Hundreds of Thousands in Donations Pour in for Pizzeria Forced to Close Over Biblical Marriage Beliefs

OConnorWALKERTON, Ind. — Hundreds of thousands in donations have poured in out of a show of support to a pizzeria that was forced to close after it faced arson and death threats by homosexual activists and advocates simply for expressing their biblical beliefs on marriage when asked by a local news station.

The matter began when reporter Alyssa Marino of ABC 57 News in South Bend set out to interview area business owners about their reaction to the controversy over the recently signed Indiana Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA). Among the businesses that she visited was Memories Pizza in Walkerton, a place that is decorated with crosses and quotes from Scripture, and begins each morning with prayer.

The establishment had never turned anyone away, nor were there any complaints about the pizzeria, and owner Crystal O’Connor explained to Marino that if a homosexual couple or someone of another religion came to eat there, Memories Pizza would never deny them service.

“I just walked into their shop and asked how they feel,” Marino explained on Twitter. “They’ve never been asked to cater a same-sex wedding.”

However, one sentence in O’Connor’s response was highlighted in Marino’s report, as she stated that because of her Christian beliefs, she would have to draw the line at same-sex weddings, which some Christians believe would be a form of participation.

“If a gay couple was to come in—like say, they wanted us to provide them pizzas for a wedding, we would have to say ‘no,'” O’Connor replied in response to Marino’s question.

“We are a Christian establishment,” she said. “We’re not discriminating against anyone. That’s just our belief and anyone has the right to believe in anything.”

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Marino soon published an online report with the angle of “RFRA: Michiana business wouldn’t cater a gay wedding,” and the nighttime television report read “Restaurant denies some services to same-sex couples.”

The story quickly went viral, and homosexual activists and advocates lashed out at O’Connor and Memories Pizza. Yelp was flooded with hundreds of negative reviews and vulgar photographs, and those angry about O’Connor’s response left messages on Facebook wishing bodily harm and death to the business owner.

“I pray to God all of you get food poisoning!” one commenter named Alex Ollmedo wrote.

“I pray your store burns to the ground with your family in it,” another named Jeff Green lashed out.

Police were called in when Jessica Dooley, a coach at an Elkhart County high school, Tweeted, “Who’s going to Walkerton with me to burn down Memories Pizza?”

Dooley was suspended without pay, and prosecutors are reviewing the matter as they consider whether to press criminal charges.

Police have also been patroling the business due to ongoing threats, and told ABC News that the patrols “will go on as long as threats continue to be made.”

The pizzeria soon closed shop and the O’Connor family went into hiding, fearing for their lives. O’Connor told reporters that her family was even considering leaving the state. She said that she the business was providing the funds for her to pay her rent, and that the matter could now harm her personally.

“I don’t know if we will re-open, or if we can—if it’s safe to re-open,” she told reporters. “We’re in hiding basically, staying in the house.”

As a result, Lawrence Jones of The Blaze launched a GoFundMe page on Wednesday to help “relieve the financial loss endured by the proprietors’ stand for faith.” With an initial goal of raising $200,000 for the business, supporters of Memories Pizza from across the country flooded the page with donations, and the fundraising effort far exceeded its goal within just 24 hours.

As of press time, just two days after the page was launched, over $711,000 have been raised in support of the O’Connor’s religious rights, with over 24,000 donors participating in the effort. The GoFundMe page has been shared over 64,000 times.

“We are with you Memories Pizza. Stand strong against the haters,” one commenter named Rand Foreman wrote on the pizzeria’s Facebook page.

“I am so sorry that your family business is experiencing such hatred and bigotry,” wrote another named Colleen Swan. “Yes, you are being discriminated against for standing up for your beliefs. The ‘tolerant’ are showing so much intolerance and spreading hatred and division. Relationships will never improve this way. Bullying Christians is no better than bullying the LGBT community.”

Yelp also suggested to the Huffington Post that it may remove the hundreds of reviews posted against Memories Pizza for irrelevance.

“Non-germane, media-fueled reviews typically violate our Content Guidelines,” the unidentified spokesperson stated. “One of these deals with relevance. For example, reviews aren’t the place for rants about a business’s employment practices, political ideologies, extraordinary circumstances, or other matters that don’t address the core of the consumer experience.”

Photo: ABC 57 News


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  • The Last Trump

    The gay mantra “Hate Thy Neighbour”.
    How it must truly suck to be such hateful bitter people.

    On another note, LOOK AT THE SMILE ON HER FACE! 🙂
    Thank you, you militant, hateful and intolerant fascists.
    Keep showing the world your true colours. Death threats! Imagine!
    So open minded and loving of you.

    • Peter Leh

      the “hate” comes from the one denying service , dont you think?

      what has been the historical pattern of those denying service? good guys or bad guys?

      blacks? women? disabled? sexual orientation? jews?

      the reason we have “protected groups” is because when given a chance those in power could not behave. 🙂

      and have ALWAYS been on the wrong side of history.

      leave you mark trump. 🙂

      • The Last Trump

        Actually the hate comes from those threatening death and physical harm to this woman, her business and her family.
        But nice try so poorly attempting to relate not willing to participate in a marriage ceremony with hate. Typical of your “types”.
        Last time I checked, “We just want to be left alone” doesn’t mean “YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME”.
        You’re sick, bud. Get some help. 🙂

        • Peter Leh

          “You’re sick, bud. Get some help. :)”

          serving my neighbor is sick? not denying service needs help? poor jesus 🙂

          “Last time I checked, “We just want to be left alone” doesn’t mean “YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME”. ”

          i have yet to see this. does the KKK agree the blacks are now equal to the aryan nation now? NO? Freedom of speech is the freedom to disagree.

          “But nice try so poorly attempting to relate not willing to participate
          in a marriage ceremony with hate. Typical of your “types”.”

          i am the business owner type. how about you?

          i context of “Hate” the op was equivicating “hate ” to the one demanding equal protection. I am suggesting , if any is “hating”, historically those who denied service and equal protections would correctly be at fault.

          “Actually the hate comes from those threatening death and physical harm to this woman, her business and her family. DUH!”

          agree. condescension not withstanding. 🙂

      • WorldGoneCrazy

        This is a Demon-crat thing, Pete: when it counted, the Demon-crats were on the wrong side of owning black people, the wrong side of 90 years of civil rights legislation, the wrong side of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments, the wrong side of the KKK, the wrong side of baby sacrifice in the womb, the wrong side of Israel, and now the wrong side of gay “marriage,” as evidenced by the fact that when they cannot have their way, they resort to bullying and death threats.

        In summary, Demon-crats have always been, and always will be on the wrong side of God. (They even had trouble getting “God” into their platform at the 2012 DNC. :-))

        • Peter Leh

          “Demon-crat” i get it. 🙂

          you DO know what is being describe above in your post ARE the republicans today? 🙂

          • roald

            Only those before the 1960s when the Southern Strategy recruited unhappy Democrats, upset by LBJ’s pushing the civil rights act. The newer stuff is Democratic -woman’s control of her body, fairness to Israelis and Palestinians, and equal rights for all.

          • Peter Leh

            yep.

            notice worldgone crazy is attributing the dems today with the actions of repubs ( ie before they switched) of old and thinking the republs of old have always been the repubs of today. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            No I don’t, Pete. The urban myth that the party magically switched (without telling anyone!) has been well-refuted. (You don’t get to re-write history to make yourself feel less guilty.) Regardless, that is why I carefully used the phrase “when it counted.” And, the only litmus tests we have today are the positions of the two parties regarding Israel, abortion, and God. As recently as 2012, God was voice voted down by the Demon-crat Party. Do I really need to show you how many times the Demon-crat Party has thrown Israel under the bus – say, in the last hour?!? And, of course, the unholy sacrament of the Demon-crat Party is baby sacrifice in the womb, at a time when America is roughly split on this issue. It is either baby murder or it isn’t. So, if the Demon-crats are wrong on this one – and they are, according to basic human biology – then they are on the wrong side of the moral murders of 57 million innocents.

            Liberalism is a mental illness that has resulted in slavery, lynchings, and baby sacrifice, just to name a few things. And, the article we are responding to today shows just how consistent this is with the Demon-crat Party: rhetorical lynchings, death threats, vandalism – all being done by the party of “tolerance.” Here are a few good links on just why gay activists are so violent and are following in the footsteps of their KKK ancestors:
            Two Christian preachers brutally beaten at Seattle Gay Pride Festival
            Gay activist who vandalized Chick-Fil-A restaurant will not be charged
            Man who attempted mass shooting at Family Research Council pleads guilty
            Floyd Lee Corkins II is a left-winger, admired atheist philosopher Nietzche
            Even after Family Research Council shooting, leftists continue “hate” rhetoric
            The mainstream media’s biased coverage of the Family Research Council shooting
            Southern Poverty Law Center called the Family Research Council “hate group”
            Human Rights Campaign calls the Family Research Council “hate group”
            Family Research Council shooting suspect volunteered at gay community center
            White House and left-wing media take hours to comment on FRC shooting
            Shooting at Family Research Council being investigated as domestic terrorism
            Gay activist Dan Savage bullies Christian teens and bashes Christianity
            Hate crime: gay activists vandalize Mark Driscoll’s Mars Hill Church
            Human Rights Campaign leaks list of pro-marriage donors and their addresses
            Gay rights activists vandalize church for posting pro-marriage sign
            Gay manager at Cisco Systems gets Dr. Frank Turek fired
            Brown University students attack pro-marriage sign at demonstration

          • Peter Leh

            whoa…
            forgive me if i did not read the entire post. too much political bile. No wonder you call them “demon-crats” 🙂 breathe sir/madam, life is better without political regurgitation.

            “The urban myth that the party magically switched (without telling anyone!) has been well-refuted.”

            Of course because what you described did not happen. That does not mean that the repubs today are not the dems pre 1964.

            “the Demon-crats were on the wrong side of owning black people, the wrong
            side of 90 years of civil rights legislation, the wrong side of the
            13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments, the wrong side of the KKK,……”

            True. and who were theses “demons” on the wrong side of history pre 1964?

            dems? yes. repubs? no. liberals? no. conservative? yes chrisitans? yes. (SBC, SMC,PRSBY) atheist?no. whites? yes. blacks? no. big government? no. small government? yes. forced labor supporter? yes. Union? no. BIg Corp? yes. peonage supporter? yes. racist? yes. freedom riders? no segregationist? yes. anti-racial mixing? yes. KKK? yes. Black panther? no. equal protection for blacks a women? no. Irritated at northern agitators? yes. Abolitionist and civil rights supporters? no. Jim crow supporters? yes.

            SO…..who were the white conservative christian small government, forced labor, big crop, peonage supporting, segregationist, anti race mixing KKK supporter, against equal protection and irritated at the northern agitators, jim crow supporters in the south pre 1964?

            today’s southern republican. 🙂

            notice today’s southern republican is now prohibiting equal protection AGAIN. Tony Perkins was solicitng for the KKK registry in LA to garner support of the republican party. David Duke ran as a republican… not as the democrat pre 1964. The SBC (hardly liberal AND democrat today) was FORMED base on the god given right to own slaves.

            given the pattern of the past…. and observing it repeating itself today (using scripture to deny american citizens equal protection.” who, again, is still on the “wrong side of history”? 🙂

            i dont give a rip about dems and repubs anymore. I use to think the same as you …. until i took the political blinders off.

            “(You don’t get to re-write history to make yourself feel less guilty.)”

            not me.

            Embrace truth.. because all truth is god’s is truth. embrace history, even the ugly parts. it is very liberating.

            the guilty justify. I can’t justify or defend the indefensible.

            jump in the water is warm when you are emancipated from the slavery of politics. 🙂

            the wrong
            side of baby sacrifice in the womb, the wrong side of Israel, and now
            the wrong side of gay “marriage,” as evidenced by the fact that when
            they cannot have their way, they resort to bullying and death threats.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Forgive me if I do not read your entire post: too much political-hsitorical obfuscation. 🙂

            Peter, you can run, but you cannot hide from the history of the Demon-crats. If white conservatives were racists, why have blacks been moving in droves from Demon-crat dominated northern states to Republican dominated Southern states in the last decade or two, just as the South became dominantly Republican?!? Here is an article from the hostile (to conservative Christians) New York Times that refutes such silliness: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/10/magazine/10Section2b.t-4.html?_r=0

            Now, I see you say absolutely nothing whatsoever about the current Demon-crat Party platform wrt God, abortion, and Israel. I wonder why? Do you not understand that the party that took away the freedom of the black man would also be the one who takes away the life of the black baby? That the party that has a low view of the Bible would be for slavery and against Israel? That the party that has a low view of God would reject Him in a voice vote at their 2012 DNC?

            Peter, the party of “anything goes” would feel just as comfortable owning black people as aborting black babies. And, they would also support terrorists like Hamas-controlled Palestine over God’s original chosen people, Israel: https://winteryknight.wordpress.com/2014/11/19/after-synagogue-attack-obama-urges-both-terrorists-and-israelis-to-be-calm/

            Look no further than the rise of anti-semitism: where is it happening? Liberal university campuses in the U.S. and throughout hyper-liberal Western Europe!

            I actually cannot believe that you are using the “nun” sign while simultaneously providing an apologetic for the party that has made the sacrifice of 57 million babies in 42 years its unholy sacrament! And no comment on the death threats by the Gaystapo in this story – just which party do you think these modern-day KKK’ers belong to, Peter?!?

          • Peter Leh

            “Forgive me if I do not read your entire post: too much political-hsitorical obfuscation. :-”

            touche 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “if white conservatives were racists, why have blacks been moving in
            droves from Demon-crat dominated northern states to Republican dominated
            Southern states in the last decade or two, just as the South became
            dominantly Republican?!?”

            because people from all colors are moving out of the bankrupt north and rust belts?

            what does that have to do with anything?

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Indeed, you are correct. But, I can assure you that if former Demon-crat KKK’ers were now Republican, blacks would rather be unemployed than lynched! 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            i can assure yo the blacks dont give a rats behind about the KKK anymore now they have equal protection.

            and
            yes David duke and tony perkins are republicans. The KKK sure is not
            democrats. 🙂 the dem party is too”colorful” for the aryans

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “i can assure yo the blacks dont give a rats behind about the KKK anymore now they have equal protection.”

            You don’t know very many black people then. I can assure you that “equal protection” does not stop the KKK.

          • Peter Leh

            i assure you you don;t know history or the significance of equal protection. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “i assure you, you don;t know history or the significance of equal protection. :)”

            Well, I know that the 14th Amendment was wrongly used to launch the killing of 57 million innocent and defenseless babies.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “you also must not live in the south?”

            Deep south. Now Republican. No more Bull Connor (D), George Wallace (D), etc. 🙂 http://historynewsnetwork.org/

            (It should also be noted that, of the 21 Democrat senators who opposed the 1964 Civil Rights Act, only one became a Republican. So much for your silly conspiracy theory. Might want to stay off of Salon – not real deep thinkers over there. :-))

          • Peter Leh

            “(It should also be noted that, of the 21 Democrat senators who opposed the 1964 Civil Rights Act, only one became a Republican.”

            oh yea. conservative democrats in the south held on to that classification as long as they could. it is a tradition. as my granddaddy said, my grandfather was a democrat, my daddy was a democrat, so i am a democrat…. but he did not like LBJ or a “n” that did not know his place.

            how many voted for the legislation?

            did the SBC vote for the repubs back then as they do today or stick to the dems opposing equal protection back then as the repubs do now?

            being from the south you know when blacks could vote there is was more protection from the sherrif and judge. This gives them more power to resist the KKK. the judges and sheriff could not look the other way now the black were a voting block. hell, you would have thought the sheriff and the judges were for equal protection all along. 🙂 that is why i said the blacks don’t give a rip about the KKK

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            It’s actually stunning to me that you develop all of these conspiracy theories to attempt to refute the plain and clear facts. I have given you study after study to refute your “they switched parties – secretly” nonsense. The Demon-crats who opposed the 1964 Civil Rights Act remained Demon-crats (with the exception of one) and voted for abortion. That should tell you all you need to know right there.

            Again, I must ask you: when it counted, has the Democrat Party not been on the wrong side of the black man’s right to liberty, right to vote, right to live (KKK), and now right to escape the womb (abortion)? All of these moral atrocities were Demon-crat policies WHEN IT COUNTED, that is, when the country was split because they were controversial at that time in history.

            You can run, Peter, but you cannot hide from your past sins. 🙂 If you ask Jesus to forgive you for voting for the Abortion President, He will.

          • Peter Leh

            “You can run, Peter, but you cannot hide from your past sins. 🙂 If
            you ask Jesus to forgive you for voting for the Abortion President, He
            will”

            which abortion President did i vote for? Reagan? Bush? Dole? Bush? i did not vote for Obama.

            Indeed. Jesus can forgive ALL our sins, even your continuous misrepresentations. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Dole didn’t make president, Peter. 🙂 Reagan and Bush the younger were demonstrably pro-life. (Reagan even authored a great book on abortion – a good read.)

            Carter, Clinton, and the current president (who shall remain nameless) are the three who were radically pro-abortion. Clinton even “saved” partial birth abortion. 🙁 But, the most radically evil pro-abortion president in our history is also, not coincidentally, the one under whom the most attacks on religious freedom have occurred, the current scoundrel.

            “Indeed. Jesus can forgive ALL our sins, even your continuous misrepresentations. :)”

            If I am misrepresenting you, it is only because you are playing Devil’s Advocate in a very subtle way. Be careful about doing that: you don’t want to be defending the Devil in court when Jesus returns. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “If I am misrepresenting you,”

            moreover there is no need to misrepresent me. just ask if you are not sure.

          • Peter Leh

            “Now, I see you say absolutely nothing whatsoever about the current
            Demon-crat Party platform wrt God, abortion, and Israel. I wonder why?”

            because we are not talking about the present day “demon-crat” but the white southern democrat of yesteryear acting very similar as today’s republican? 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            But, it’s the modern-day Demon-crats that are on the wrong side of objective moral human rights, and on the side of “anything goes.” Again, I must ask you: who is behaving more like the KKK today? Who is taking away life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? The Republican Party is NOT sacrificing babies, throwing Israel under the bus, and rejecting God in their platform.

          • Peter Leh

            maybe. i will conceded whatever political rant you wish to make.

            I am not, because it is off topic for me. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “I actually cannot believe that you are using the “nun” sign while
            simultaneously providing an apologetic for the party that has made the
            sacrifice of 57 million babies in 42 years its unholy sacrament!”

            i have already answered that:

            “i dont give a rip about dems and repubs anymore. I use to think the same as you …. until i took the political blinders off.

            “(You don’t get to re-write history to make yourself feel less guilty.)”

            not me.

            Embrace truth.. because all truth is god’s is truth. embrace history, even the ugly parts. it is very liberating.

            the guilty justify. I can’t justify or defend the indefensible.

            jump in the water is warm when you are emancipated from the slavery of politics. :)”

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            See, Pete: it is all moral equivalency for you. You really cannot see the difference between a nearly uniform vote for abortion on demand from the Demon-crats and a nearly uniform vote against abortion on demand from Republicans. I agree with you that the Republicans are far from perfect: what does that make the Demon-crats then?!?

          • Peter Leh

            “See, Pete: it is all moral equivalency for you.”

            see this is were politics leads… putting words in others mouths.

            if you were a christian i would call out your integrity for lying. Don;t exchange the two (religion for politics).. it tends to make one an idolater and the son of the devil. :0

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Pete, you are using the “nun” sign as your symbol. Now, presumably that means that you are showing solidarity with Christians in Iraq and Syria who are facing death threats and the vandalism of their homes and businesses. Yet, on this story, you seem to be showing solidarity with those who are making the death threats and committing the vandalism.

            So, please do us faithful Christians a favor and remove your “nun” symbol and replace it with a swastika so that you do not refute yourself any more.

          • Peter Leh

            “So, please do us faithful Christians a favor and remove your “nun”
            symbol and replace it with a swastika so that you do not refute yourself
            any more”

            do you think the “real” christians laugh at our “persecution in america?

            i know the missionaries do.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Do you think there is something funny about this Christian family receiving death threats, vandalism, and having to go into hiding for not denying Jesus?

          • Peter Leh

            “Do you think there is something funny about this Christian family
            receiving death threats, vandalism, and having to go into hiding for not
            denying Jesus?”

            i contend they are being violently rebuked for discrimination. Legal discrimination. those who break the law should be brought to justice

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Rebuked?!? You are sick.

            “those who break the law should be brought to justice”

            You would have been some coward in the days when slavery was legal.

          • Peter Leh

            “You would have been some coward in the days when slavery was legal.”

            the agitators were courageous but lets stay on subject.

            “Rebuked?!? You are sick”

            why?

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “the agitators were courageous but lets stay on subject.”

            We are on subject. You seem to equate “legal” with “moral,” and that is not a Christian virtue.

          • Peter Leh

            so far i have pretty much quoted and refereed to the legal aspect.

            YOU are talking morality. I have yet to speak on the morality side, essentially.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Yes, and as one who comes from a very long line of lawyers, I appreciate your legal understanding. But, as a Christian, you know full well that God’s Laws are necessarily superior to, and authoritative over, man’s laws. That means talking morality.

          • Peter Leh

            not until you have address the legal side… accurately.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Not at all. It is clear to all but the most disingenuous that the purpose of the gay fascists has nothing to do with gay “marriage,” but with pushing Christian thought and practice into the closet. And, I am not the only one who thinks so. Here are three openly gay folks who believe as I do:

            “Talk show host Tammy Bruce, who is a lesbian and former leader of the Los Angeles chapter of the National Organization for Women, told Sean Hannity last week that LGBT harassment of Memories Pizza – as well as Christian florists, bakers, and photographers who refused to participate in same-sex “wedding” cermonies for religious reasons – is a form of “bullying” that borders on “fascism.” She said today’s pressure and coercion conflict with the philosophy she learned when she entered political activism. “We have embraced the civil rights movements of this country, which were about allowing people to live the lives that best suit them,” she said. But, she warned, today’s LGBT movement has no interest in live-and-let-live. “For us to put on to these small business owners this kind of totalitarian boot is clearly us becoming the monster we were fighting against,” she said. “This kind of bullying, this kind of fascism in the name of equality doesn’t make sense.”

            Courtney Hoffman, who donated $20, wrote in a note to the O’Connors: “As a member of the gay community, I would like to apologize for the mean spirited attacks on you and your business. I know many gay individuals who fully support your right to stand up for your beliefs and run your business according to those beliefs. We are outraged at the level of hate and intolerance that has been directed at you and I sincerely hope that you are able to rebuild.”

            Likewise, Buz Smith donated $250, and wrote, “My partner and I have been together almost 27 years. The Democratic Leadership hi-jacked the Gay community many years ago and continue to spew the intolerance of religion as they promote [sic] the tolerances of their choices. This is noe [sic] big community-organized ploy with the media to do harm to people with religious convictions, conservatives, capitalism on and on. Love Peace and Happiness to the Family!!!!”

            What is it that they see that you, as a Christian, do not, Peter?!? Work on your discernment, please, Sir.

          • Peter Leh

            my apologies, i am talking about “stutzman” on the “pizza in indiana site”. sry for the confusion.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            No apology necessary. I brought Stutzman up first and I believe the stories are very much related.

          • Peter Leh

            “Yet, on this story, you seem to be showing solidarity with those who are making the death threats and committing the vandalism.”

            perhaps this comment give you the reputation of having a lack of integrity?

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            I don’t think so. Above you wrote: “the “hate” comes from the one denying service , dont you think?”

            So, you are excusing the death threats and convicting the Christians (of hate) for standing firm in their faith. That is the opposite of what I expected from someone displaying the “nun” sign.

          • Peter Leh

            “I don’t think so. Above you wrote: “the “hate” comes from the one denying service , dont you think?”

            that is a far cry from “showing solidarity with those who are making the death threats and committing the vandalism”

            have some integrity, sir! 😉

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “that is a far cry from “showing solidarity with those who are making the death threats and committing the vandalism””

            Quite the contrary! You are wrongly assigning hate to a girl who has not exhibited it. THAT is a lack on integrity. And, you are denying the fact that the “hate” actually comes from those making the death threats by assigning it to this sweet girl instead. If that’s not solidarity, I don’t know what is. What does the homofascism icon look like? 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “You are wrongly assigning hate to a girl who has not exhibited it.”

            that is why the hate is in quotes. while her action of discrimination is certainly not “loving” i have no idea she personal hates anyone.

            “And, you are denying the fact that the “hate” actually comes from those
            making the death threats by assigning it to this sweet girl instead”

            can you provide a quote of me denying death threats and vandalism not being hateful? i have been very consistent.

            “If that’s not solidarity, I don’t know what is.”
            indeed.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “while her action of discrimination is certainly not “loving” i have no idea she personal hates anyone.”

            As opposed to the gay fascists making death threats!

            “can you provide a quote of me denying death threats and vandalism not being hateful?”

            Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. You have consistently, and wrongly, called this girl out while remaining silent wrt the gay fascists. There your heart lies. Again, I kindly suggest you develop some discernment skills.

          • Peter Leh

            “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”

            authority from silence eh? try that in court. :0

            “As opposed to the gay fascists making death threats!”
            yea, they probably do.

      • jmichael39

        There is no hate in refusing to provide a service that endorses a life-view that violates your sincerely held religious belief…so the courts have said. But it does seem a bit hateful to feel like you have to force people to act in violation of their sincerely held religious beliefs merely to appease your view of how the rest of the world should think.

        To quote Rep. Tim Donnoly:

        “Regardless of the politics of this embarrassing charade playing out in Indiana and other states, the stakes couldn’t be higher. This battle isn’t about a gay person’s right to be served; this fight is about whether a gay rights activist can use the government and the courts to coerce someone into doing something that violates their faith.

        “That takes this out of the bedroom and puts this debate squarely into the realm of the Constitution. After all, does a woman who wants an abortion have the right to demand that a “pro-life” gynecologist perform it? No. That would violate that doctor’s faith. Does the woman lose the legal right to obtain an abortion if one doctor refuses to perform it? No. She simply has to find an abortionist.”
        Ironically, that seems to be the very desire of the left…to force people who don’t completely agree with the way the left think and believe that they should be forced to or forced into a place of being a second class citizen with no right to own a business or act as a gynecologist unless you’re willing to think and behave exactly as they want, even if that means denying your very faith. Where…tell me WHERE in our country’s founding was that EVER the intent?

        • Peter Leh

          “There is no hate in refusing to provide a service that endorses a life-view that violates your sincerely held religious belief”

          true. but again “misapplied” in terms of equal protection.

          the employee cannot be “forced” to perform a service against their belief. so that does not happen and will be upheld in any court per the SOS. Owners are different.

          “But it does seem a bit hateful to feel like you have to force people to
          act in violation of their sincerely held religious beliefs merely to
          appease your view of how the rest of the world should think.”

          so again… the blacks were being hateful for sitting at the counter and ordering off the menu? Women were being hateful for demanding the husband not have sole propriety ownership of her account? Or demanding the right to vote was hateful? Rejecting servcie of catholics or jews or italians

          “this fight is about whether a gay rights activist can use the government
          and the courts to coerce someone into doing something that violates
          their faith.”

          and the answer is no. no one has been coerced into violating their faith. It has not happened. An owner has not been coerced not has an employee not has a citizen. What HAS happened is a company cited for not following the policy or registration set up by the business/ business owner. Again, it is all on the owners’ freedom of choice to set up its company to comply with their FAITH AND STATE regulation.

          Donnoly know better than this:
          “or act as a gynecologist unless you’re willing to think and behave exactly as they want”

          medical has completely difference rules. apple and horses

          “Where…tell me WHERE in our country’s founding was that EVER the intent”

          no where. no where at all. moverover it is not happening now. you can keep you faith and provide service without violated the state requirements. Happens all the time

          🙂

      • ter ber

        No Shoes No Shirt No Service. Businesses have a right to discriminate. She served gays, she just did not want to cater their unions. People have freedom of choice, right? If a party is too big, not the right day of the week, the owner has a right to refuse. If she does not want to condone your rebellion to God, she has that right also.

        • Peter Leh

          “No Shoes No Shirt No Service.”

          *sigh* so tiring of the business ignorance.

          “Businesses have a right to discriminate. ”

          true. we do. however not against protected groups. but you already know this?

          “She served gays, she just did not want to cater their unions.”

          which is the right of business in the state of indiana.

          “People have freedom of choice, right?”

          people do indeed. business have less choice and are more restrictive compared to civilians. that is why you cannot equate the two. but you already knew that as well?

          “If a party is too big, not the right day of the week, the owner has a right to refuse”

          you DO know some business regulations… what else can the business do and not do?

          “If she does not want to condone your rebellion to God, she has that right also. ”

          placing an order equals condoning? If so, She has served quite a number of rebellion people indeed. so it is not really a religious conviction…. is it?

          • ter ber

            “This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.” James 3:15.

          • Peter Leh

            stay on subject please. we can debate scripture another time. 🙂

          • ter ber

            Look Peter, any gay person can walk into a pizzeria and order 50 pizzas to cater a wedding. Or a wedding cake and the couple will provide their own (2 male) statue. You do not have to tell the business owner your sexual preference. What is happening, is the gays are trying to make the news and bring the law into it. In other words they are doing it on purpose. They are foaming at the mouth in excitement on the hate crime legislation being implemented.

          • Peter Leh

            “They are foaming at the mouth in excitement on the hate crime legislation being implemented. ”

            not hate crime legislation, public accommodation and equal protection. homosexuals are already covered under federal hate crime legislation.

            “What is happening, is the gays are trying to make the news and bring the
            law into it. In other words they are doing it on purpose.”

            Well, an effective pattern we have seen used before.

            “any gay person can walk into a pizzeria and order 50 pizzas to cater a
            wedding. Or a wedding cake and the couple will provide their own (2
            male) statue.”

            True. and it is legal for the busienss to do this IF they do this with everyone, not just the gays ( except in indiana for now, of course)

            (see the baker in CO that let the christian man put his verses on himself. )

    • Marie Adigwe

      I’m bisexual, and I don’t, as you say, “Hate thy neighbor,” and I’m neither militant or fascist. Maybe you should stop lumping people together because it makes you look like a hateful, bitter hypocrite.

      • Peter Leh

        “because it makes you look like a hateful, bitter hypocrite.”

        how else can he convince you to accept jesus but by being condescending?

  • Carol Sakaguchi

    The money poured in as a backlash to the backlash. This was the silent majority that gets no press coverage. You know the saying “put your money where your mouth is” well, they just did. I hope there is a turning point in this country where they decide to stop bullying Christians for what they believe. It boils down to conscience and belief and not being co-erced to participate in a ceremony that goes against your beliefs. Kind of what the founding fathers had in mind.

    • Paul Hiett

      If you think Christians are being bullied, you’ve never lived your life as a homosexual or an atheist. Christians own the title of “bully”.

      • guerito777

        the owners have had plenty of hate mail and death threats. I believe that the left has been the bullies here.

        • Paul Hiett

          Wouldn’t have happened if they weren’t hateful bigots.

          • guerito777

            they aren’t being hateful if they merely refuse to participate in a ceremony. They don’t want Christians forcing them to go to church, They should be trying to force others to participate in their ceremonies. forcing that participation is in itself hatred

          • Paul Hiett

            There are laws in this country that prevent discrimination. When a business elects to open, the business owner has made a decision to abide by the laws that govern commerce, If sexual orientation is a protected status in that area, then denying a couple service based on that status is illegal, and yes…hateful.

            Your Bible is not the law of the land, and to be frank, it’s nothing more than a choice people make. People can switch religions whenever they want. People can’t switch their sexual orientation.

          • guerito777

            8 major studies using identical twins have shown that it is in fact a choice as the twins were no more likely to be gay than the general population, even though their genetically identical sibling was.

          • Paul Hiett

            Despite all of the science proving otherwise to your claim, how do you explain the fact that you have no desire to be with another man?

          • guerito777

            If it is not a choice how do you explain that 24% of the prison population participates in gay acts and only 1-3% of the general population is gay? is it because gays commit felonies at higher rates than the general population?

          • Bill

            it’s called situational sexuality.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Situational_sexual_behavior

          • roald

            Perhaps it is because (1) 20+% of the prison population wants sexual relief even if they are not attracted to their partner (2) rape is used to acquire power?

          • The Last Trump

            No militant gay agenda in our schools when we were growing up, pushing us to accept and experiment with it. And pick out our own genders, etc, etc, etc. Ahhh, those were the days.

          • Bill

            yes those were the awful awful days

          • roald

            When did you decide to be straight?

            I would appreciate a link to one of those studies to see if they conclude as you did.

            You might be interested in
            http://www.worldpolicy.newschool.edu/wpi/globalrights/sexorient/twins.html
            http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/1961to1999/1993-homosexual-orientation-in-twins.html
            though probably not since it might cause you to re-think your conclusions.

          • The Last Trump

            Blah, blah, blah.
            Got anything new, tolerant one?

          • Angel Jabbins

            This has nothing to do with ‘the Bible being the law of the land’. It has everything to do with religious freedom guaranteed by our constitution. That pizza shop never refused to serve gays….never turned them away from their restaurant…not ever. They simply make a statement they could not, due to their religious convictions, participate in a gay marriage which they believe to be immoral and violation their conscience. If a gay couple ever really wanted pizza for their ‘wedding’ they could get it most anywhere.

            I read a lot of the comments posted by gays at Yelp,com before they started taking them down, so I know who the real bigots and haters are. Most of their comments were disgusting and vile, many containing explicit pictures of themselves involved in homosexual acts. They went out of their way to mock this family, their beliefs, and some even threatened violence. Nice bunch!

          • roald

            How is baking a cake or arranging flowers participating in a wedding? How did the business owner know which of their customers was gay when ordering a pizza? Do these business owners refuse service to divorced people? Brides who are not virgins? People who do not honor their parents?

            You do realize that deeply held religious beliefs were used to support racial segregation.

          • Angel Jabbins

            The baker of the cake does not just hand over the cake. They have to go to the reception hall to arrange and do the last minute touches. Florists do not just hand over the flowers. They must go to the church or wherever the wedding is being held and arrange the flowers. They are participating to some extent…having to be physically present at the wedding or reception site. Photographers have it the worst though. They truly have to be there for the entire thing…start to finish, taking pictures of the whole affair, participating in every aspect of the wedding and reception. You are asking these people to violate their consciences to participate in something they feel is immoral. Muslims would absolutely refuse, but of course, gays would never pick on Muslims though there are surely many fine Muslim bakeries, florists, and photographers. No, let’s get those Christians! They are easy to bully, aren’t they?

            Be specific please: Which ‘deeply held religious (Christian) beliefs’ were used to support racial segregation. I would like to know exactly which beliefs you are referring to in the Bible that support racial segregation. Truth is, Christianity helped to end slavery in this country and in England and true Christians fought along side Martin Luther King (a Christian himself) to end segregation. Anyone claiming to be a Christian while supporting hatred for people based on their skin color is not a true Christian at all, but in name only, because racial hatred is completely against the teachings of Christ.

          • roald

            They are not participating. They are merely present. They are not being asked to endorse the wedding. The same arguments were made to support segregation.

            “Almighty God created the races white, black, yellow, malay and red, and he placed them on separate continents. And but for
            the interference with his arrangement there would be no cause for such marriages. The fact that he separated the races shows that he did not intend for the races to mix.”
            — Judge Leon M. Bazile, January 6, 1959
            Caroline County (Va.) Commonwealth v. Richard Perry Loving and Mildred Dolores Jeter
            http://lva.omeka.net/items/show/54

            “…[p]urity of race is a gift of God . . . . And God, in his infinite wisdom, has so ordained it that when man destroys his racial purity, it can never be redeemed.” Allowing “the blood of the races [to] mix,” according to Bilbo, was a direct attack on the “Divine plan of God.” There “is every reason to believe that miscengenation [sic] and amalgamation are sins of man in direct defiance to the will of God.”
            Senator Theodore Bilbo
            https://archive.org/details/TakeYourChoice

            “God made them negroes and we cannot by education make them white folks.”
            Georgia Gov. Allen Candler (1901)

            “…the good Lord was the original segregationist.”
            Mississippi Gov. Ross Barnett won (said before the election)

            How about the Christians who succeeded from the Union to maintain slavery?

            If racial hatred makes one a bad Christian, why is it OK to hate gays and be a good Christian?

          • Angel Jabbins

            I will say it again…(even though you refuse to listen) anyone advocating racial hatred is NOT a Christian. I don’t care what their title or who they portend to be or what official statement they made. They are deceived and when they stand before God one day, they will be shaking in their shoes to find out they their real condition. God does not and never has condoned racial hatred! You can site hundreds of people calling themselves christian who did evil things. If they do what it against God, they are not true followers of Christ.

            True Christians do not hate gays. They believe what the bible says,…. that the behavior is immoral, sinful. It is like any other sin which needs to be repented of. Christians share the gospel with gays, with everyone who needs to repent of whatever their particular sins (we are all sinners)…and the need to believe in Christ. We are free, at least for now, to share that message. It is a message Christians have always shared. But for sharing it today we are now called haters. If it is against one’s conscience and religious belief to participate, even by being ‘merely present’, they should have to right to exclude themselves, especially when there are plenty of other businesses ready and willing to supply their need. Compassion and tolerance needs to work both ways. Instead we have the Gay-KK forcing their lifestyle on people who have a valid conscience objection. There is no more I can say to you. This conversation is over.

          • roald

            There must be a lot of non-Christians in this country that call themselves Christian. Perhaps you should be helping them become true Christians.

            When the message being shared is that it is OK to practice discrimination against gays, Browns., Blacks, the poor, etc. the people sending the message are haters. As your post progressed, I see you shifting into hate mode…”Gay KK[sic] forcing their lifestyle…” is hate. Jesus would want you to love them and, if the government made you cater their wedding, you are to follow the government’s laws for your reward will come after your death.

            The argument you make was also made to justify segregation. It was accepted for a while and then not.

          • StarkStealthArmor

            A very valid statement!!

          • Angel Jabbins

            Continuing my response to you:

            “Do these business owners refuse service to divorced people? Brides who are not virgins? People who do not honor their parents?”

            The issue here is the definition marriage and the attempt of gay people to redefine it. Marriage is and always has been, for centuries since the beginning of time, between one man and one woman…yep even sometimes divorced people remarry and people who have fornicated before their marriage get married…but it is still one man and one woman which is what marriage was meant to be. Two men, two women, two men and three women, five women, and man and his pet…where will it end? Once you open Pandora’s Box, you will never get it closed again. Marriage becomes meaningless when it can apply to any combination at all and that is where we are headed. Marriage is not a right. Can you marry your mother…your sister….your pet pig?

            You equate discrimination against people due to racial differences to gay ‘discrimination’. They are not the same at all. You cannot change the color of your skin. There are people who have changed from gay to straight. I know some of them. Racial differences are genetic. There is absolutely no scientific evidence that being gay is inbred. One even one shred! Even in the study of twins, in most every set, if one turns out to be gay, the other is not and their genes would be almost completely identical. It is a moral issue not an issue of illegal discrimination.

          • StarkStealthArmor

            Another impressive statement. Thank you!!!

          • Angel Jabbins

            i think it is telling that we have never had a gay couple go into a Muslim-run restaurant asking them to cater a gay ‘wedding’. I wonder why the gays don’t pick on Muslims for their beliefs. Their holy book says gays should be killed….thrown off tall buildings and then stoned to death. The Islamic religion is a true threat to gays. But no…they purposely target peace-loving Christians over a stupid ‘wedding’ pizza they never wanted in the first place. The GayKKK is on the rampage against the ‘hateful, mean spirited, bigot Christians whom they know will just retreat into the woodwork because they are non-violent. Easy bunch to pick on, don’t ya think?

          • roald

            How many Muslim restaurants are there that would cater any wedding and have a menu that a couple would want at a wedding. If those cases do exist, the restaurant owners are equally wrong.

          • Angel Jabbins

            OK, here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=102&v=RgWIhYAtan4

            This man recently put together a video that’s gone viral, in which he visits a number of Muslim bakeries and tries to order a cake for a gay wedding.

            Many of the bakers politely declined and sent him to other bakeries, which brings up an interesting point in light of the hypocrisy we are seeing in Indiana and across the United States. Is political correctness the greatest of hypocrisies?

            So if you believe the Muslim restaurant owners are equally wrong, then why are there no lawsuits being brought again them? Why aren’t their restaurants being forced to close, being picketed, threatened with violence like the Christian owners are?

            It is not true the Muslim restaurants would not have a menu gays would not want to order from. There are many Muslim bakeries that do provide cakes for wedding. There are probably Muslim photographers as well you would refuse. Gays don’t pick go to the Muslim business because Christians are the easy target. Who wants to mess with the Muslims considering their real intolerance of gay, hmm?

          • roald

            Your persecution complex is showing.

            Be patient, the lawsuits will come. Gays do not care that Christians refuse to treat them equally. They care that people refuse to treat them equally.

          • Angel Jabbins

            No persecution complex here. I will gladly suffer anything for my faith in Christ and expect to soon in this country. Bring it on! I am ready.

            “Gays do not care that Christians refuse to treat them equally. They care that people refuse to treat them equally.”

            Then why don’t they try getting their next wedding cake from a Muslim bakery for a change. Let’s just see what comes of that first shall we? I expect no lawsuit will be filed against them, no threats of burning down their store, no incessant phone calls day and night, and no disgusting remarks on Yelp with filthy porn pics attached. And we both know why.

          • roald

            No persecution complex, yet you will gladly suffer anything for your faith. That is the definition of a persecution complex when you are by-far the majority of the population.

            The time will come when they do try to get a cake from a Muslim baker and might sue that baker should s/he refuse. The law is clear that if you serve the public, you serve all of the public. That came from the days when people used their religious beliefs to refuse to serve Blacks.

          • jmichael39

            And there are laws in this country that prevent the government from creating laws that violate our fundamental right to exercise our sincerely held religious beliefs in whatever manner we wish. You don’t like it? Write a new constitution.

          • roald

            The laws are trumped by the Constitution – equal protection and all that. There are other laws that say discrimination is illegal.

          • jmichael39

            I don’t think you quite understand how the Constitution words. The 14th Amendment does not incorporate the Bill of Rights to the States…well at least that was not the intention. Even though some court cases have since incorporated certain parts of the BoR to the states. So, no, the Constitution only in very small ways applies to the states. The Constitution was drafted to provide limited powers to the federal powers to the National Government as delegated to them BY the states.

          • roald

            jmichael39. You are correct that the 14th amendment does not incorporate the bill of rights to the states; however article VI of the Constitution does. Have you read it? Let me quote,
            “This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.”

            http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_transcript.html

            Can you provide even one case where this has been demonstrated to not apply? I can supply a few examples to the contrary.

            Loving v. Virginia
            https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/388/1

            Lawrence v. Texas
            http://www.oyez.org/cases/2000-2009/2002/2002_02_102

            Hollingsworth v. Perry
            http://www.oyez.org/cases/2010-2019/2012/2012_12_144

            McDonald v Chicago
            http://www.oyez.org/cases/2000-2009/2009/2009_08_1521

          • jmichael39

            That’s great, you actually tried to do a little research. Unfortunately, the intent of Article VI is clearly not to override state supremacy…but to merely address the pre-eminence of the US Constitution in issues where the state law and the federal law are in conflict with one another. In addition, when cases over this issue are brought before the SCOTUS, the Supreme Court generally looks at whether Congress has established a national regulatory scheme and if so, states cannot regulate in that area.
            This is what happened when Arizona tried to pass a state law that mirrored federal law on immigration and border security. The Court said that the US has regulatory authority over this issue. In doing so, the Court, in all such cases, refers to the US Constitution and the authority delegated by the States to the National Government. Then applies the law appropriately.
            In regards to Hobby Lobby, it was only accepted as federal case because of the regulatory authority of the National Government over interstate commerce, and in particular because the law which HL asserted was causing an undue burden on their religious liberty was of a national origin.
            In other cases, where the business is NOT bound under interstate commerce regulatory powers, nor the law is federal in nature, the cases were kept within the confines of State and Local laws…because there was no federal legal jurisdiction over them, no matter what federal law was or is in place.
            Nineteen states have mirrored to a large degree the federal version of the RFRA for the single purpose of having applicable laws for issues not bound under US Constitutional authority by delegation.
            While you have an interesting understanding of the Constitution, you application of it is deeply fallacious.

          • roald

            Most of the RFRA laws do not allow religion to be used as an excuse for discrimination, which was attempted with the more recent laws. A lawsuit pointing to the 14th amendment would invalidate those laws in much the same way religious objections were raised and discounted to support miscegenation and segregation.

          • jmichael39

            You’re completely wrong. That’s why they’re called RELIGIOUS Freedom Restoration Acts. They most definitely offer due process for appeals for religious exemptions from certain laws or provisions. As with ALL RFRA laws, it doesn’t guarantee that those exemptions will be permitted, but only that they can use Religious Liberty as the basis for their standing in requesting their exemption. Are you finally getting it?

          • roald

            Nope. The newer laws exempt individuals and businesses from responsibility for discriminating against individuals, not protected by anti-discrimination laws, based on religious beliefs on those discriminating. The older laws protected the individuals against actions by the government only.

            If you are in business to serve the public, you need to serve the public.

          • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

            do you take issue with a halal restaurant not serving bacon or a muslim cafe not serving pork?
            just because they don’t eat it doesn’t mean all their customers don’t

          • roald

            A classic, failed attempt at misdirection. Just as I would not expect a halal restaurant not to serve pork, I would not expect them to sell shirts either. If they do choose to serve pork, they must serve it to Jews who want a ham sandwich. If they sell shirts, they must sell them to Christians.

          • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

            Cool story bro! By the way, I am gay and yes conservative and if someone didn’t want to cater for my wedding as it is against their religion fine I’ll take my cash elsewhere!
            That ok with u hun?

          • roald

            It is, of course, your decision. My opinion is that you should not be refused service. You should not have to look for a job in a company that accepts you. You should not have to find an apartment to rent or a house to buy somewhere else. You should not have to use a different bathroom, water fountain, or lunch counter. Your children should not have to go to another school.

          • The Last Trump

            You mean their newly discovered riches?
            What’s it up to now, $900 000 dollars?
            Imagine! A million bucks for not allowing hateful, bigoted bullies to push you around. And you nuts say there isn’t a God!
            Yeah, must just be driving you crazy. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Gosh, Paul, I actually expected you to come on here and condemn the death threats and Gaystapo bullying. But, you can’t actually do that as an a-theist, can you? It’s all “survival of the fittest” under your view, and there are no objective moral values or duties under such a bankrupt worldview.

            This just goes to show the self-refuting bankruptcy of the gay “rights” and a-theistic life: in order to promote their (false) view of tolerance, they must be intolerant bullies and hate mongers.

            “In a universe of blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won’t find any rhyme or reason in it, or any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference… DNA neither knows nor cares. DNA just is. And we dance to its music.” (Richard Dawkins, River Out of Eden: A Darwinian View of Life (1995))

          • jmichael39

            like you, Paul…LMAO. Sorry, but we won’t be donating to YOUR cause. Try some kindred spirit…like some Marxists or Islamic Extremists.

        • Bill

          and they deserved it all.

      • The Last Trump

        Says the anti-religious freedom and anti-freedom of thought bully on the Christian website!
        Too funny! Grossly hypocritical, as usual. But still, funny.
        Live and let live, eh hater?

      • Anonymous

        Do you know what the first ‘Christians’ (they weren’t called like that in the beginning) endured under the Roman Empire? Especially under Emperor Nero’s rule? It was horrible, awful, sad, etc. It was not easy to be a Jesus’ follower back then.

        Of course, that doesn’t justify what many Christians did during the Middle Ages and continue to do today. So the title of “bully” just switched. Just like it will switch again in the future to another group.

        P.S. Even Christians were the victims of Christians (e.g., Galileo Galilei, Martin Luther).

        • Oboehner

          “Even Christians were the victims of Christians” *catholics* there is a distinct difference. That being said, even evangelicals shoot their wounded.

          • Anonymous

            Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Protestant, Mystic, Anabaptist, Baptist, Puritan, Quaker, Unitarian, Evangelical, Jehovah’s Witness, Latter-day Saints, Lutheran, Pentecostal, among others I may not know of fall under the wide scope of Christianity.

            Each might interpret scripture differently and might view Jesus’ divinity differently but that doesn’t change the fact that all of them are Christians. Even when they won’t accept it.

            “Even Christians were the victims of Christians” That statement is correct.

          • Oboehner

            I’m sure you missed some other cults in there somewhere in your great generalization.

        • Nick_from_Detroit

          Galileo wasn’t a victim, except of his own hubris. What was Luther a victim of?

          • Anonymous

            Galileo was a victim. He proposed heliocentrism (astronomical model in which the Earth and planets revolve around the Sun at the center of the Solar System) which was proven to be true. The Roman Inquisition got hold of him and condemned him to house arrest for the rest of his life just because he opposed the church’s wrong ideas.

            Martin Luther opposed the Vatican’s abuses as well and could have ben victim of the Roman Inquisition as well had people of power in Germany not intervened to help him. He might not have suffered a severe punishment other than excommunication but at least exposed the lies of the Roman Catholic church.

          • Nick_from_Detroit

            Umm….wrong. Galileo thought the sun was the center of the universe, rather than the earth (i.e., heliocentrism). And, he couldn’t prove that it was true, his math wouldn’t work (he thought that the planets traveled in circular orbits instead of elliptical). He also couldn’t show stellar parallax (look that up), which is why most of his fellow scientists didn’t defend him.
            After promising to only teach heliocentrism as a theory (his trial by the Jesuits, A.D.1616), he went back on his word and started teaching it as fact, again.

            Then, he started making theological pronouncements on the Scriptures, something he was not competent to do. Finally, he wrote a book (Dialogue) in which the proponent of geocentrism sounded a lot like the pope, and, he called him Simplicio, as in simpleton. Not very smart, on Galileo’s part.

            For his arrogance and pride he spent the rest of his life in a plush villa, wanting for nothing.

            You said that Luther was a victim, now you claim he could have been a victim. Not the same thing, really.

            Tyndale was another who’s pride and arrogance got him into trouble. He had no training as a translator and was a mediocre scholar. His translation was full of errors and his notes taught heresy. (He was tried for heresy 3 years before he first published his translation (1522)). His bible was so bad, Henry VIII ordered that every copy be burned!
            Hope that helps. May you, and your family, have a very blessed Easter.

          • KenS

            Sorry but you are so wrongonTyndale, The King James Version of the bible is almost identical to his translation.

          • Nick_from_Detroit

            Not true, KenS.
            But while the King James translators rejected some specific translations in the Douay, they emulated others. It is commonly acknowledged that, in preparing the KJV, the translators made use of the Rheims New Testament and adopted many of its readings in preference to those of other English editions. The KJV in many places thus bears a Douay-Rheims “slant” absent from prior translations.
            http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=4300&CFID=23061356&CFTOKEN=42582707

          • Nick_from_Detroit

            Where’d you go, KenS?

          • Nick_from_Detroit

            Where’d you go, Mach?

      • Oboehner

        But it’s ok if you ram your religion down our throats and our children’s under the BS of “science”.

        • roald

          Please tell me that you understand the difference between observable, repeatable observations that can make predictions that come true and when they fail are improved and faith, which is unprovable, unchangeable, and cannot make accurate predictions.

          • Oboehner

            Exactly, evolutionism is a religion.

          • roald

            OK, you don’t understand the difference. Your loss.

          • Oboehner

            Not mine…

          • KenS

            Not one prophecy from the bible has not come true. There are some that we are still waiting to be fulfilled, but there are none that have been false, unlike Nostradamus and others who have made some true predictions, but some false predictions

          • roald

            At the risk of letting you sidetrack me, name a dozen that have. You don’t get to use the Bible as a source of the prophecy and the event.

            Faith…”strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.”

            Science…”the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.”

            You have to be willfully ignorant to conflate the two.

          • KenS

            Your challenge makes abosultey no sense. The bible is the source of the prophecies that are being challenged, so If i cannot use the bible as the source of the prophecy, then I have no prophecies to defend.

          • roald

            How about using a non-Biblical source of proof that the prophesy came true?

          • KenS

            Isaiah 51:3

            3 For the LORD shallcomfort Zion: he will comfort all her waste places; and he will make her wildernesslike Eden, and her desert like the garden of the LORD; joy and gladness shall befound therein, thanksgiving, and the voice of melody.

            Isaiah 62:2-4

            2 And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness,and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name , which the mouthof the LORD shall name.

            3 Thou shalt also be a crown of glory in the hand of theLORD, and a royal diadem * in the hand of thy God.

            4 Thou shalt no more betermed Forsaken ; neither shall thy land any more be termed Desolate: but thou shalt be called Hephzibah, and thy land Beulah : for the LORD delighteth in thee, and thy land shall be married .

            At the present time, there are rivers and springs of water rising up in areas of Israel that have been dried, desert land since the captivity of Israel.
            Isaiah 11:12:
            12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth

            Since 1948 when Israel was made a nation again, the Jewish people have been migrating back to the mother land from all over the globe. Then again in the 90’s when the Soviet Union fell and the Berlin Wall was torn down, Jews were finally able to leave these communists states and migrated back to Israel.

            Isaiah 49:22:
            22 Thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I will lift up mine hand to the Gentiles, and set up my standard to the people: and they shall bring thy sons in their arms, and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders.

            This also started in 1948 when the United States, a Gentile nation was the first to recognize Israel as a Nation and helped the Jews migrate back home. This will be fulfilled even more when during the tribulation the gentiles will help the Jews get back to Israel while the 144000 witnesses are spreading the gospel of the Christ.

            The following are from a book written by Dwight L. Moody titled: “Pleasure and Profit in Bible Study”, Chapter 5
            BABYLON.

            First regarding Babylon—”And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees’ excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation; neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there. But wild beasts of the desert shall lie there; and their houses shall be full of doleful creatures; and owls shall dwell there, and satyrs shall dance there. And the wild beasts of the islands shall cry in their desolate houses, and dragons in their pleasant palaces; and their time is near to come, and her days shall not be prolonged.” And again: “The word that the Lord spake against Babylon and against the land of the Chaldeans by Jeremiah the Prophet. Declare ye among the nations, and publish and set up a standard; publish and conceal not; say, Babylon is taken, Bel is confounded, Merodach is broken in pieces; her idols are confounded, her images are broken in pieces. For out of the north there cometh a nation against her; which shall make her land desolate, and none shall dwell therein; they shall remove, they shall depart, both man and beast.” “Because of the wrath of the Lord it shall not be inhabited, but it shall bt wholly desolate; every one that goeth by Babylon shall be astonished, and hiss at all her plagues.” “How is the hammer of the whole earth cut asunder and broken! How is Babylon become a desolation among the nations! I have laid a snare for thee, and thou art taken, oh Babylon, and thou wast not aware; thou art found, and also caught, because thou hast striven against the Lord.”

            A hundred years before Nebucadnezzar ascended the throne, it was foretold how Babylon should be destroyed, and it came to pass. Scholars tell us that the city stood in the midst of a large and fruitful plain. It was enclosed by a wall four hundred and eighty furlongs square. Each side of the square had twenty gates of solid brass, and at every corner was a strong tower, ten feet higher than the wall. The wall was eighty-seven feet broad, and three hundred and fifty feet high. These figures give us an idea of the importance of Babylon. Yet nothing but ruins now remain to tell of its former grandeur. When Babylon was in its glory, the queen of the earth, prophets predicted that it would be destroyed; and how literally was it fulfilled!

            A friend going through the valley of the Euphrates tried to get his dragoman to pitch his tent near the ruins, and failed. No Arabian pitches his tent there, no shepherd will dwell near the ruins.

            NINEVEH. Now take Nineveh. Nahum 3:6 “And I will cast abominable filth upon thee, and make thee vile, and will set thee as a gazingstock. And it shall come to pass, that all they that look upon thee shall flee from thee, and say, Nineveh is laid waste; who will bemoan her? Whence shall I seek comforters for thee?” Now, how are you going to cover the city up? “I will cast upon her abominable filth.” How are you going to cast abominable filth upon the city? And yet for 2,500 years Nineveh was buried and an abominable filth lay upon her. But now they have dug up the ruins, and brought them to Paris and London, and you go into the British museum, and there is not a day except the Sabbath but what you can see men from all parts of the world gazing upon the ruins. It is just as the prophets prophesied. For 2,500 years Nineveh was buried, but it is no longer buried.

            Then look at Tyre: Ezekiel 26:1-5 “Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, Oh Tyrus, and will cause many nations to come up against thee, as the sea causeth his waves to come up. And they shall destroy the walls of Tyrus and break down her towers; I will also scrape her dust from her, and make her like the top of a rock. It shall be a place for the spreading of nets in the midst of the sea, for I have spoken it, saith the Lord God, and it shall become a spoil to the nations.”

            Coffin, who was correspondent of the Boston Journal during the war, went round the world after the war was over in ’68. One night he came to the site of old Tyre, and he said the sun was just going down, and he got his dragoman to pitch his tent right over by the ruins, where the rocks were scraped bare, and he took out his Bible and read where it says, ” It shall be a place, for the spreading of nets.” He said the fishermen had done fishing and were just spreading their nets on the rocks of Tyre, precisely as it was prophesied hundreds and hundreds of years before.

            Now take the prophecy in regard to Jerusalem: “And when He was come near, He beheld the city, and wept over it saying, If thou hadst known, even thou at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace: But now they are hid from thine eyes. For the day shall come upon thee, that thy enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side.” Didn’t Titus do that? Did’nt the Roman Emperor do that very thing? “And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.”

            I have read of two Rabbis going up to Jerusalem, and they saw a fox playing upon the wall; one began to weep when he thus looked at the desolation of Zion. The other smiled and rebuked him, saying that the spectacle was a proof that the Word of God was true, and that this was one of the prophecies which should be fulfilled—” Because of the mountain of Zion, which is desolate, the foxes walk upon it.” It was also said that Jerusalem should be as a ploughed field. This prophecy has also been fulfilled. The modern city is so restricted that outside of the walls, where part of the old city stood, the plough has been used.

            End of Quotes from Moody’s book

            I can find more if you are still not satisfied.

          • roald

            Thanks for pointing them out. Your are correct that some biblical prophesies have come true. As you also point out, many have not or, at least have not yet. The same could be said about any prophesy that did not have an associated date.

            Here is a list of biblical prophesies that have not come true yet.

            http://faithskeptic.50megs.com/prophecies.htm

          • KenS

            You are not playing fair at all, you make a restriction that I cannot use the bible as a source of fulfilled prophecies, then send me to a website of failed prophecies that use the bible to try and justify that they are failed. If I cannot use the bible to justify fulfilled prophecies, you cannot try to use the bible to justify failed prophecies.

          • roald

            The creators of the site used external sources to show that the prophecies failed (or to be generous, have not happened yet). That is the same standard I ask of you.

          • KenS

            To say that there is no reference in the old testament is not using external sources

          • roald

            No, it is not allowed. That the source I used made reference to bible merely reduces the number of prophesies that did not come true.

            Before we go too far afield, the point I made was that the bible’s track record on prophesies is not as good as you claim. Going back to the original posts, I see that I missed something else. The predictions based on science would be made by most scientists with the same information. They are predictions about what will happen in a given set of circumstances. They are not prophesies.

    • guerito777

      once this backlash to the backlash plays out often enough progressives will stop their manufactured outrage.

      • roald

        Nope. What will happen is over the next few generations people who think like you will be marginalized. The same happened to those who claimed the Bible justified slavery, segregation, and anti-miscegenation laws.

    • Greg Segda

      these people are so interested in forcing Christians to go against God that they lost all common sense.

    • Peter Leh

      “Kind of what the founding fathers had in mind.”

      founders had many things in mind and would be shocked today. like women voting.

      as great as the founders were, and they certainly were, i dont think many would want to go back to 1776 🙂

  • RWH

    On the other hand, it is now on record that they believe that they have the right to discriminate. If these people now carry out their promise, we can rest assured that all this money will disappear very fast defending themselves against complaints of discrimination. There is nothing like a smoking gun. On the other hand, who orders pizza for a wedding?

    • Carol Sakaguchi

      Following a deeply held religious belief does not equate with discrimination. All of these businesses, the christian pizza place, the photography co. The bakery all are willing to serve gay people anything food wise etc that they desire with the only exception being that they don’t want to participate in a gay wedding. So the real issue is religious persecution, forcing someone to participate in a religious ceremony they don’t agree with. Bullying and screaming discrimination when all they are doing is trying to put anyone of that religious persuasion out of business.

      • RWH

        Sorry. A cake is a thing. It is not a religious ceremony. These people sell a product. Once they make the product, it is none of their business how that product is used once it leaves the store. Bakers and florists produce products. Someone will pick it up, or someone will deliver it. This happens before a wedding, and the bakers of the cake don’t have to know the people. Business people don’t get the luxury of discriminating. They can’t refuse to sell a washing machine to someone they disapprove of just as they can’t refuse to sell a cake.

        • WorldGoneCrazy

          Do you really not understand the difference between selling pizza to gay people at the pizza parlor (which this store did) and catering a gay “wedding,” which is a participatory act excluded from those who share the Christian faith? Do you also not understand the difference, in the Barronelle Stutzman case (Washington florist), between selling flowers to gay people, which this woman did (repeatedly) to the man who wanted her to do his “wedding,” and participating in the wedding by designing and setting up the floral arrangements on site?

          In the first case, the pizza parlor would happily sell as many pizzas to the gay “couple” as they want, they just are not going to participate in the “wedding” by catering it on site. In the second case, Stutzman provided flowers numerous times for the “offended” gay man, including for his birthday, but she declined to participate in the floral services onsite of a gay “wedding,” which is an oxymoron in the Christian view.

          Not sure if you are just getting your news from Brian Williams or if you are deliberately being deceptive, but your discernment skills or intellectual honesty are lacking to non-existent.

          • RWH

            I have been buying pizzas all my life. Not once has anyone asked me what they were for. Should anyone ever ask me, I would tell them that it is none of their concern who is going to be eating that pizza. Nobody has been able to tell me the difference between a “normal” flower arrangement and a flower arrangement for a wedding. As far as cakes go, they are things and are delivered way before a celebration takes place. I am a church organist. I can’t tell you how many weddings I have played for where I have no idea who the couple is. I haven’t been invited to any celebrations before and after. I just play for a rehearsal and for the wedding and then go on my merry way. I’m paid for a service, period. Discrimination is against the law. If they are opposed to anything, they should stop providing the service to anyone, or they should stop prying into something that is really none of their concern.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “I have been buying pizzas all my life. Not once has anyone asked me what they were for. Should anyone ever ask me, I would tell them that it is none of their concern who is going to be eating that pizza.”

            What does your comment have to do with this case? The pizza parlor has NEVER turned anyone away – what part of this do you not comprehend?!? Strange how a “christian” like you would condemn them, but not the ones making the death threats.

            “Nobody has been able to tell me the difference between a “normal” flower arrangement and a flower arrangement for a wedding.”

            Which has absolutely nothing to do with the Stutzman case! Again, I see you do not address the fact that Stutzman provided numerous floral arrangements over the years to the “offended” gay man as well as numerous other gays.

            “I am a church organist. I can’t tell you how many weddings I have played for where I have no idea who the couple is.”

            Yes, but if you play for a gay “wedding,” it just goes to show what kind of “christian” you are.

      • Bill

        the courts say it is discrimination

        • Carol Sakaguchi

          I believe the courts have become unelected oligarchies imposing their will on everyone. They have been saying abortion is “legal” for years and most everyone knows abortion is murder. None of these businesses have refused service to gays with the only exception being not wanting to participate in a gay wedding which goes against a deeply held religious belief. So it boils downd to forcing by “law” that someone violate their conscience. Since there are plenty of businesses who will cater weddings I fail to see the problem.

          • Bill

            the law is law and what the courts says goes no matter what idiots like you think if you don’t like it you’re free to leave.

  • mrdsoccer

    Not that I condone the treatment to the business owner at all but it sure sucks when the shoe is on the other foot doesn’t it? Now she knows what Gay people struggle through on a daily basis from bigots and haters, maybe she’ll have a new found respect for what gay people go through………Hate hurts doesn’t it! But I doubt she’ll even think about it that way, she’ll take her money & run!

    • FoJC_Forever

      Homosexuals struggle with the reaction normal people have to the perversion which they embrace and follow. They are not a persecuted people.

      • Paul Hiett

        If you claim they’re not a persecuted people, you’re either a liar, or you’re one of the dumbest people on the face of the planet.

        • The Last Trump

          Wow! You actually said that with a straight face?
          Uh huh. Homosexuals are persecuted!
          What a ridiculously m0ronic thing to say.
          Perhaps somebody needs to reread the article again to discover just who’s doing ALL the persecuting.
          Here’s a hint: It’s NOT the family that everybody across the nation is donating to BECAUSE she’s yet another VICTIM of militant homosexual persecution and intolerance. Try to keep up with the facts Paul. It’s seriously embarrassing. Leave your jaded, and nonsensical opinion out of it. Nobody cares.

          • Bill

            piss off pig

          • Richard

            How tolerant, understanding, and accepting of you, Bill. You demonstrate the true colors of gay activism.

          • Bill

            Who said I was any of those things? I believe that aggression is the only way to deal with bigoted pigs like you

          • Richard

            So much for tolerance, acceptance, and understanding. But why would we expect something different, since gays have the highest incidence of violence in their own relationships. This is an evidence of their own demons.

          • Bill

            how does it feel to lose the war pig?

          • Richard

            Why so much hate? Bigotry? Intolerance?

          • FoJC_Forever

            There hasn’t been an actual war. If there was an actual war, the homosexuals and their supporters would lose. Your fear mongering would turn on you.

          • Richard

            Without Christ, you’ve lost the most important battle: the battle for your soul.

        • FoJC_Forever

          I am neither, and your claims about homosexuals being a persecuted people are false.

    • Carol Sakaguchi

      Just because you don’t agree with someone’s world view does not make someone a hateful bigot. there are 2 views. Some people believe gay marriage is ok. Many people believe it is against nature and the Bible. B/c of that they don’t want to be a participant in a ceremony that is against their beliefs. It doesn’t equal hating gays. Why gays are only targeting christians and not Muslims shows some kind of an agenda.

      • WorldGoneCrazy

        They are afraid of Muslims resorting to violence.

      • Ambulance Chaser

        No one is “targeting” anybody. If there were a Muslim-owned business in Indiana that refused to cater to gays, they’d be bigots too.

    • WorldGoneCrazy

      Please provide evidence of gay businesses being targeted by death threats for being gay.

      • The Last Trump

        🙂

  • thoughtsfromflorida

    Well that’s great. Goodness knows the best way for Christians to use $700,000 in the furtherance of the teachings of Jesus is to give it to people who own a pizza restaurant.

    • BigWhiteDog

      And are hypocritical homophobes…

      • Richard

        Why are you so afraid of God?

        • BigWhiteDog

          Sorry but I’m not afraid of your imaginary sky fairy invented by superstitious wandering tribesmen who didn’t science.

          • Richard

            Can you prove all of your baseless assertions? Otherwise, yours is just an opinion. Your opinion isn’t reality.

        • roald

          Why do you cherry-pick the Bible? There are 613 commandments in the old testament from where most of your and Jesus’ opinions on homosexuality come.

  • FoJC_Forever

    Reporters like Alyssa Marino have no problem stirring the hatred and bigotry that lies within the homosexual community and their supporters. They know what’s going to happen, and they revel in the verbal lashing and threats which come from those who want to spread their perversion into every corner of society.

    • Paul Hiett

      Oh yes, that’s what the LGBT community is trying to do. Force you to become gay. Yep, you nailed it.

      *sigh*

      • FoJC_Forever

        You either have a reading comprehension problem or you just enjoy giving responses that have nothing to do with what people address in their comments, or both.

  • Nick_from_Detroit

    UPDATE: Memories Pizza, the Indiana pizza place that has been mercilessly attacked by homo-fascists has received OVER $840,000!!!!
    Thanks, homo-fascists!
    http://www.gofundme.com/memoriespizza

    • BigWhiteDog

      You were suckered. It was an organized campaign and you were played.

    • Disqusdmnj

      Imagine all the hungry people that could have helped instead. You know, like what Jesus would have wanted.

      • Nick_from_Detroit

        You obviously don’t know Christ that well. He said that we would always have the poor with us.

        • Disqusdmnj

          And that absolves you from helping them?

          • Nick_from_Detroit

            No, of course not. What does that have to do with what I wrote?

      • jmichael39

        There’s still time, Disq….why don’t you start a campaign to raise money to feed the hungry and call on all your left-wing friends…see how much you can raise.

        • Disqusdmnj

          Scarily, we both know it wouldn’t raise as much as these “followers” got.

          Fortunately, I already donate to help people get fed, as do most of my “left-wing” friends. That’s what Jesus would want, right?

          • jmichael39

            considering the vast majority of private food banks in this country are run by faith based organizations and that the largest percentage of global food programs are faith based, I’d say most assuredly we’re doing what Christ told us to do. And considering more than 47 million Americans are in need of help getting food, I’d say the left is doing their damned best to make sure those food programs are kept busy. Thank you very much.

          • Disqusdmnj

            You are assuming that people will continue to donate. We assume that if they don’t, that there’s a social safety net in place that will guarantee that those of us who can – whose cup overfloweth – will indeed help those in need. Just like the Pope himself said, unless you think he’s not religious enough to qualify for your standards.

            Instead, it is the Rebiblicans in office who call themselves “Christian” who are trying to revoke that social safety net every chance they get.

            As such… you’re welcome.

          • jmichael39

            LMAO….you’re wrong on so many levels. Food banks have thrived in tight economies and good economies. You’re a fool if you think the best way to care for the needy is through our government. All that does is create a permanent needy class and create new needy. And why wouldn’t you want that? It’s how the left that gotten votes for 75 years or more.

          • Disqusdmnj

            I guess that’s why, by & large, the states with the most welfare spending are traditionally southern, white, Bible-belt states.

            Right?

            It really *is* like playing chess with a pigeon!

          • jmichael39

            While Alabama, Mississippi and S. Carolina do seem to fit nicely into your little bigoted pigeon-hole, I’m afraid New York, California, Illinois, Hawaii, Ohio, Maine and New Mexico don’t. Kentucky, while some consider it a southern state, some do not…I’ll give that one a split.

            What are these states? The ten US states that have more people on Welfare than in the jobs force. I guess that doesn’t fit neatly into your bigotry, does it. Wanna come up with another one?

  • Coz Mo

    The Huffington Post! I get more facts and objective reporting from MAD magazine!

  • Brian Mc

    Would they sue or threaten to burn down a vegetarian restaurant for refusing to serve meat at a wedding?

    • Disqusdmnj

      Obviously not, because a vegetarian restaurant would not refuse to serve meat to one group, but then serve meat to another. That’s the difference… not really hard to grasp, one would think.

      And yet…

  • Ino Yamanaka

    I just checked the GoFundMe. They are sitting pretty at around $842,000. It’s closed now though.

    Aint that crazy?

    “Oh whats that, you hate gay people? Shut up and take my money!”

    Makes me wonder where all this financial support was at when Jack Phillips or Barronelle Stutzman was sued. And to think, this pizza shop owner isn’t going to be sued and can’t be sued, but she is now and almost millionaire.

    • WorldGoneCrazy

      The pizza shop owner is not a girl. Barronelle Stutzman is also being supported by Christians through Alliance Defending Freedom. Both the pizza shop and Stutzman served gay people numerous times – they merely declined to participate in onsite services at a gay “wedding,” which is an oxymoron in the Christian worldview, and used to also be so in the secular view. Stutzman even did a birthday arrangement for the “offended” gay man. Thus, you have no evidence that they hate gay people. What would you have the pizza owner be sued for: declining to cater a hypothetical gay “wedding?!?” They have never even catered any wedding, much less been asked to! Facts are not a big deal in your universe, are they?

      • Basset_Hound

        Yet when Steven Crowder went to Dearborn, MI pretended to be shopping for a cake for his gay wedding and approached Muslim baker, he got turned away. All you heard from the media was …………….. (crickets)

        • WorldGoneCrazy

          Brilliant, Basset_Hound! Thank you for pointing this out!

          • Basset_Hound

            A friend told me about him. I’m not sure if he is a Christian, but .he’s a real funny guy

        • Peter Leh

          probably cause he was, in your words “pretending?”

          IDK ill have to look up that story.

          • Basset_Hound

            probably because the businesses he was approaching were Muslim rather than Christian.

          • Peter Leh

            after looking it up, Michigan is one of the last 13 states that does not recognize SSM.
            So the discrimination is legal. no matter who is doing it.

          • Basset_Hound

            OK, so I’ll type this again…s-l-o-w-l-y (and drag out my finger puppets to help clarify)…why do the Muslim bakers have a right to refuse to make a gay wedding cake but the Christian bakers don’t? It really doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not a state recognizes SSM.

          • Peter Leh

            political and religious martyrdom and condescension aside… i understand your point. 🙂

            that does not change the fact that a muslim baker will get cited for discrimination as well (in states that recognize SSM), “media double standard” notwithstanding.

      • Ino Yamanaka

        ” – they merely declined to participate in onsite services at a gay “wedding,””

        And the reality is that doing their job does not count as participating in a gay wedding. If it did, then those people would have won their court cases. They’ve all lost.

        “Stutzman even did a birthday arrangement for the “offended” gay man.”

        It’s quite interesting how cafeteria christians, like Stutzman, can do her job one and that doesn’t violate her religious beliefs, but then any other random day doing her job magically violates her religious beliefs.

        • WorldGoneCrazy

          I see you did not provide evidence that these Christians were haters.

          “And the reality is that doing their job does not count as participating in a gay wedding. If it did, then those people would have won their court cases. They’ve all lost.”

          In both cases, they have sold flowers or pizza to gay people at their location, but have declined from contributing their onsite services at a gay “wedding.” Those are two entirely different situations, whether the courts recognize it or not. At one time, the courts were fully behind the “right” of white plantation owners to own black people. They are also currently behind the “right” of women to have their babies killed, provided the babies are located in the womb. In neither case was the “right” established by the courts moral in an objective sense.

          “It’s quite interesting how cafeteria christians, like Stutzman, can do her job one and that doesn’t violate her religious beliefs, but then any other random day doing her job magically violates her religious beliefs.”

          Again, you fail to recognize that, in both cases, gay people were served in their establishments. It’s only when Christians are forced (by the “tolerant” ones) to be onsite at a gay “wedding” that we object. i thought you were “tolerant” of other people’s religious beliefs? We Christians are tolerant of your a-theistic religious beliefs. 🙂

          • Ino Yamanaka

            “I see you did not provide evidence that these Christians were haters.”

            ….I never said they were haters. So why would I provide evidence for that?

            “It’s only when Christians are forced (by the “tolerant” ones) to be onsite at a gay “wedding” that we object.”

            What you fail to understand is the logical absurdity of a business owner being forced to do their job. How does that make any sense at all?

            “Oh gee golly I need a job. I KNOW! I’ll open a bakery. And then when I get customers, I won’t do my job and instead I’ll have to be forced to do my job”.

            None of that makes any sense.

            ” i thought you were “tolerant” of other people’s religious beliefs?”

            I am tolerant of other people’s religious beliefs. As it stands though buying a cake or buying flowers is not an act of “religious beliefs”, it is an act of business.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “….I never said they were haters. So why would I provide evidence for that?”

            Here is where you did indeed say they were haters! “Oh whats that, you hate gay people? Shut up and take my money!”

            If you are going to backtrack, at least have the intellectual honesty to admit it.

            “What you fail to understand is the logical absurdity of a business owner being forced to do their job.”

            So, are you saying that a pro-life doctor should be forced by the state to perform abortions, or no longer practice medicine?

            “I am tolerant of other people’s religious beliefs.”

            Actually, you are not, because you believe that just the fact that a person opens a business means that he or she must forgo his or her 1st Amendment rights because of a read-in 14th Amendment “right” for gays to “marry” that was passed when sodomy was illegal in all 50 states. You actually do believe that the act of opening a business means a person must let go of their religious freedoms. (Except for the religious beliefs of the a-theist, of course.)

            As a former a-theist, I do understand your plight: there would be no reason for you to appreciate religious freedom (except for the worship of intolerant “tolerance” – that religious belief must always be affirmed). But, you should know that, as an a-theist, you cannot condemn anyone from an objective moral standpoint without stealing from God. And, it is not merely I who say that, but your “pope” and “cardinals:” https://winteryknight.wordpress.com/2014/01/16/an-atheist-explains-the-real-consequences-of-adopting-an-atheistic-worldview/

            “In a universe of blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won’t find any rhyme or reason in it, or any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference… DNA neither knows nor cares. DNA just is. And we dance to its music.” (Richard Dawkins, River Out of Eden: A Darwinian View of Life (1995))

          • Ino Yamanaka

            “Here is where you did indeed say they were haters! “Oh whats that, you hate gay people? Shut up and take my money!”

            If you are going to backtrack, at least have the intellectual honesty to admit it.”

            Clearly you don’t understand what context is or the fact that my statement was based off of a Meme based off of Futurama.

            I never said they were haters. It was a contextual meme about how successful they are being based on what they said.

            “So, are you saying that a pro-life doctor should be forced by the state to perform abortions, or no longer practice medicine?”

            Irrelevant. The topic is not about abortions or pro-life doctors.

            “Actually, you are not, because you believe that just the fact that a person opens a business means that he or she must forgo his or her 1st Amendment rights”

            Actually I am. Because as it stands, the first amendment right has zero to do with your job being a religious act or your business being considered a religious expression

            Just cause you associate the two doesn’t mean your government does.

            “But, you should know that, as an a-theist, you cannot condemn anyone from an objective moral standpoint without stealing from God.”

            The funny thing is, is that morals don’t come from god. They come from empathy.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “Clearly you don’t understand what context is or the fact that my statement was based off of a Meme based off of Futurama.”

            Clearly YOU do not understand that when you imply that someone is a hater, you are calling them a hater. You were saying that this quote of yours was applicable to the story at hand. Thus, you were most assuredly calling them haters.

            “Irrelevant. The topic is not about abortions or pro-life doctors.”

            Actually, it is MOST relevant, as it will show just how far you gay fascists will go to deny the religious freedoms of Christians. (Not Muslims though.) So, the question stands. and if your answer is “no,” how could that be, since abortions are even more legal than gay “marriage,” and doctors should not be able to discriminate against the abortion-minded based on their religious beliefs, right?

            “Actually I am. Because as it stands, the first amendment right has zero to do with your job being a religious act or your business being considered a religious expression”

            You DO realize, however, that it takes a PERSON to do a job or run a business, and that PERSON has rights? It gets all confusing doesn’t it, when you can kill a person in the womb, why shouldn’t you be able to force a person to participate in a gay “wedding.”

            “Just cause you associate the two doesn’t mean your government does.”

            Excellent case for slavery!

            “The funny thing is, is that morals don’t come from god. They come from empathy.”

            Prove it!

          • Ino Yamanaka

            “Clearly YOU do not understand that when you imply that someone is a hater, you are calling them a hater. You were saying that this quote of yours was applicable to the story at hand. Thus, you were most assuredly calling them haters.”

            I’m not implying that they are a hater, I’m just stating facts. And again, you clearly don’t know what the meme is I am referring to, so why are you trying to have an argument about it when you know nothing about it?

            Have you even heard of Futurama?

            “Actually, it is MOST relevant,”

            Actually it isn’t relevant. The topic is discrimination and homosexuals, not abortion or murder.

            “You DO realize, however, that it takes a PERSON to do a job or run a business, and that PERSON has rights?”

            Yes I realize this. Since we have yet to create a robotic race to do all manual labor, we currently are still stuck with employing humans.

            “why shouldn’t you be able to force a person to participate in a gay “wedding.””

            The only thing that doing your job counts as “participating” in, is having a job

            “”Just cause you associate the two doesn’t mean your government does.”

            Excellent case for slavery!”

            How so?

            “”The funny thing is, is that morals don’t come from god. They come from empathy.”

            Prove it!”

            Morals are based off of what you to “feel” is either right or wrong. Some would say that comes from sympathy, but it actually comes from empathy. When you can feel the emotions in another persons heart, whether you hurt or help them, thats when you’ve attained true morality.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Sick! You write: “Morals are based off of what you to “feel” is either right or wrong.”

            With your “empathy,” who needs hate?!? Your “empathy” would walk past a slave being whipped and say “it must be OK – the courts ruled in its favor.” Your “empathy” would walk past a crematorium in 1940’s Germany and say “Hitler said they were rats, so I needn’t feel sorry for them.” And, of course, your “empathy” has resulted in 57 million dead babies, all because it was legal and a “right.” So, it is no wonder whatsoever that you would have no empathy for the people in this story who are receiving death threats. You don’t “feel” for them.

            But, under your own view, those people who really do hate gays are also just operating according to their feelings and are perfectly moral to do so. So, you could not condemn a person who hates gays or even one who wants to kill gays. It’s just their feelings after all, and you said that if they feel it is right for them, then it is moral – for them.

            Your moral compass is severely broken, Ino: only Jesus can fix it. God bless!

          • Ino Yamanaka

            More trolling and nonsense. I know not to respond to you anymore.

            “Your moral compass is severely broken, Ino: only Jesus can fix it. God bless!”

            God isn’t real and morals come from empathy, not god.

            You are a amateur troll. Good luck in the rest of your follies.

          • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

            I will even make a donation. I’m glad chick fil a was successful against the gay bullies!

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            I see you did not respond to the very important issue that, if morals are based on feelings, then you cannot condemn Hitler, Stalin, Mao, slave owners, or abortion doctors, all of whom could justify their atrocities based on their deeply held feelings.

            Also, by showing your lack of empathy for the family who has received death threats from the Gaystapo, you have demonstrated that you are neither empathetic (but pathetic), nor do you have a moral compass that exists. Finally, you write: “God isn’t real…”

            The burden of proof is on you. Since you know God does not exist, please provide your evidence for this belief, so that the rest of us can stop believing in Him. God bless you, Ino!

          • Ino Yamanaka

            “if morals are based on feelings, then you cannot condemn Hitler, Stalin, Mao, slave owners,”
            You just proved that you do not know what Empathy.

            I refuse to explain it to you because if it has to be explained to you, then you will never understand the value of empathy.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            You said above that “Morals are based off of what you to “feel” is either right or wrong.”

            Well, I can assure you that Stalin, Mao, Hitler, slave owners, and abortion doctors ALL have (or had) deeply held feelings that feed their convictions. They all most certainly “felt” and continue to “feel” (in the case of abortion doctors) that what they are doing is 100% correct, in a moral sense. Use your brain for a moment: Hitler thought that gassing Jews was moral; Corrie ten Boom thought that rescuing Jews from being gassed was moral. Well, they cannot both be right!

            So, your way to arrive at morals, via invoking subjective feelings, fails and fails miserably, as has been shown throughout world history and geography. The road to Hell has been paved by your “empathy” throughout geopolitical history. So, the statement “If there is no God, objective moral values and duties do not exist” stands.

            BTW, did you call me a “troll” a couple of replies ago?!? You, dearest, are the a-theist on the Christian site, so that is the worst case of projection I have seen since the Abortion President’s last speech! Logic really is not your strong suit, is it? 🙂

          • Paul Hiett

            So you only do things because your Bible says so. Morally, that seems rather corrupt, don’t you think?

            Atheists do the right thing without such a book.

            Tell me again who’s “moral compass” is broken?

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Paul, you are confusing moral ontology with moral epistemology. I suggest you study up on that before you step in it. And, the fact remains: up to 97% of a-theists believe that killing an innocent defenseless human being in the womb is morally acceptable. So, it looks like they could use a Book, or at least a relationship with Jesus of Nazareth. 🙂 There would not be anything morally wrong with needing a Book to determine objective moral values and duties anymore than a serviceman like yourself, would have had a book outlining a code of conduct. You yourself did have something like that, no?

            Most importantly, my argument with Ino is that if objective moral values and duties were based on feelings, as she asserts, then the a-theist cannot condemn Stalin, Mao, Hitler, slave owners, or abortion doctors, all of whom could justify their atrocities based on their deeply held feelings. Your argument here really is not with me, Paul, but with your fellow a-theists, the majority of whom agree that there are no objective moral values without a transcendent Being of some sort. I apologize if I linked this before, but it really is worth reading, whichever side of the aisle we are on: https://winteryknight.wordpress.com/2014/01/16/an-atheist-explains-the-real-consequences-of-adopting-an-atheistic-worldview/

            Bless you, Paul, and Happy Easter!

          • Peter Leh

            “It’s only when Christians are forced (by the “tolerant” ones) to be onsite at a gay “wedding” that we object”

            in sturtzmans case she was not “forced” as she does wedding all the time. The customers just place the order to what she always provides per the SOS rules a regulations. She agreed and new the law. her citation was based on bad legal advice (that she could win) and poor business policy ( that she choose not to update)

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Stutzman does do weddings, just not gay “weddings,” because that is a clear violation of the Christian doctrine of not participating in, or affirming, the sins of others. Gay “marriage” does not actually exist in the Christian view, and making it legal does not legitimize it any more than making abortions legal legitimized baby murder.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Furthermore, the state (and Human “Rights” Commission) attempting her financial ruin is nothing but Christian persecution.

          • Peter Leh

            persecutionis were one has no choice

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            No, persecution is where this nice grandmother is being forced to give up either her religious liberty or her freedom to pursue happiness through her business. Consider this:
            1. abortion: where Demon-crats take away the right to life (for babies only)
            2. slavery: where Demon-crats take away the right to liberty (for black people only)
            3. gay “marriage”: where Demon-crats take away the right to pursuit of happiness (for Christian business owners only)

            It’s so weird: it’s almost like a pattern or something! 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “No, persecution is where this nice grandmother is being forced to give
            up either her religious liberty or her freedom to pursue happiness
            through her business.”

            so as a busienss person, what were/are her choices?

            if she had no choice, ask yourself this :” what has dan cathy not been cited?”

            btw: don’t waste they political typing, i am not interested. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            I don’t understand your question. Is it not clear that she either must give up her religious freedom (by participating in a gay “wedding”) or give up her business? What part of “financial ruin” is unclear to you, Peter?

            But, Peter, there just seems to be a trend with the Demon-crat party thing – that’s all. I’m all about trends, Peter. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “is it not clear that she either must give up her religious freedom (by participating in a gay “wedding”) or give up her business?”

            Not to those who own a business.

            “What part of “financial ruin” is unclear to you, Peter?”

            the choices and poor decisions she made that made the citation so unnecessary.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “Not to those who own a business.”

            How many businesses have you run, Peter?

            “the choices and poor decisions she made that made the citation so unnecessary.”

            And which choices and poor decisions were that?!? She was doing just fine until the gay fascists showed up on the scene.

          • Peter Leh

            “How many businesses have you run, Peter?”

            i run three.

            And which choices and poor decisions were that?!? She was doing just fine until the gay fascists showed up on the scene.”

            the choices that caused her to be cited for violation of public accommodation laws in the state of washinton and the poor advise from the ADF that had nothing to lose but use her , imo, as a political mascott for fund raising.

            I ask again, why has dan cathy not been cited?

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “the choices that caused her to be cited for violation of public accommodation laws in the state of washinton”

            What choices were those?!? The choice to run a business in her state?!?

            “and the poor advise from the ADF that had nothing to lose but use her , imo, as a political mascott for fund raising.”

            That’s a pretty despicable view of a Christian legal organization that has a high win rate AND, more importantly, has done tremendous good for Christians. To throw good fellow believers under the bus like that is not much of a testimony for you.

          • Peter Leh

            “The choice to run a business in her state?!?”

            the “choices” (not “choice”) listed on the SOS webpage for all to read. she can run her business in anyway that satisfies her conscience AND state regulations.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            You just made a great argument for German business collusions with the Nazis. What happens when state regulations trump her 1st Amendment rights and conscience? Do you obey the state over God, Peter? Once again, you are guilty of VERY poor discernment.

          • Peter Leh

            i am not sure what argument you are making at all.

            why not do both?

            “What happens when state regulations trump her 1st Amendment rights and conscience? ”

            i will be the first to protest.

            “Do you obey the state over God, Peter?”

            i dunno. i speed past a parked police car. if a got a ticket i would take the licking. Did not claim a religious exception becasue it did not apply. So far i can;t think of a law that requires me to disobey god.

            “Once again, you are guilty of VERY poor discernment.”

            i dunno. i’m not the not being cited and i have satisfied my conscience.

            If good discernment means being cited for violating the very covenant i myself made with the state then claimed martyrdom when i had every opportunity to copy those who can do both?

            well…. :0

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “So far i can;t think of a law that requires me to disobey god.”

            Well, the one in Washington does!

          • Peter Leh

            OK-

            I”LL BITE 🙂

            “which law is this that requires a business owner to disobey god?”

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            The one in Washington that says that Stutzman has to either disobey God by participating in gay “marriages” or face total financial ruin.

          • Peter Leh

            please cite your source

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Christian News Network, LifeSiteNews, etc. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            please quote your source.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            I just quoted 2 sources.

          • Peter Leh

            you cited your source.. as i asked.

            i countered with a clarification.

          • Peter Leh

            “That’s a pretty despicable view of a Christian legal organization that
            has a high win rate AND, more importantly, has done tremendous good for
            Christians”

            #1 i know too many lawyers.
            #2 when one takes the political blinders off it is easier to see. politics cut both ways. ADF still makes has to make a living. Having her settle a case they KNOW they can;t win and KNOW she is not legally in the right does not inflame the constituents and in the long run cost the ADF $$$
            #3 Owing my own business and listening to the grandstanding of Waggoner claim things she know is not true (which lawyers do) is pretty sickening.

            “To throw good fellow believers under the bus like that is not much of a testimony for you.”

            fellow believer deserve to be thrown under the bus if they are hurting others. it gives a poor testimony.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “when one takes the political blinders off it is easier to see. politics cut both ways.”

            Wrong, Peter: only one party on the side of abortion on demand. (Same party that supported slavery for 100+ years)

            “Having her settle a case they KNOW they can;t win and KNOW she is not legally in the right”

            You confuse “legal” with “moral” here. You would have made a fantastic apologist for legal slavery and legal Jew gassing. I pray you never have to choose between obeying the state and obeying God, because I am quite certain which one you would choose.

          • Peter Leh

            “I pray you never have to choose between obeying the state and obeying God”

            i have said multiple times…..i choose both. I do both. dan cathy does both ( btw you have not answered my question)

            don;t get in the way of those doing it… the old saying goes 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “i have said multiple times…..i choose both. I do both.”

            Not when they conflict. Read your Bible. Barronelle Stutzman is a heroine to me for obeying God and not man (when man’s law conflicts with God’s Law).

          • Peter Leh

            there is no conflict. conflict is only if you have no choice. stutzman had many choices on how to run and register her business.

            the hitching post in ID did. the baker in CO did. dan cathy has. i have.

            do say it can;t be done when others are doing it, sir

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Yes, I can see you now, Peter, as I am being fed to the lions: “Look at that dumb WGC! If he had just set his business up smarter or denied Jesus, he wouldn’t be going through this.” With friends like you, who needs enemies?

          • Basset_Hound

            Isn’t it ironic that those who slobber and whine and moan about “separation of church and state” when folks like us want to speak out on cultural matters are the same ones who want to get the state involved to tell folks like us how to run our businesses?

          • Griffonn
          • Basset_Hound
          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Haha – good one, Basset_Hound – you are on a roll this month! Your hypocrisy detector is operating on full strength! 🙂

            It reminds me how I am supposed to not let the government get between a woman and her doctor when she wants to kill her baby, but to force the government in there on everything else with ObamaDoesntCare. Or, how I am supposed to stay out of the uterus when she wants an abortion, but get right back in there when she wants “free” contraception. It’s all so very confusing! 🙂

          • Basset_Hound

            Ain’t it the truth, WGC!

            I’ve mentioned this to a couple of others. I’m going to be scarce on DISCUS for awhile. I’m picking up pocket change scoring 4th grade narratives in Texas for a large educational contractor. These 9 and 10 year olds use a lot more logic and clarity of thought than most of the trolls do.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “These 9 and 10 year olds use a lot more logic and clarity of thought than most of the trolls do.”

            Haha – straight into your Hall of Quotes, Basset_Hound! Good luck with the hard work, and we will try to hold the fort down while you are gone, though that will be difficile, en francais. What’s that sound? I hear Locomotive PJ4 coming down the tracks even faster than normal! 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            stick to the subject and prove me wrong.

            i am open to correction btw.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “i am open to correction btw.”

            Romans 1.

          • Peter Leh

            what bout it? it is off topic.

            as you can see i have yet to debate scripture.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            You claim to be a Christian, no?

          • Peter Leh

            you…. nothing gets past you. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “You would have made a fantastic apologist for legal slavery and legal Jew gassing.”

            agitator. i would have made a fantastic agitator.

            i think it was you that has suggested i was. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            “You confuse “legal” with “moral” here.”

            again. it is not moral if you have choices. therefore it is legal only. the legality of Stutzman’s choice.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            “it is not moral if you have choices. ”

            Not if the only choice is to deny God.

          • Peter Leh

            have i listed denying god as a choice? indeed, i have stated “do…. both”. 🙂

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Show some respect for you Creator and Savior and capitalize “God!” I didn’t leave blind faith a-theism to be surrounded by disrespectful Christians.

          • Peter Leh

            i can see you have run out of steam.

            stick to the subject and don’t project your ignorance on me.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            If you think it is ignorant to capitalize the Name of your Creator, I have run out of steam. 🙂

          • Peter Leh

            THE HRC can do nothing.

            the state is what enforces her registration and covenant with the state.. that she herself made.

            BUS 101

            Integrity matters

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            You are largely correct here. The HRC, though, has tremendous powers. It is the fact-finding arm for the state. If conciliation is not achieved, it will turn its facts over to the Attorney General for prosecution. The fascism begins with the HRC, but is ultimately prosecuted through the state. If the HRC had found “no reasonable cause for discrimination” as it should have, Stutzman would not be up for financial ruin.

        • Peter Leh

          “It’s quite interesting how cafeteria christians, like Stutzman, can do
          her job one day and that doesn’t violate her religious beliefs, but then
          any other random day doing her job magically violates her religious
          beliefs.”

          logical point.

        • Peter Leh

          you know she has serviced wedding of adultery. yet NOW she is concerned about her religious convictions?

          • Ino Yamanaka

            She is a tried and true cafeteria christian

          • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

            I just donated!

          • Ino Yamanaka

            Liar, the GoFundMe page was closed like 2 days ago.

          • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

            exactly! i wanted to see if you would respond and you fell for it!
            lol
            now show me where your followers like your response method!
            tick tock tick tock

      • Peter Leh

        “Thus, you have no evidence that they hate gay people.”

        this is a true statement. But you can see how prohibiting equal protection and violating public accommodation laws can get some peoples ire up 🙂

        • WorldGoneCrazy

          By “get some peoples ire up,” you mean “behave like the KKK,” right? Again, I must ask you to replace the “nun” symbol with the swastika, for the sake of your being consistent. And, how about equal protection for the Christians?

          Speaking of the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment, you do realize that it was passed when sodomy was illegal in all 50 states, and thus, would have no bearing on gay “marriage”? You also realize that the 14th Amendment was used fraudulently in Roe vs. Wade to usher in the moral murder of 57 million innocents? I kindly suggest you work on your discernment skills.

    • Deina

      Wouldn’t surprise me in the least if we find out that this was all staged, just to get GoFundMe cash.

      • Richard

        Only people with no moral compass do things like that. Interesting that you’d be the one to posit something like that.

        • Deina

          I don’t have a GFM site. Wouldn’t even know how to set one up.

          Just looks a bit suspicious: she goes on the news making a rant about how she would refuse to cater a gay wedding, (I’ve never heard of any wedding, gay or straight, serving pizza. Have you?), and in less than a week, she has almost $1 million to do anything she wants with.

          • Richard

            She didn’t go on a rant. The reporter did. You should get your facts straight.

          • Deina

            You need to start getting your facts straight.

            You seem to think that just because you want to believe something, it must be true, eh?

            “If a gay couple was to come in—like say, they wanted us to provide them
            pizzas for a wedding, we would have to say ‘no,’” O’Connor replied in
            response to Marino’s question.

            Nothing to do with the reporter.

          • Richard

            You don’t comprehend very well. O’Connor was interviewed and asked a question, which she answered. You said O’Connor ranted. She didn’t. The reporter made her comment an issue, which I stated. So sad gay activists have to stretch reality to suit their agenda.

            But without one moral compass, what should we expect.

          • Deina

            Ah!

            So it’s the reporter’s fault because they reported what she said!

            And more of your ridiculous ad hominae.

            How pathetic!

          • Richard

            You can’t bring yourself to admit you were wrong…even in view of the facts. But as I said, what else should we expect when you make up your own morals.

          • Deina

            In view of what “facts”? So far you’ve presented no “facts” to review.

            I love the way you judge anyone who disagrees with you as “without morals.” Just out of curiosity, who do you think the Lord will look on with more favor?

            a) someone who follows the teaching in
            . . . Matthew 22:36-40 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
            . . . (36 )“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” (37 )And He said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ (38 )This is the great and (-a-)foremost commandment. (39 )The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ (40 )On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”
            Footnotes:
            . . . a. . . . Matthew 22:38 Or first

            Or

            b) someone who willfully violates
            . . . Matthew 7:1-5 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
            . . . (1) “Do not judge so that you will not be judged. (2 )For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and (-a-)by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. (3 )Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? (4 )Or how (-b-)can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye? (5 )You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.
            Footnotes:
            . . . a. . . . Matthew 7:2 Lit by what measure you measure
            . . . b. . . . Matthew 7:4 Lit will

            I merely ask for information.

            It’s up to you, but I think it would be in your best interests to think about that for a bit.

          • Richard

            Read the article again. To say O’Connor was ranting is a lie…which you committed. To do such a thing demonstrates you don’t think there is anything wrong with lying to support your position…which again demonstrates your ‘made up’ morals…that it’s okay to lie if you feel you need to.

          • Deina

            I sometimes use hyperbola to make a point – something that is done by most people, yourself not the least. Just remember that when you judge me, you judge yourself as well.

            I have no need to “make up” any morals. The ones I was taught growing up are just fine, thank you very much. Neither myself, nor any of my kids or grandkids have anything more serious than a speeding ticket. My son is 14 years into his only marriage, I’m 30 years into my second, my daughter is 12 years into her second. We all donate to charities, both time & money. I suspect one would be hard pressed to find any way in which my morals are in any way less than yours.

            I use the lessons Jesus taught in the Bible because they are good lessons, and because it’s something that you claim to believe in. At least when it suits your purpose. Yet you’re quick enough to ignore Jesus teachings when they become inconvenient.

            Like now.

          • Deina

            I wish the hypocrites in charge of this would quit deleting my posts! Apparently they’re afraid of alternative views.

            I sometimes use hyperbola to make a point – something that is done by most people, yourself being not the least among them. Just remember that when you judge me, you judge yourself as well.

            I have no need to “make up” any morals. The ones I was taught growing up are just fine, thank you very much. Neither myself, nor any of my kids or grandkids have anything more serious than a speeding ticket. My son is 14 years into his only marriage, I’m 30 years into my second, my daughter is 12 years into her second. We all donate to charities, both time & money. I suspect one would be hard pressed to find any way in which my morals are in any way less than yours.

            I use the lessons Jesus taught in the Bible because they are good lessons, and because it’s something that you claim to believe in. At least when it suits your purpose. Yet you’re quick enough to ignore Jesus teachings when they become inconvenient.

            Like now.

          • Deina

            In view of what “facts”? So far you’ve presented no “facts” to review.

            I have no need to “make up” any morals. The ones I was taught growing up are just fine, thank you very much. Neither myself, nor any of my kids or grandkids have anything more serious than a speeding ticket. My son is 14 years into his only marriage, I’m 30 years into my second, my daughter is 12 years into her second. We all donate to charities, both time & money. I suspect one would be hard pressed to find any way in which my morals are in any way less than yours.

            I love the way you judge anyone who disagrees with you as “without morals.” Just out of curiosity, who do you think the Lord will look on with more favor?

            a) someone who follows the teaching in:
            . . Matthew 22:36-40 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
            . . (36 )“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” (37 )And He said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ (38 )This is the great and [a]foremost commandment. (39 )The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ (40 )On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”
            Footnotes:
            . . a. Matthew 22:38 Or first

            Or

            b) someone who willfully violates:
            . . Matthew 7:1-5 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
            . . (1) “Do not judge so that you will not be judged. (2 )For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and [a]by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. (3 )Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? (4 )Or how [b]can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye? (5 )You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.
            Footnotes:
            . . a. Matthew 7:2 Lit by what measure you measure
            . . b. Matthew 7:4 Lit will

            I merely ask for information.

            It’s up to you, but I think it would be in your best interests to think about that for a bit.

  • Mary Waterton

    Memories Pizza storefront vandalism photograph:

    https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/1906/6927/original.jpg

    • Richard

      Pathetic display of gay activism and oppression.

    • Deina

      What does a badly photoshopped picture have to do with anything?

      Do you even bother to vet the crap you post, or did you create that yourself?

  • Guest

    ‘Forced to close’? How were they forced to close because of online reviews and comments?

    Hope they do something good with the money.

    • Richard

      Forced to close because of militant gay fanaticism.

  • Letty Alter

    Jessica Dooley would be arsonist
    (574) 295-1972
    29002 Oak Grove Dr, Elkhart , IN

    Sister

    Parents John and Kimberly Dooley

    Places Lived

    – 58356 Old County Road 17, Goshen , IN, 2012 – 2013

    – 2311 Toledo Rd # 20e, Elkhart , IN, 1997 – 2012

    – 2311 Toledo Rd, Elkhart , IN

    – Rr 35, Goshen , IN

    – 1240 White Oak Dr, Goshen , IN

    – 58496 Old County Road 17, Goshen , IN

    Phone – (574) 295-1972

    – (574) 875-3265

    – (574) 370-0611

    – (574) 534-0721

  • Jim Deferio

    WHY ARE HOMOSEXUALISTS SO VIOLENT, HATEFUL, AND INTOLERANT?

    Well, the short answer is this. When you become a slave to your feelings and engage in activities dictated by feelings that are unnatural and perverted and in your mind these FEELINGS are all there is to life, it can produce a large amount of pent up hostility to others, especially those who disagree with you.

    Can you imagine if you had a powerful feeling (a fetish and obsessive compulsion) to stick your tongue into every knot hole that you saw. Not only would this be unnatural and irrational but it would result in medical consequences detrimental to you and everyone you kissed.

    And if in your desperate condition you were also deluded into thinking that you were born this way, had a civil right to act this way, and that those who disagree with you should be punished – you now have the present day homosexualist movement.

  • Jim Deferio

    Have you ever wondered why those identifying as “homosexual” are so unclean and are such nasty, obscene, and hateful people? Homosexuality is demonic to its core. You are seeing what a demon can do as it uses a human body as a puppet.
    I was talking to a medical worker who has cared for diseased homosexualists and they told me that it is a whole host of diseases that plague them, not just AIDS, and to be safe you may have to double-glove and double-gown. Many lesbians are afflicted with nasty respiratory infections. I’m not going to describe what these perverts do to each other but it isn’t clean or healthy. Don’t let them breath on you.

    • Paul Hiett

      There’s something seriously wrong with you.

      • Jim Deferio

        Why, because I’m not a sexual pervert?

        • Paul Hiett

          Because you flat out lie.

          • Richard

            Can you prove homosexuality is not caused by a demon?

          • Paul Hiett

            That’s the stupidest thing you’ve said in a while, and that’s saying something.

          • Richard

            I’ll take that to mean you can’t. Until you can, the possibility exists.

          • Paul Hiett

            Can you prove homosexuality is not caused by two unicorns humping, and the rainbows caused by their love passes over a hospital thus rendering any newborns as gay?

            If you can’t, the possibility exists.

          • Richard

            “Can you prove homosexuality is not caused by two unicorns humping

            Yes. Unicorns don’t exist today. Scientific fact. As such, they can’t cause anything.

            “the rainbows caused by their love passes over a hospital thus rendering any newborns as gay?”

            Yes. A rainbow is an optical and meteorological phenomenon that is causedby reflection, refraction and dispersion of light in water droplets resulting in a spectrum of light appearing in the sky. It takes the form of a multicoloured arc. Rainbows have no power in themselves. Scientific fact.

            BTW, as an atheist, isn’t it illogical to judge my opinion as stupid or not? If you believe in subjective morality, you should be okay with what anyone says regardless it if disagrees with your opinion?

            How can you reconcile judging others if you believe in subjective morality?

          • Paul Hiett

            Prove that Unicorns don’t exist. You can’t, can you?

          • Richard

            “Prove that Unicorns don’t exist.”

            Rational and sane people will admit that beyond a reasonable doubt, unicorns don’t exist. I agree. If you believe otherwise, you should have some good evidence to the contrary, and not just made up nonsense.

            Do you have some good scientific evidence to support a belief that unicorns exist today?

          • Paul Hiett

            Waiting for you to prove they don’t exist. If you can’t, the possibility exists.

          • Richard

            I’ve already said they don’t exist. It’s a logical conclusion based on the evidence.

            I find it telling that you have to resort to nonsense to defend your beliefs. By your own nonsense, there are many things we can’t prove definitively, such as love, tomorrow, creativity, job security, the upcoming weekend, and so on. Do you believe in any of these? If so, what is your definitive proof?

            If you can’t prove them, then they don’t exist.

          • Paul Hiett

            Still waiting. Should be easy to prove that they don’t exist. If you can’t, the possibility exists.

            Or, we could agree that if you can’t prove something exists, then it doesn’t exist. Would you like to agree on that?

          • Richard

            Already proved it beyond a reasonable doubt. Unless you can prove otherwise. Can you?

          • Paul Hiett

            Just because you claimed that rational people don’t believe in unicorns doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Still waiting for you to prove it.

            You can’t, can you?

          • Richard

            “Just because you claimed that rational people don’t believe in unicorns doesn’t mean they don’t exist.”

            Can you prove they do exist today? Your opinion isn’t proof. Can you?

          • Paul Hiett

            Still waiting on you to prove they don’t exist.

            Should be easy for you, since you’re always “right”, aren’t you? Your opinion isn’t proof. Can you?

          • Richard

            I’ve already answered it twice. No, they don’t exist today.

            If you believe otherwise, you would need to produce some type of evidence that they do? Can you?

          • Paul Hiett

            Yes, you’ve said that, I’m waiting for you to prove that unicorns don’t exist. Why not? Seems like you can’t…

          • Richard

            You haven’t answered any of my questions. Logically, I’ll take that to mean you don’t have any answers, which means no, you can’t prove otherwise. Thanks for your inferred answers.

          • Paul Hiett

            So no, you can’t prove unicorns don’t exist. I didn’t think you could. So now we have to accept both theories, since both theories have just as much evidence to support them.

          • Richard

            You appear to have a comprehension problem. That could be one of the reasons you stumble as you do.

          • Paul Hiett

            Let’s see…you demand that I prove demons don’t exist, then demand that i prove unicorns exist.

            Do you really not see the hypocrisy of your argument?

          • Richard

            “Do you really not see the hypocrisy of your argument?”

            There isn’t any. Unicorns may have exited in the past, but don’t now. There isn’t any evidence to suggest otherwise.

            Demons have been shown to exist by God himself. The NT writers recorded it as a matter of fact.

            Unless you have evidence to disprove both. Do you have any?

          • Paul Hiett

            The NT is not proof of anything. The NT is the claim. For some reason you don’t seem to understand this.

            You have no more evidence to suggest that unicorns aren’t real as I do to support my claim that demons aren’t real.

            Any claim by you to the contrary is nothing more than a lie on your part.

            It’s almost as if you think you stumbled onto some great debating tool by swapping what you consider valid criteria for proving God. If I claim God doesn’t exist you demand proof from me of this claim. Yet, when I ask for the same proof regarding Odin, you then switch the criteria, claiming I am now responsible to prove his existence for both claims.

            It doesn’t work like that.

          • Richard

            “The NT is not proof of anything. ”

            Yes, it is. It is a historical account of the events at the time. Yours is an unproven assertion…unless you can prove the historical account wrong. Can you?

            Good luck with that. No one has in over 2000 years, including scholars and historians…far superior to you.

            “It doesn’t work like that.”

            Yes, it does. The burden of proof is on you to disprove the historical account, not just deny it.

            Non believers are great deniers, and abysmal at proving that which they assert.

          • Deina

            It’s been 2 days and it still looks like you’re trying out for the Escape & Evasion Finals. Apparently you never intend to provide proof that your “demons” exist.

            I think it reasonable that we take this as just one more of your numerous unsupported claims.

          • Deina

            Rational & sane people also used to believe the Earth was flat & that the Moon gave off light.

            Since you can’t prove that unicorns don’t exist, maybe you want to take a stab at proving that your “demons” do exist?

            Some “good scientific evidence” would be good.

          • Richard

            Demons: Jesus cast them out of many people when he walked the earth. Jesus is a proven historical person who claimed to be God, was killed for that claim, and rose again to prove it.

            I’ll take a real person’s word (who is God) over your imaginary illogical fabrications. Unless you can prove Jesus didn’t exist or wasn’t God? Can you?

          • Deina

            Still waiting for your scientific evidence that demons exist.

            I heard of a man whose best friend was a 6 foot invisible rabbit. Given that I never met the man, nor did I ever meet said rabbit, that doesn’t constitute scientific evidence that such exists.

          • Paul Hiett

            Deina, see how Richard works? If you claim something exists, he demands proof of the positive. He he claims something exist, he demands proof of the negative to prove him wrong.

            For whatever reason, he thinks no one understands his little argument trick. It’s a little funny, but also a lot sad.

          • Deina

            Those who rely on such logical fallacies only do so because they have neither fact nor logic to support their claims.

          • Richard

            Atheism is highly illogical. I’m not surprised loftier concepts elude you.

          • Deina

            I see you’re going out of your way to avoid answering the questions Paul & I have asked.

            Obviously you take the old adage to heart — If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullschmidt!

          • Richard

            I asked the first question. How about an answer? Can you prove homosexuality is not caused by a demon?

          • Deina

            Demons can’t cause anything if they don’t exist.

            We’re still waiting for your proof of their existence.

          • Richard

            “Demons can’t prove anything if they don’t exist.”

            Do you want to rewrite that so it makes sense?

            Already produced it. Demons are a matter of the historical record. Can you prove the historical record wrong?

          • Paul Hiett

            BTW, Deina, Richard here thinks the Bible is the “historical record” he speaks of.

          • Richard

            Recorded history is a fact. Unless you can prove the NT writers were wrong? Lied? Can you?

          • Deina

            So you agree that Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene, since that is in an ancient papyrus from about the same time frame as other papyri of the gospels, & therefore also “a matter of the historical record”?

          • Richard

            Another example of reaching. Still very sad you feel you have to stoop so low to support your beliefs.

          • Richard

            It only seems like a trick to you because you have no defence to support your nonsense.

            Since you don’t believe in God, you must not believe in tomorrow, creativity, love, job security, the upcoming weekend….

          • Jim Deferio

            I fear God and always tell the truth. It was my search for truth when I was an atheist that eventually led me to Christ who said,
            “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No comes to the Father except through Me.” (John 14:6).

            Here’s just a few resources:

            http://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/STD.htm

            http://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/viral-hepatitis.htm

            http://kff.org/hivaids/fact-sheet/the-hivaids-epidemic-in-the-united-states/

            http://www.hhs.gov/ash/oah/adolescent-health-topics/reproductive-health/stds.html

          • Paul Hiett

            “I was talking to a medical worker who has cared for diseased
            homosexualists and they told me that it is a whole host of diseases that
            plague them, not just AIDS, and to be safe you may have to double-glove
            and double-gown. Many lesbians are afflicted with nasty respiratory
            infections.”

            Everything you said right there is a lie, plain and simple. I doubt you have the morals to admit it.

          • Jim Deferio

            I personally know the medical worker who works at a major hospital here in Syracuse.
            Btw, I often preach open air at “Pill Hill” here in Syracuse (it’s called that because there are three major hospitals next to each other – Crouse Hospital, Veterans Hospital, University Upstate Hospital).

            I will not give the medical worker’s name. Everything I said is 100% the truth.

            I know another medical worker who told me about a homosexual case they had and it was very nasty – even included herpes of the lungs! I will not reveal this medical worker’s name either.

            I personal know numerous EX-homosexuals and they have told me about their diseases which continued even after they got right with God (you will reap what you sow). Two have since died.

          • Richard

            Paul likes to believe his baseless assertions are true. He doesn’t respond well to facts and evidence.

          • Paul Hiett

            Again, all lies. How you can call yourself a Christian is beyond me.

          • Jim Deferio

            Hmmm, who between us has actually documented the severe medical consequences of homosexuality?

          • Paul Hiett

            Not you, that’s for sure.

          • Richard
          • Paul Hiett

            Holy crap, did you actually read that? Meningitis is an “gay” disease?

            ROFL…that’s awesome. By all means, please post more “articles” from wnd.com!!!!

          • Richard

            Homosexuals have a high incidence of impaired immune systems. It appears your “Not you, that’s for sure” comment is once again wrong.

  • Grace Kim Kwon

    Yes! Uphold God’s truth and the freedom of conscience!

  • John Mark IB

    well, well, well, interesting isn’t it? here’s your new tolerance folks, this is what the end times will be soon looking like, with the hater’s wanting nothing less than the blood of the professing Bible Believing Christians, ever notice how it’s all good and tolerant when it’s all about them getting their special rights, to be based upon what they want to do in their privacy of their own bedrooms?? but if you, or I, or anyone dare disagree with them, then immediately the bogus label of homophobic is labeled and branded upon you, and the media jumps into the fray and goes after you?? soon it will be legal to take the Bible believing Christians to the guillotine and kill them and they will think they are doing the world a big favor same as the isis idiots!! the anti Christ will have a field day with it, truly sad and the very word used to label them as so called “gay” is just plain wrong too, we as true Christians who are truly born again should not be allowing the hijacking of the term gay which is supposed to mean happy and not homosexual or sodomites etc., same as they calling us homophobic and basically just hate ranting instead of truly wanting equality for all, not special rights for sexual behaviors which are still outlawed as sodomy laws are in most states, and I’m sure the haters will rally against me because of my views and freedom of speech here but this intended with all love of course you’ll never get it until you get truly saved and born again and repent of your sins before a thrice Holy GOD! to my dear homosexual lesbian and so called trans gender male or female friends here’s hope for even you as we love you but most importantly if you will be objective and truly tolerant and fair and equal, Jesus loved you so much He died for your sins which you choose to live in and rebel against Him, here’s hope for you all may you seek Him with an open and sincere heart, have a blessed Resurrection day!! may you truly repent and seek Him,

    http://faithsaves.net/truth-for-gay-friends/

    http://faithsaves.net/salvation/

    http://faithsaves.net/apologetics-and-false-religions/

    http://goodpersontest.com/

    http://www.pillarandground.org/home/?page_id=36

  • Ino Yamanaka

    .

    • SPEECHFREEDOM1976

      Where’s ur link?

  • Nick_from_Detroit

    UPDATE: Memories Pizza’s, the Indiana pizza place that has been mercilessly attacked by homo-fascists, GoFundMe account was shut-down on Friday, as planned. But, not before it received OVER $840,000!!!! Thanks, homo-fascists!
    Even though anti-freedom loving leftwingers did everything they could to bully GoFundMe into shutting down the account. Losers!

    Meanwhile…
    The homo-fascists set up their own GoFundMe account in a lame attempt to show those pizza-making bigots what’s for! They set a goal of reaching One Million Dollars. They raised a grand total of….less than 600 bucks!

    Here’s the link to the florist being sued by homo-fascists, and she might lose her store and home:

    http://www.gofundme.com/mz6zm4