll eyes) we were not founded as a Christian nation. Have Americans been dumbed down so much that they don’t know their early history??? Has no one read the Mayflower compact or any of the early Puritain writings?? No ‘seperation of Church and state there ! Don’t people get taught about the Great Awakening that led to the break from England? Boy we really need God’s help here and I am praying for revival in this land.

    • DNelson

      Yeah! Right! Let’s go back to the way things were under the Puritans. Branding the foreheads of non-Christians. Witch burning. Telling left-handed people they are possessed by Satan. Complete bans on any religion other than the Christian religion. No such concept as free speech.

      You tell ’em Liz! Puritans now, Puritans tomorrow, Puritans forever!!!!!!!

      • The Skeptical Chymist

        Yeah, and let’s hang some Quakers, too, just like the Puritans did in the good old days!

        • DNelson

          Ahhhh….Quaker hangings. I’d forgotten about those. Such good times. Grandma would always make a casserole. With oats, for some reason.

          Liberals spoil everything!

          • stop2wonder

            Yep. People think the Puritans were trying to escape religious persecution. That is flatly wrong. They only wanted to flip the script. As soon as they got over here the persecuted became the persecutors.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            All religions teach that other religions are their enemies. There are no exceptions no matter how people want to promote their religion as “love”.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And most of their ‘victims’ were other Puritans that were not ‘good enough’ to be “Puritans.” Talk about a bunch of nutcases.

    • stop2wonder

      None of that matters when compared to the Constitution.

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      Having Christians participate in the Revolutionary war does not equal Christian country. Or were there no Atheists in America at that time? There were pagans. Or so the Salem Witch Trials suggests.

      There were many beliefs at the time of the founding, and many were at each others throats. Heck Philly was a war zone between Protestants and Catholics. There was no unified Christianity at the time. Actually it wasn’t until much later that the denominations could agree enough to use the term “Christian” to promote what few ideals they could all agree on.

    • Guzzman

      Who needs a history lesson? The concept of separating religion and government traces back to Roger Williams, a 17th century colonial Baptist, who wrote about the need to create a “wall of separation” between the church and civil authority.

      In a nutshell, Roger Williams founded the First Baptist Church and the colony of Rhode Island in 1636 on the premise of separation of church and state. This colony was the first to guarantee freedom of worship for all its citizens. Roger Williams’ views later became the future model for the U.S. Constitution’s prohibition against state sponsored religion.

  • FoJC_Forever

    Atheism is a religious belief. Governments promote and support religious beliefs every day. The only religion harassed is that which appears to be, or actually is, Christianity. This may seem awful to some people, but it’s a Truth in which to rejoice! Those harassed and railed against for loving and following Jesus should thank God for the honor to suffer for His namesake.

    Praise God, we are not of this world! Those who have been given Eternal Life through Jesus (the) Christ will live forever in the New Heavens and New Earth. Stay True. Continue to pray and seek the Kingdom of God. The End of this Age is at hand!

    • stop2wonder

      It was not taken down in the name of atheism, it was taken down in the name of secularism. Taking down the flag is not Christian harassment, it’s simply taking a neutral stance.

      • FoJC_Forever

        You are not neutral. It is impossible for you to be neutral. You have a stated set of beliefs which are directly related to religious belief. You simply lie to yourself about not having a religion so you can appeal to your own selfishness.

        You answer to God through the LORD Jesus (the) Christ. You can’t change this Truth anymore than you can change being human.

        Judgement is coming.

        • stop2wonder

          First, I’m talking about government neutrality toward religion, not an attachment individual person.

          Second, thanks for turning an opportunity to have a healthy debate about church/state separation into a sermon. Some would say that’s the strategy used be the side who knows they have nothing substantial left to add.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I second that.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Debates are not healthy. Your words come from Unbelief. Unbelief is Satan’s belief.

          • stop2wonder

            Your thoughts on the matter would be right at home in the Middle East.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Not true. Your wretched kind keep trying to tie Christianity to Islam, but the two are diametrically opposed.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            They are simply sides to the same coin attempting to force others to accept their beliefs as the only valid belief, not diametrically opposed in any way, shape, or form.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            So diametrically opposed they share the same base book for their beliefs. The Old Testament.

            You can not change history regarding your text, if your text is the main basis for your beliefs.

            The only thing that separates you is culture and the argument about which messiah is which.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          “It is impossible for you to be neutral.”

          Of course it is. Religion says that those who are not within their folds are enemies or targets of prothletising.

        • Nathan Marcy

          Blah blah blah. Vague premonitions and empty threats. Meaningless posturing.

          • FoJC_Forever

            When you die, you will revise your belief system – permanently.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And when you die, you will become worm food and at least the worms will care that you ever existed.

    • Carlos Romero

      Atheism is a religious belief in the same way “not smoking” is a habit.
      Christians get the brunt of it because they’re the majority religion in the Western Hemisphere, not only in the US. If the government is to remain neutral when it comes to religion, numbers say Christians will be the ones most affected by it.

      • stop2wonder

        Excuse me while I go and not collect some stamps; my new favorite hobby.

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      Here we go again…..

      There is no doctrine of how an Atheist has to think, believe or anything. Therefore not a “religious” belief.

      Christian majority claiming to be harassed minority noted and ignored due to absurdness.

      Preaching does not help point at all any more than a crazy screaming homeless person is taken seriously.

      End of the world has been “right around the corner” since some crazy loon wrote down a silly prophecy. So it will always be in the near future but never come true. How many “Christian” lives have been ruined by their faith in such a thing every time some “expert” claims they know the date and they give up their livelihood to grovel before a rapture that never comes. Religion makes me sick.

      • FoJC_Forever

        You are wrong. Atheism is centered around the rejection of religions, therefore it is centered around religious belief. You can’t get away from it, anymore than you can get away from existence.

        You, and everyone, answer to God through the LORD Jesus (the) Christ. Nothing you can do or believe will change this Truth.

        Judgement is coming.

        • weasel1886

          Doesn’t the Bible say to kill unbelievers?

          Deuteronomy 13:6-10New International Version (NIV)

          6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death.

          So you don’t even follow your own doctrine, unless you DO believe unbelievers should die

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I am curious on how many slaves he owns, and whether or not any of them are Hebrew.

            ” If you buy a Hebrew slave, he must remain your slave for six years. But in the seventh year you must set him free, without cost to him. 3 If he was single at the time you bought him, he alone must be set free. But if he was married at the time, both he and his wife must be given their freedom. 4 If you give him a wife, and they have children, only the man himself must be set free; his wife and children remain the property of his owner.”

            Exodus 21

            So… how devout a Christian is he? Is he ready to push for slavery to be made legal again because it is his religious right?

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Wrong.

          Atheism has as much to do with being “centered around religious belief” as not collecting baseball cards has to do with sports.

          You are making a mistake and assuming all Atheists are Anti-Theists, which IS anti-religion. For an alternative, you can look up and learn about Humanism.

          I am an Anti-Theist. I think religion is a plague that trades critical thinking and reality for a happy little fantasy to make people feel better about their insignificant life.

          Not all Atheists share my views on religion (as a matter of fact, probably most Atheists do not). Most want to be left alone or feel a need to do something good in the world to help humanity as a whole.

          The only reason I can not “get away from it” (religion) is because of the incessant requirement of its followers to promote its teachings. I understand that most view it as a sort of charity, but one I could do without.

          You have no basis for your belief outside a ancient poorly assembled book, and perhaps your own delusions. So until I have a real reason to see any truth to your fantasy, I’ll choose to mock and disdain it. The same way I would treat someone that said they make their daily decisions by the invisible advisory gnome that sat on their shoulder whispering advice in their head. No matter what “good” they thought they were doing.

          • Nathan Marcy

            I would actually say I’m both an anti-theist AND a Humanist. I think Humanism is a very positive worldview and it does a lot of good for people to contribute to society. Meanwhile I think religion is very harmful. All the good things you have with religion you can have without religion, and without all the negative stuff like crusades and inquisitions.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I like to say the same about myself, but in forums like these, I tend to represent the former first. I let my non-profit work speak for itself. My dislike for religion isn’t about the people who follow it, but instead the religious beliefs itself.

            Most of the people that follow these religions were born into it. It is what they were taught and via their brainwashing growing up, don’t know any better to question what their parents and priests/rabbi/preacher/etc. taught them.

          • FoJC_Forever

            your beliefs are centered around religion. you are obsessed with religion. Otherwise, you wouldn’t be anywhere near religious discussions or religious people.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Like I said, I am an Anti-Theist. I find religion repulsive and prone to making people do stupid, hateful and life endangering things. Religion is one charismatic leader away from killing a ton of people. For every ISIS, there is a David Karesh or a Heaven’s Gate.

            I am not “religious” in the sense that I believe in any of your mumbo jumbo about a sky daddy by any name. However, I can recognize the dangers of what your Bible teaches and oppose it without having to have faith in something fake.

          • Lark62

            I object to violations of the Constitution of the United States by government officials who use government property and resources to favor their religious beliefs. I object to christians trying to enshrine the crazy rules if their religion into secular law.

            I have no problem with the vast majority of christians who somehow manage to worship, pray and follow their beliefs without government reminders or legislative action.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You are clueless as to the intricate role religion played in the founding of the USA and it’s infusion into many of the laws, federal, state, and local.

            Secular rule is cruel, misguided and foolish.

          • Lark62

            Try counting all the times god is mentioned in the US Constitution.

            There is nothing cruel, misguided or foolish about a government that treats all citizens equally without regard to which absurd mythological being they worship

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And you reamin cluelses as to the multitude of ways those founding fathers used to ensure that ‘religion’ was not a part of the Constitution. They had fought a war to escape from a ‘state religion’ and did not want it replicated here.

          • David Cromie

            Try a theocracy where Sharia law is the only law. You seem to wish for a ‘christian’ theocracy, which would be just as cruel, and evil, to anyone who openly objected to its tenets. Check out the history of christianity throughout the centuries.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Christianity isn’t cruel. Man-made traditions and religion is cruel, but not Christianity. You’re confusing the two.

          • David Cromie

            Christianity is just as man-made as any other religion, current or defunct.
            You seem to be confusing superstitious phantasy for reality. Have you not checked out the history of religion yet, for the finer details of the truth about religious cruelty over the centuries?

          • FoJC_Forever

            You are antichrist. You are groping in Darkness, all the while believing you’re intelligent and enlightened. You must know the things you are writing have been written here before. The same Lie. The same Unbelief.

            I’m aware of the history of false religions. It is Sin which compels mankind to do evil. Sin includes the plethora of false religions, as well as fake Christianity. It also includes those who war against others for dominance and control, apart from religion.

            Atheism is a false religion as well. Atheists worship and honor humanity, their own intellect, their own abilities, and science (natural understanding). Atheists are antichrist; just another lost group of people who believe the Devil’s lies.

            You can be free from your Sin, free of the ignorance inside your soul, and free from the Darkness which permeates your spirit. Call upon Jesus (the) Christ for Salvation. Ask Him to reveal Himself to you. He will show you Truth, if you call upon Him from a sincere and honest heart.

          • David Cromie

            How could anyone be anti anything that is not proven to exist? Should I go around with a placard proclaiming; ‘I am anti Odin! Join me in the fight to save the world from this war mongering, dangerous, ogre’, what would your reaction be on seeing me?

            So your answer is that all religions are ‘false’, except the one you happen to subscribe to. How smugly delusional.

            My answer to you is that all religions, especially yours, are the result of mankind’s ignorance and superstition when confronted with the otherwise inexplicable facts of existence.

            This credulity was, cynically, turned into a control mechanism by the early christians in the form of hierarchical ‘organised’ religion. Once it was seen that fear could be a very effective control mechanism (and a great source of money), religions, sects, etc. began to spring up all over the place, especially in the US. These hybrids are available to us all at our front doors, most days of the week, now.

            As science unravels the secrets of the universe, the room for superstition gets narrower, and narrower. This phenomenon has been aptly referred to as the diminishing ‘god of the gaps’. No wonder religiots (cf. ISIL) are determined to fight this, using any means, fair or foul, to maintain sway over the semiliterate, the vulnerable, and the weak-minded.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Odin is a name given to a demon who was worshiped by people of a pagan culture. If you want to warn people about him, go ahead, but you’ll have to get saved from your Sin so that the Holy Spirit can teach you the Truth about him and other demons worshiped in pagan cultures.

          • David Cromie

            As far as Odin worshippers are concerned, you are the pagan!

          • FoJC_Forever

            The opinions of those who are antichrist are not relevant. Only Truth matters. Jesus (the) Christ is Truth.

          • David Cromie

            Your superstitious self-oppression does you proud. Where is the evidence for your favourite sky fairy, which would make all other ‘gods’ redundant?

          • FoJC_Forever

            You don’t want evidence. You want to be blind, so you cannot see or understand it.

          • David Cromie

            Try me!

          • Jim H

            You don’t need the Holy Spirit to be taught about Odin or any mythological figure. You just need to read something other than the Bible, which some would contend also teaches about mythological figures, albeit a very select few.
            Odin was not a demon. He is the mythological King of the Norse gods. At one time he was called “Odin the Wanderer” because he wandered in search of wisdom, which he eventually gave his left eye for. Many are unaware of the influence of Odin on the development of Santa Claus.
            However, the Norse did have demons; Fenrir, who was a wolf, Jormungand, who was a great serpent, and Hel, who ruled over the underworld.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You see the facade, the Lie believed by the pagans. The Truth is that demons posed as gods to people who rejected God. This Truth applies to the pagan deities worshiped by all cultures. The only True Deity is the Creator of the universe who sent His Word to become a human, whom we call Jesus (the) Christ.

          • Jim H

            Is your perspective really so narrow and closed-minded that you believe that? I guess you have never heard of Jungian type archetypes or read Joseph Campbell or others who study myths and the common themes they share.

            At one time, most cultures had not even heard of Yahweh, much less rejected him. They made up their supernatural causes to explain things they couldn’t understand.

            According to your beliefs, God chose only Abraham and his descendants to reveal himself to. He stuck with that plan for a couple of millennium and only gave it because, although they still believed in him, they rejected.

            Until that happened, no other culture was ever offered the chance to accept him. In fact, the Israelites were cautioned not to associate with them and defile themselves. The Bible recounts many incidents where the Israelites are ordered just to slaughter them.

            Even Jesus reiterated the exclusivity of his mission:

            “But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

            Matthew 15:24

            Or to the woman was a Gentile, of the Syrophoenician race:

            “And He was saying to her, “Let the children be satisfied first, for it is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.”…

            Mark 7:27
            Your theology seems very superficial and often seems to have nothing to do with the Bible. You just seem to babble any theological sound nonsense floating around in your head. A lot of it has no foundation in anything but your own strange thinking.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You’ve subjected yourself to misinformation.

          • Jim H

            You accuse me of wandering in darkness when your head is obviously stuck up where the sun doesn’t shine.

          • FoJC_Forever

            I’m not accusing, and you wander in Darkness, not darkness.

          • Jim H

            Should I say: “I know you are but what am I?”. It would be about as profound as your comments, maybe more so.

          • Ken Campbell

            What is the difference between Darkness and darkness?

          • FoJC_Forever

            darkness is night time, when you turn out the lights in your living room… natural

            Darkness, to name a few, is referred to in Col. 1:13, Matt. 4:16, Matt. 6:23, Matt. 8:12, Matt. 22:13, Jude 1:6, Jude 1:3, 1 John 1:5-6, Eph. 5:8 …

          • Ken Campbell

            Ah…so Darkness (with a capital) is a place.

          • FoJC_Forever

            It’s a condition of the human spirit without Christ.

          • Ken Campbell

            We don’t usually capitalize conditions unless they are based on a specific name. For example, we will say ‘flu’ or “Swine Flu”. I’m assuming that this Darkness is a Christian term. Is it used by any other religions to show some absence of the respective religious spirit?

          • Ken Campbell

            We would not have Wednesday if it were not for Odin. Its the weekly worship day

          • Bluesman1950

            Our atheist ‘obsession’ is with keeping your superstitions out of public life.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You’re on your way to Hell. There is a place devoid of all Life and Good. There is no rest there. There is no pleasure there. There is only Eternal loneliness and pain. It is what you seek. It is what you will find.

          • Bluesman1950

            Woo hoo, scary threats. Father Christmas won’t bring you any presents if you’re horrible.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You only reveal that you’re afraid. I’m not making scary threats, simply telling you where you’re Unbelief is taking you.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Belief is irrelevant. Truth is unchangeable.

            The only thing we can do is seek truth, whatever it is.

            Believing in something as true without verifying is the path to gullibility (and gold candlesticks in the Vatican).

          • Bluesman1950

            Afraid of your nasty fairy? Not really.

          • FoJC_Forever

            When I tell you Judgement is coming, the first reaction in you is fear. Why? Because Judgement is coming and you are not ready for it. You are afraid of death and afraid of standing before God. If you would forsake your ways and follow Jesus, then you wouldn’t be afraid of Judgement anymore.

          • Bluesman1950

            It is you religious who fear death and the angry, judgemental fairy that you think comes after it. You waste your lives trying to please the imaginary ‘god’ created by bronze-age goatherds.

            I have no fear of death. It comes to us all and then there is nothing.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You are a fool.

          • Bluesman1950

            For not believing in fairies?

          • FoJC_Forever

            Psalm 14:1 – The fool has said in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, They have done abominable works, There is none who does good.

            Because God has revealed your heart.

          • Bluesman1950

            Well that has convinced me!

            Do you really think that some piece of bible nonsense that effectively says “If you disbelieve, you are a fool.” will turn me into a believer?

            If I remind you of what it says in the Quran ““The unbelievers among the People of the Book [Bible] and the pagans shall burn for ever in the fire of Hell. They are the vilest of all creatures.” Quran 98:6” will that convince you to turn Muslim?

            Quotations from books of fairy tales carry little weight, regardless of which fairy allegedly wrote them.

          • FoJC_Forever

            No, I don’t. It’s obvious you enjoy Unbelief and want to live a God-less life here on earth. A God=less life here on earth ends in a God-less existence, eternally separated from all Good and Life. Besides, it’s not Christians who “convince” people to accept Jesus (the) Christ, it’s the Holy Spirit who draws people to Him. You resist and reject the Holy Spirit. For your sake, I hope the day comes when the hardness of your heart and mind are broken and you receive the Word of God to be saved from your Sin.

          • Bluesman1950

            I am happy living a godless life and a fairyless life and a fatherchristmasless life etc. etc.

            You cling to your comfort blanket if you want to. Console yourself that all the suffering that occurs in the world will be magically made better when the sufferers have died (provided they believe in your god, of course, not any of the others). Congratulate yourself on the prize you will get for being a good boy.

            Just keep your beliefs out of government and law and accept that, whilst the ‘holy spirit’ may be real to you, it is about real to me as Shrek.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Hell! ROFL

            So you give me a choice to go to an afterlife with Jerry Falwell or Albert Einstein….

            Hmm….. let me see……

            By the way fictional Gods come with fictional bad guys and bad places and bad punishments too. Scaring children into believing this crap is CHILD ABUSE.

          • FoJC_Forever

            I was not aware that you are a child. If you are a child, then you have nothing to worry about. When a child dies, they are ushered into the Glorious Presence of God to live for Eternity.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Thank goodness I’m all grown up then.

            Too many adults forget how to laugh. You should try it sometime.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Then you’re on your way to the Lake of Fire because you have rejected the Truth, Jesus (the) Christ.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Imaginary people threatening imaginary things. Sir, you need counciling and treatment for your delusions.

          • Bluesman1950

            And Christian love to you too!

            Do you realise that trying to scare us with your monster under the bed just sounds ridiculous?

          • George T

            The US is lousy with religious people. If a person lives in any city of note, it’s near impossible to avoid religious people… but really, why would we want to? Most people are pretty nice and don’t throw their religious beliefs around like monkeys with feces.

          • FoJC_Forever

            And you incessantly promote the teachings of your religion. You are a hypocrite, practicing the very things you condemn in other religions. Atheism, which in inextricably tied to Humanism, is your religion.

        • chiefwarrantofficer

          “Nothing you can do or believe will change this Truth.”

          Not actually a “truth”, more like a completely unsubstantiated OPINION.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Appearing to be an officer of the law doesn’t intimidate me. You are a troll.

          • Lark62

            Note to the poorly educated – A chief warrant officer is a rank in the United States military and has zip to do with law enforcement.

          • FoJC_Forever

            The military carries out and enforces law. The police carries out and enforces law. Your understanding of law and it’s many, many agents needs further study.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            A warrant officer has NOTHING to do with military law.

            One I know was in charge of a warehouse. So unless huge stockpiles of MREs were being held for questioning… I don’t see your statement being any less than ignorant.

          • FoJC_Forever

            All police officers enforce laws. The Sheriff’s Department enforces the law. The military enforces the law, they call it the Constitution. the FBI enforces the law. The Office of Homeland Security enforces law. The CIA is governed by and enforces law. The IRS enforces the law. These are just a few of the many law enforcement agencies in America. It’s all centered on the government, which is run by laws.

            Whether you like it or not, if you work for the government then you are an active member of carrying out and enforcing laws.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            A Warrant Officer is not a police man! Geez are you too stupid to Google it?

            Warrant Officer:

            Warrant officers in the United States are classified as officers and are in the “W” category (NATO “WO”); they are technical leaders and specialists.

            Reading your post, you sound like you understand that fact, at least after you initially voiced your opinion, and then decided to turn the military into a Police force to show how you are right.

            The day the military turns into a police force is the day we have the 2nd civil war.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You are oblivious to the obvious. You see life through a tiny pinhole, and your understanding of reality is just as small.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Your the one that can’t even educate himself on military ranking before going on a tirade. I’m afraid your ability to judge anyone’s grasp of reality is lacking. You don’t even have enough grasp of your own Bible to be able to argue with me on it. You see, I have actually read the book, unlike you, and know its contents. I would advise you to open its pages and read the WHOLE BOOK before you start making judgements based on its contents.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And what delusional world do you exist in that would make you even consider that I was even “appearing” to be an “officer of the law?”

            You are apparently too ignorant and or stupid to understand the difference between “opinion’ and “fact’ and ‘truth.’

            I would posit that those failures would keep you from even understanding the “message’ you are voicing is not the actual message that was given humans ove 2,000 years ago.

            Now that is definitely a TROLL, a stupid & ignorant one, but definitely a TROLL.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You are simply a God-less person practicing a fake religion. And, again, I’m not intimidated.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And I don’t think you have any idea what ‘religion’ I practice so thank you for yet another unsubstantiated opinion that is completely bogus and further evidence of the utter lack of any brain inside that skull on the top of what passes for a spine.

            I did not attempt to ‘intimidate’ you, I merely stated that you are too ignorant to be walking around without an adult present.

          • FoJC_Forever

            It’s obvious by your arrogance that you practice a false religion, even if you claim to not be religious. Everyone is religious in one form or another, because it’s built in to humans to be so.

            Your words are the only substantiation needed to see the Darkness in your heart.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            And you persist in your lack of reading comprehension. I made no claim of which religion I practice and yet you continue to insist that is it a ‘false’ one. That is bigotry of the lowest order.

            Your other comments remain as ignorant as usual and reflect so very poorly on the condition of the human in the world that you apparently think we live in and on.

            I live in a world of truth and light, you should come visit sometime but leave the bigotry and hatred and lies behind.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Again, more condescending rhetoric. You’re truly a bane to everyone who can read.

            You live in the False Light and the Lie. I will not be joining you in your Unbelief.

            Judgement is coming.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            Talk about condescending rhetoric! You presume to know what I believe in, and even more condescendingly, presume to judge what others believe in.

            Judgement is indeed coming and you & your ilk will be very alarmed at what it does not do for those of you who fail to live a Christian life.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Please cite the study that dictates we were built in to have religion?

            Being curious does not equal needing religion.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Ahahahahaha! I didn’t get to see the original post, but based on your reply I couldn’t stop laughing.

            Apparently your name “chiefwarrantofficer” was perceived as a civilian law enforcement position and not a Military rank as is its definition.

            That was priceless.

          • chiefwarrantofficer

            One should never be startled by the almost universal ignorance found among all the religious ‘experts’ who gather to tell others what their twisted version of ‘god’ would or would not have entire other groups of people do.

            And from reading the other comments of that not completely connected to the real world we actually live in, that was a very mild example of their delusional status.

            And we all do need a good laugh when the inmates are attempting to run the factilty. Glad you got a good laugh out of it.

        • Lark62

          I don’t believe that bigfoot exists, because there is no evidence that it does.

          I don’t believe that unicorns exist, because there is no evidence that they do.

          I don’t believe that the biblical god exists, because there is no evidence that it does.

          I don’t believe that a giant frog is sitting on my car because there is no evidence for that.

          I don’t believe that mermaids exist, because there is no evidence that they do

          I don’t believe that heaven and hell exist, because there is no evidence that they do.

          I don’t believe that Napoleon has been reincarnated and is living in my spare bathroom, because there is no evidence that for that.

          If everything I don’t believe for lack of evidence is my religion, I sure have a lot of religions. And so do you.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Atheism is centered around religious belief. You simply practice an anti-religion religion. Quite moronic, actually.

            The universe is proof of God’s existence. He provides those who Believe with all the proof necessary. Those who choose Unbelief, like yourself, are lost in Darkness.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            But… but I swear I saw Napoleon! Why wont you believe me?!?

          • Lark62

            ‘Cause it was really Elvis dressed up as Napoleon.

        • Bluesman1950

          Do you believe in fairies? If not, are your beliefs centred around rejection of fairies?

          Your ‘judgement’ is just another fairy story.

          • FoJC_Forever

            You believe in that which does not exist – a God-less universe. The universe and the earth belong to God. you will be Judged by Who you believe to not exist. You are living the “fairy tale”.

          • Bluesman1950

            So show me the proof of the existence of any god.

          • FoJC_Forever

            If you really wanted proof, you’d see it. You don’t want proof, so you ignore all the proof God has already supplied. Anymore trolling questions?

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Wanting to see only helps support delusion. It is much harder to accept what you do not want to see.

            I’d love to believe in some benevolent force that looks out for us, however it would be nothing like your God.

            Just wanting there to be something like that doesn’t make it so.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Your own words reveal your own heart. You don’t want to see, so you don’t see. You don’t want to believe, so you don’t believe. You have chosen Darkness and Unbelief. You will find what you seek, an Eternal God-less existence devoid of all Good and Life.

          • Bluesman1950

            In other words, you have no proof. Thought so.

          • FoJC_Forever

            I have all the proof I need. I seek the LORD, He reveals Himself and His Word. Proof. You don’t want proof, so you don’t seek the One who will give you the proof. God will prove Himself, but you reject His proof. Then you whine around in your Unbelief saying there isn’t any proof. You lie to yourself and anyone who will listen to you.

            Judgement is coming.

          • Bluesman1950

            Your standards of proof may be low enough to allow you to be convinced. I require actual evidence, not spiritual waffle.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I will believe in a God when there is evidence to give me reason to believe.

            Now will I follow the hateful vindictive bast***d? Doubt it.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Then you will go to the Lake of Fire with the Devil. You are simply making your own choice to reject Salvation, so you are stuck in your Sin. Judgement for Sin has been declared and is coming.

            Without Jesus, you cannot be saved from the Sin which condemns you to Eternal Damnation.

            With Jesus, accepting His Salvation and following Him into the Kingdom of God, you can be saved from your Sin.

    • Nathan Marcy

      It’s not like the flag was replaced with one saying “There is no god.”

      No flag is not an inherent endorsement of atheism.

    • Doug Indeap

      It should not be supposed that the government, by remaining separate from and neutral toward religion in keeping with the Constitution, somehow thereby favors atheism over theism. There is a difference between the government (1) remaining neutral in matters of religion and leaving individuals free to choose, exercise, and express their religious views without government intrusion and (2) taking sides in matters of religion and promoting one view (whether theism [in one, any, or all its various forms], atheism, or whatever) to the detriment of others. It is one thing for the government to endorse the idea that god(s) exist or, alternatively, endorse the idea that god(s) do not exist; it is quite another for the government to take no position on the matter and respect the right of each individual to freely decide for himself.

      • The Skeptical Chymist

        Very well stated. I agree 100%. Unfortunately, many seem to think that if their religion is not actively promoted by government, they are being discriminated against.

    • Bluesman1950

      Atheism is not a religious belief. It is a lack of religious belief. The opposite!

      • FoJC_Forever

        You are wrong. Atheism is centered around religious belief. All people worship something or someone. you are practicing a religion and are pretending not to. Yours is a fantasy existence.

        • Bluesman1950

          Gods are your fantasy, not mine.

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Your belief in my belief is unbelievable.

        • George T

          Fundamentally incorrect. I know you want to believe that atheism is a religion because you want to put atheism on equal footing with your religion. It’s easier to argue against if the other people are playing the same game for a different team. Sorry, but atheists aren’t participating in your “religion game” at all. We’re the people in the stands catcalling the batter and enjoying a frosty cold beer.

          • FoJC_Forever

            It’s not a “religion game”. Every human being is religious in one form or another. The very word atheist is about religion. Your religion is a worship of science and humanity. You worship and honor self, instead of God. You are religious. Atheism is your religion. You want everyone else to honor your religion and express and live your religion in public.

            You’re a hypocrite.

          • George T

            Again, fundamentally incorrect. Trying to reframe my trust in physics and the scientific method as **belief** doesn’t mean I’m religious. …and no, I don’t want to convert everybody to anything. Quit projecting your own intentions on others.

          • FoJC_Forever

            Every human is religious. This is Truth. You can use the intelligent sounding word ‘fundamentally’, but you are simply misusing it. Every human honors, respects, and adheres to a belief system. Religion is simply adherence to a belief system. You believe in Humanism. You trust in it. You are dedicated to it.

            You are religious. You are antichrist.

          • George T

            Every human is inclined towards religious beliefs because it has an evolutionary advantage. I do believe that there is no god, but I don’t have faith that there is no god. I don’t have an active trust in my belief as it’s simply the result of my an absence of faith. I am not dedicated to not believing there’s a god. If there were reasonable, falsifiable evidence for a god then I would carefully consider it.

            If anybody is misusing words, it’s you. You’ve been misusing “belief” when you mean “faith”.

  • Matt Weiler

    can’t expect politicians to stand up for anything…

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      Churches don’t pay taxes. Why did you think they would get preferential treatment like the others that lobby, bribe and cajole politicians into doing what they want?

  • bowie1

    Similar complaints happen even here in Canada. City and Town Councils can no longer recite the Lord’s Prayer before their meetings after the court ruled it unconstitutional. Our local council does now allude to the supremacy of God as laid out in the constitution which doesn’t satisfy some complainants either. There is, however, a group of citizens who meet across from city hall and pray for the councillors and the mayor. At least there is more than one way to “skin a cat”.

    • Josey

      They did the same thing to Daniel but he refused to obey even with the threat of being thrown into the lions den. God stands by His people when they put His ways first over that of mans.

      • Lark62

        But Daniel lived in a theocracy and was told to worship the king as god.

        If that story has any possible relevance, it is that the government in a democracy should not tell anyone which religion is right or which god to worship.

        Do you really not get it? We are fighting to make sure that everyone, including you, can worship who you want how you want without government interference.

        This means the city council meetings begin with a call to order, not a government instruction to bow your head and pray to the government official’s preferred diety. Do you not see the connection?

        This means the government does not fly a banner promoting the preferred religious teaching of a government official. Every single person gets to fly whatever banner they like without fear.

      • Unrepentant Atheist

        Since when?

    • Emmanuel

      Similar here in my town, a local pastor/priest prays before session but they can’t mention Jesus and only God. God is more broad and general. LOL do you see the ignorance in that statement.

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      Why is there a need to recite prayer before doing their job? Praying = 0 productivity. If you want the hungry to get fed, or illness to get cured, get up and make it happen. No one found a cure for anything by praying.

  • Josey

    FFRF says that it received a complaint from a local resident about the flag, which flies at the Bradley County Courthouse below the Arkansas state flag.
    Why not name who the complainant is? Could it be a made up complainant?

    • weasel1886

      I doubt they are roaming the country looking for such things.
      I would think there may be people that would commit violence against the person

      • stop2wonder

        History says that violence is possible.

    • rarw

      Gee, maybe because the complainant is afraid of receiving death threats from “loving Christians” ?

      Its illegal for government to promote one religion over another, or religion over nonreligion. It was illegal for the flag to be there. Someone there realized this, and did the right thing. End of story. Want to fly this flag at your church, or at your home? GO RIGHT AHEAD. It has no business flying on a government building.

  • Josey

    My faith in Jesus Christ stands regardless of what flag is taken down or who declares we can’t pray in public. God gives boldness and helps me today in my walk with Him. Glory to God and to the Lord of Lords and King of Kings over all, Jesus Christ my Saviour!

    • stop2wonder

      I’m curious, who is telling you you can’t pray in public?

      • Jimmy B.

        Her favorite right wing gossip “news” sites. They really get the fake “opponents” in your head yelling at yiu

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      As is your right to pray. Just keep your symbolism out of courts, schools and government buildings (outside your personal items).

      Oh, and don’t spray the insane foaming spittle from your fanatical flopping. Its kinda gross.

      • Josey

        yes and keep your symbolism out of courts, schools and government buildings as well as in “gay pride month” or as in putting people out business because they do not wish to celebrate by baking a gay wedding cake or as in causing christians to support abortion by adding the cost of it in medical insurance, etc. etc….

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          I’m with you on the insurance and that’s about it.

          There is no gay or atheist symbols posted in courtrooms. Silly point to make.

          As for having “Gay Pride” month added to the various hordes of pointless Halmark holidays is rather a silly thing to worry about. It’s not like you are forced to do anything different. Should we make a big deal about national prayer day or Christmas? Or is it OK for you to be a bigot and not anyone else?

          If you open a business, no one assumes or even cares, for the most part what your beliefs are. As long as when they walk in the door and hand you money that they are treated like everyone else. No one assumes that you endorse strippers at a bachelors party, a Barmitzfa, or a KKK birthday party any more than they assume what your stance is on gay rights.

          I’d like to see what happens if you walked into a bakery and the owner turned you away because they believed that the cake celebrating a First Communion (Catholic) was celebrating brainwashing and didn’t want anything to do with it.

          It would be wrong, and is also poor business sense to turn away business and risk the bad publicity. If you don’t want to run your business without discrimination then you shouldnt have a business.

          • lorrainie

            Obama had his Gay Pride colors glowing on the White House.

            How special!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Relevancy to the post you replied to: 0%.

            You did however earn yourself a Jebidiah Bush Scratch and Sniff sticker. Comes in three Bush scents. Father, Son, and the Holy S@#!. You guess which one.

          • lorrainie

            Too bad. You’re foolish.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Congratulations. You won the interweb troll awards.

          • lorrainie

            laughable. Now you’re boring and irrelevant.

            You’re “Dismissed”

            Left right left……

      • lorrainie

        Oh really, the White House had the Gay pride Flag Colors lit up. Disgusting and hypocritical.
        Just keep your symbolism to your self! Laughable at best…government building!

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          Being gay has nothing to do with religious belief outside of Christians not liking it and wanting to control bedroom behaviors via government.

          Politicians pandering to voters is nothing new, and this is just a pro Democrat display.

          • lorrainie

            Yup, keep your symbols to yourself!
            How about the good ol red white and blue displayed, after all, the 4th of July is nearing!

            You’re foolish…

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Did I say anything about showing (or not showing) the Flag’s colors? You act like people that don’t think like you (Muricans) are not patriotic.

          • lorrainie

            Symbolism was your point. You’re still foolish.
            Obama loves the rainbow symbol of the homosexual gay pride colors and wanted the whole world to see. One big fat display..a symbol of his belief and celebrating on the “people’s house!”
            Let’s see the red,white and blue symbol!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Religious symbolism. The government is not allowed to promote any religion. Gay colors has nothing to do with religion. However I don’t expect you to understand such a basic premise.

          • lorrainie

            Foolish human.
            You’re not even getting the symbol point. That’s ok.
            You’re dismissed.
            Left right left…

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            It might be because what you are seeing is only in your own mind. I don’t see your delusion.

            Plus your reference to the military is starting to get insulting. If you don’t respect the people that defend your right to type this drivel, then you do not deserve the right to be an American.

          • lorrainie

            Foolish comment and quit whining.
            You’re getting way to nutty.
            You’re dismissed again..left right left..
            You don’t decide my patriotism, got that private “Joker”?
            Now move along and enjoy the 4th…

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I will. Thank you very much. I think I have earned that much at least from my service. Did you serve?

            So enjoy the freedom that our country provides for you. Brought to you by Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Gays, Atheists, Mormons, Democrats, Republicans, Libertarians, Conservatives, Tea Partiers, and even the occasional Scientologist. Of course there are many more groups and ideologies than that.

            THAT is what makes up America. Enjoy your 4th as well.

          • lorrainie

            Let freedom ring and God Bless America and you also!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Also, are you saying that you are not human?

    • Ken Campbell

      That’s what I like to see. Keep this religious stuff in the home. We need to support the concept of a secular society

  • Lisa

    How is this a Christian flag?

    • weasel1886

      It’s seems like more of a political flag

      • Lisa

        Yes it does. It seems like Christians are falling for it. Looks like people are arguing over the seperation of church and state now instead of wondering what the heck this has to do with Christianity. Amazing!

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          I would get a good laugh if it was a Muslim that prompted the flag be put up.

          • Lisa

            Why is that?

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            I tried to reply, but this sites censorship obstructs the “S” word (Big red fallen angel evil dude) among other words they don’t like. Here is a truncated version.

            Because the Christians are in an uproar because of their religious symbol is being pulled down. “An attack on (edited to avoid censorship)” as another poster put it. But as it was pointed out, it shows a tree with a reference to heaven, which is not specific to Christianity (Judaism and Islam share similar ideas). So as unlikely as it would be, it would be ironic, that Christians would defend Muslim incursion into our government. They would be in an uproar if any other religion did what they think is harmless.

            Check out FL ban on religious materials for support for my statement.

          • Lisa

            What religious symbol are you talking about? I’m not sure what the other poster wrote-what you are saying there seems incomplete to me.
            The flag-a tree with the reference to heaven is silly and to call this a Christian flag is ridiculous. Christians don’t have flags. Just because someone makes up a flag and calls it Christian doesn’t make it so. All the Christians getting on the bandwagon and arguing for it is also ridiculous.

            Christians are to be in the world not of the world. It seems to me that many Americans that call themselves Christians are confusing Christianity and patriotism. Patriotism for ones country is not included in Christianity. Christianity is about being saved from sins by the only one who can save us from sins-Jesus! It’s about telling others about the good news that we have learned and follow Jesus. We are not told to go out and change the world, make this a Christian nation. Jesus told us His kingdom is not of this world, why then do Christians feel it’s their job to try to make non christians follow what they feel is Christianity?

            God gave us all the right to believe or not believe. We are blessed by God when we believe-saved by grace through faith in Jesus so none can boast. Those who don’t believe are going to be thrown into the lake of fire and be punished for eternity but God gives all men their free will to make either decision.

            This as you can see has nothing to do with this flag or this movement.

          • Lark62

            This flag and the slogan on it are used by a christian organization to promote religious objectives. It is a christian flag whether you like it or not.

          • Lisa

            No it’s not.

          • Lark62

            Huh? There is a website where a group of christians uses this flag to promote a christian message.

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            Apparently they don’t like links in their posts either…. *sigh*

            Look up “In God We Trust?” on You Tube and you will see the documentary I discussed in a previous post (semi unbiased, no anti-christian narration, but the Christians didn’t present themselves well).

            I agree with you that there is no official Christian flag, because there is no official “Christian” religion. It is a term used to tie in all the denominations that believe in Jesus Christ into one giant powerful machine, despite the major differences in belief an ritual.

            However, you would be in a minority here among these Christians, and these people are deadly scary.

          • Lisa

            You may be right about it tying all the denominations together in unity.
            Yes I believe I have a minority opinion-and I have tried to talk to people about what they post and how they come across-I think its wrong and they should stop and remember certain scriptures but they don’t like what I have to say and continue on in looking horrible so……

        • Lark62

          Look up appeal to heaven movement. It is a religious organization with a religious purpose and they have adopted this flag as their symbol.

          • Lisa

            They can call themselves whatever they want-but its not Christian.

          • Lark62

            And you get to decide which people who claim to be christian really are christian? How special.

            Regardless this flag is intended to communicate a religious message and does not belong on government property.

          • Lisa

            It seems to me that you would be happy that I said it wasn’t Christian since you don’t like it. But what is kinda funny is that you don’t want it to be displayed but now are gonna tell me that it is Christian.

          • Lark62

            The flag is fine. I personally disagree with what the group wants to accomplish – electing lots more christians. But I’m pretty fond if the first amendment and I will defend them and their right to exist.

            I don’t want it displayed ON GOVERNMENT PROPERTY. What anyone does with a flag on private property is their own business.

    • Lark62

      It represents a group that promotes the election of christians. The existence of the group is fine. They just can’t have the government do their advertising for them.

      • Lisa

        Christians don’t have flags. Just because someone puts heaven in the name does not make it Christian. We are to be in the world not of the world, so the whole premise is wrong.

        • Lark62

          Christians in North Carolina had a christian flag, and the government of one city found it simply impossible to honor veterans without it. (Which meant a big giant screw you to all non christian veterans, but they really didn’t care about them.)

          Regardless of its meaning 240 years ago, today the “Appeal to Heaven” flag is associated with the a movement that seeks to “honor the Lord by supporting candidates for public office who are believers in Jesus Christ, who regularly attend and display a commitment to an evangelical, Gospel-centered church, and who will commit to live and govern based on biblical… principles.”

          This flag simply does not belong in front of a court house.

          • Lisa

            Again I say-Christains don’t have flags or movements. We aren’t to be political because Jesus said His kingdom was not of this world.
            Christianity is not about making our voices heard and forcing people to live according to biblical rules. It’s about being saved by Jesus from our sins and telling others what we know about Jesus. Share the good news and then it’s up to that person to decide whether or not they believe the truth or if they will continue being a sinner. Sinners however will be thrown into the lake of fire for their non belief which is why it’s a tragedy when someone doesn’t believe the truth and are saved.

          • Lark62

            Christians aren’t supposed to be political? I think one or two (million) (or more) missed the memo. So I will continue to stand up against those who try to use our secular government to push religion.

            I was a christian for over 3 decades. I finally realized that it was all fiction. And crazy, illogical and totally absurd myths about eternal torture (oooohh let’s be scared) top the list of ridiculous nonsense.

          • Lisa

            I’m sorry you made a bad decision.

          • Lark62

            What ev

          • Lisa

            It is your life-you should care.

          • Lark62

            No. I have better things to do than worry about ludicrous christian revenge porn. “Gods gonna get ya. Nyah na na nyah na.”

            Maybe I’ll trim my toenails.

          • Lisa

            Your call-good luck!

          • Unrepentant Atheist

            So then why is it a big deal to Christians by taking the flag down?

          • Lisa

            It seems to me that Christians have really lost what Christianity is all about. We are to contend for the faith but this flag and what it’s about, to me, is not the faith and I don’t understand why Christians would be upset about it, except to say there is no Christian flag and why are you doing this?

        • Unrepentant Atheist

          There is a Christian flag, but because “Christian” is a collaboration of many denominations loosely assembled to appear to be a unified majority, it is not an “Official” flag. There was a big deal about a Christian flag over a memorial just awhile back in Hill, NC.

          I watched a documentary on it and it was the first time I was truly afraid that there were actually huge groups of people in the US that would try to hurt or even kill me for my beliefs.

        • Ken Campbell

          I think it is the writing that is the issue

          • Lisa

            Because it has heaven in the name?

          • Ken Campbell

            Yes

  • Ed Words

    I think Christmas trees were banned in England at one time for
    being symbols of paganism.

  • George T

    Could Heather Clark or one of the editors please correct the title and first paragraph of this article. The Freedom From Religion Foundation is not an “atheist activist organization”. They are a church/state watchdog organization with theist and non-theist members.

    • FoJC_Forever

      They are antichrist.

      • George T

        Oh, I don’t think there’s any reason to say such things about Heather or the editors. They just made an error.

        • FoJC_Forever

          I wasn’t talking about Heather or the editors.

          • George T

            I know. It’s called humor. You should try it some time.

      • Unrepentant Atheist

        There is more than one? Please site! You can include the Bible in this one because I know its not there, even if you don’t (which is funny in its own right, oh the IRONY).

        • FoJC_Forever

          There is the “son of perdition”, who is the Antichrist. Then there are spirits of antichrist, which have been in the earth for hundreds of years now. Then there are people who are antichrist; these are those who have accepted the teachings of the spirits of antichrist.

          • George T

            Soooo… you’ve found a way to imagine that enemies are everywhere. You can claim that anybody who upsets you is an antichrist of some kind. When your dog soils the rug in your home, it’s infected with an antichrist.

            Please please PLEASE tell me that you don’t own a gun.

          • FoJC_Forever

            No, enemies aren’t “everywhere”, although the Enemy is very active twisting this world into his platform for his “last rule”. You have made yourself an enemy, but I war against spiritual principalities, powers, and wickedness in high places. You are simply a tool of the Devil to harass and berate.

            Maybe the Devil will drop you one day and you will see just how foolish you have been to let yourself be used by him. This would be a good thing for you, so that you can have the opportunity to hear the Word and receive Salvation through Jesus (the) Christ.

          • George T

            I’ve had an opportunity. Grew up attending church and went through confirmation just before I realized that there was no reason to believe anything in the bible. In fact, there were many scientific findings that directly contradicted things I had learned from the bible.

  • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

    Why was this flag removed if congress has not yet passed a law establishing the secular religion?

    • Tolerant Atheist

      In this case, it would be because congress can’t pass any law establishing any religion, period.

    • Lark62

      The government cannot promote or discourage religion.

      Look up the definition of neutral.

    • Bluesman1950

      Find a dictionary and look up ‘secular’. A secular religion is like a colourless rainbow or a silent song!

      • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

        Oh dear, my dictionary only has “humanism”. Put your colourless green idea back to sleep.

        • Bluesman1950

          Ah, a christian dictionary.

          • George T

            I was guessing Conservapedia content editor or moderator.

        • Ken Campbell

          not spiritual : of or relating to the physical world and not the spiritual world

          : not religious

          : of, relating to, or controlled by the government rather than by the church

          • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

            Your dictionary says “secular” is a non-religion controlled by the government. Yep. Sounds about right. That’s secular humanism – the all-encompassing world-defining ultimate-meaning-providing government religion. (Seriously though, you need a better dictionary. “Secular” should have nothing to do with the government … but suddenly it does … and this is because because there is now secular religion – a colourless green idea that thinks furiously.)

          • Ken Campbell

            That is Miriam Webster for you. You are correct that secular should have nothing to do with the a need for government oversight. Lets leave that piece out.

  • Nathan Z Solomon

    What’s amazing to me is that groups of people are fighting for change (i.e. the flag was here and now it has to go), don’t realize the strain they are putting on everyone. Change, by definition, requires grieving. But with:
    gay marriage now becoming the law of the land,
    ACA law mentioning “States” being redefined as the entire Federal Government, Confederate Flags being torn down
    the IRS degaussing tapes,
    Social security running out of money ($47M given to dead people, $17B overpayment, etc)
    Clinton’s lost 15 messages,
    “You can keep your Doctor, etc”,
    Illegals coming in through the borders that are like a sieve.
    Police becoming powerless
    Ferguson, Baltimore, Detroit, Chicago, Charleston

    Change…lots of Change…without Hope, without a chance to grieve the change.

    But you see, the real problem is that all the different groups want what they want, irregardless of the repercussions.

    There will be a repercussion and it won’t be pretty.

  • http://mattbierbaum.github.io/zombies-usa/ Zombie Lee

    The fir evergreen tree is a pagan symbol.

    Christians can be so silly sometimes.

  • robertzaccour

    Why are atheists so offended by a God they don’t believe in? Do people complain about cartoons for not believing in them as reality? Or professional wrestling?

    • Ken Campbell

      it is not about being offended. It is about one religious organization pushing its agenda on everyone else.

  • Troy Eckhardt

    Yes, this is CLEARLY unconstitutional because an employee at the courthouse is Congress, and the raising of a flag is the making of a law.

    • Unrepentant Atheist

      Its not against the law if you live in ‘Murica.