Atheist Activist Group Wants Illinois Principal Fired for ‘Promoting Christianity’ to Students

Photo Credit: Michael McGrone/Facebook
Photo Credit: Michael McGrone/Facebook

CHICAGO — A professing atheist activist organization is recommending that a Chicago-area principal be fired for promoting Christianity to students.

The Wisconsin-based Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF) recently sent a letter to the attorney for Rich Township Schools after becoming informed that Rich South High School Principal Michael McGrone announced that his goal is to “allow God back in school.”

It pointed to an article in the Chicago Tribune, which outlined that McGrone supports prayer in school and had a Christian woman, known as Mother Henderson, pray with students in the cafeteria over a microphone.

“This is how we ‘stop the killing’: Allow God back in school!! Prayer works,” he also wrote on Facebook.

FFRF further pointed to a quote in the Tribune article, in which McGrone stated, “Is [prayer] considered crossing the line? I would agree in part, but in so many ways I cannot deny who I am and what got me to become principal.”

It therefore recommended that the principal be fired.

“Given McGrone’s admission that he was aware that his activities violated the law, and his description of his unconstitutional behavior as ‘who I am and what got me to become principal,’ we see no reasonable alternative to terminating his employment with the district,” wrote staff attorney Ryan Jayne.

  • Connect with Christian News

 

“It is inappropriate and unconstitutional for district administrators to encourage students to pray, or tell students that ‘prayer works.’ Combined with ‘frequent references to Jesus,’ there is no doubt that McGrone is personally promoting religion in general, and Christianity in particular, to the students under his care,” he said.

FFRF also took issue that McGrone allowed Mother Henderson on campus to pray with students.

“The district may not allow its schools to be used as religious recruiting grounds during the school day,” Jayne wrote. “McGrone is not just complacent with Mother Henderson’s prayers and proselytizing of other people’s children, but actively promotes the activity by giving her a microphone, posting videos of her public school prayers online, and encouraging students to participate in the religious exercises.”

The church-state separation group therefore requested that not only McGrone be fired, but that Mother Henderson also be banned from campus.

“McGrone is plainly unfit to work at a public school in the United States,” FFRF opined. “We request written assurances that the district will protect Rich South High School students’ rights of conscience by replacing McGrone with a principal who is willing to follow the law. Additionally, we request assurances that Mother Henderson will not be allowed access to students during the school day in the future.”

In early America, 123 of the first 126 colleges established in America were founded on Christian principles. Harvard University, named after Pastor John Harvard, held the motto “Truth for Christ and the Church.”

“Let every scholar be plainly instructed and earnestly pressed to consider well the main end of his life and studies is to know God and Jesus Christ, which is eternal life. Therefore, to lay Christ in the bottom as the only foundation of all sound knowledge and learning…” its student manual read.

Princeton’s motto was “Under God’s Power She Flourishes.” The first president of Princeton, Pastor Jonathan Dickinson, said, “Cursed be all learning that is contrary to the cross of Christ.”

Yale also wrote in its requirements in 1745, “All scholars shall live religious, godly and blameless lives according to the rules of God’s word, diligently reading the Scriptures…”


A special message from the publisher...

Dear Reader, our hearts are deeply grieved by the ongoing devastation in Iraq, and through this we have been compelled to take a stand at the gates of hell against the enemy who came to kill and destroy. Bibles for Iraq is a project to put Arabic and Kurdish audio Bibles into the hands of Iraqi and Syrian refugees—many of whom are illiterate and who have never heard the gospel.Will you stand with us and make a donation today to this important effort? Please click here to send a Bible to a refugee >>

Print Friendly
  • bowie1

    Perhaps FFRF should be “fired” for promoting atheism.

    • Frank Dorka

      Perhaps you should read the Constitition or think about moving to another country where they like religious tyranny?

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        The 1st amended has been misconstrued as it was originally interpreted by the supreme court. Under organism/textual view as was ratified in 1776 religion can be in public, it is only Congress that cannot make any laws over preference of one religion or denomination. Religion has the freedom to be in public life as it has nothing to do with congress.

        • Frank Dorka

          Misconstrued? Perhaps. But religion has no business in any affairs of government. I’m thinking that was the meaning of the people that built the Constitition, don’t you? Isn’t that why there is no mention of a god in any law making document?

          • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

            That’s a lie sir.

          • Frank Dorka

            Proof is all I need.

            Jefferson, Adams, Paine, Kennedy..(and other)all said that Religion should be separate from government and never intermingle.

          • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

            The First Amendment has been interpreted by the Court as applying to the entire federal government even though it is only expressly applicable to Congress.

          • Frank Dorka

            Your Bible tells you to live without the “filthy lucre”, it says that you can survive on faith. You throw out your money, it will not buy your way to heaven.

          • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

            What does this have to do with the Constitution?

          • Slidellman4life

            Red herring. Stay on topic.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            That’s nice. But the 14th Amendment says it applies to the states as well.

          • George T

            Mr. Avatar: Ambulance Chaser is correct. The 14th amendment amends the 1st through 10th to apply to all parts of US government and citizens.

          • Josey

            you have twisted what they meant, they meant government is not to interfere with one’s faith, that is where separation comes, they even taught reading back then by using the Bible.

          • Frank Dorka

            You have twisted what they meant. I have read many statements by our “founding fathers” and they were in agreement that the religious tyranny that they escaped from would not be part of the new government.I know I am speaking to someone that got their American history from the pulpit. So did I. I just took it further to discover the truth that the religious will not claim.

          • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

            When earlier Supreme Courts used Jefferson’s letter, they referenced the entire letter in its context, and not just the separation phrase taken out of context as is done by today’s courts. By doing so, they arrived at very different conclusions. In the 1878 case of Renolds vs. United States, the Supreme Court concluded:
            “Congress was deprived of all legislative power over mere [religious] opinion, but was left free to reach [only those religious] actions which were in violation of social duties or subversive of good order.”

            That same Court went on to summarize Jefferson’s meaning of separation of church and state:
            “[T]he rightful purposes of civil government are for its officers to interfere [only] when [religious] principles break out into overt acts against peace and good order. In this … is found the true distinction between what properly belongs to the church and what to the State.”

            So, according to Jefferson and the Supreme Court, the government could interfere with religion only when its actions were “subversive of good order” or “broke out into overt acts against peace and good order”. The Court also identified those actions which, if perpetrated in the name of religion, the government had legitimate reason to interfere. Those actions included human sacrifice, polygamy, bigamy, concubinage, incest, injury to children, and the advocation and promotion of immorality.

            It seems that the original intent of the First Amendment has been set aside in favor of the separation phrase taken out of context from Jefferson’s personal letter written eleven years after the First Amendment was ratified.

          • james blue

            How is Christian proselytizing done by a school not interfering with the faith of non Christians?

          • The Last Trump

            How is Atheist proselytizing their religion any different?
            No special treatment for them either, I’m afraid.
            Until you can prove God doesn’t exist, you merely have faith and “believe”.
            Just like every other religion.

          • james blue

            Atheism has just one tenet, the denial of the existence of any God, beyond that there is nothing to connect one atheist to another other than coincidence. So no, Atheism is not a “religion”

            BTW I’m not an atheist.

          • The Last Trump

            Wise move.
            I wouldn’t want to be associated with that truth denying religion either!

          • Ronald Carter

            There are some who will always insist that atheism is a religion. Even though it’s not in any sense, i.e. no holy book, no deity, no prayer, no rites and no rituals. Call it a knee jerk response…with accent on the “jerk”.

            Interesting too that the subject of proselytizing comes up. Proselytizing is specific to only SOME Christians (Catholics for instance don’t do it at all) and never to atheists. I’ve never once heard an atheist say “I don’t believe in God and you shouldn’t either.”

          • TheKingOfRhye

            “Atheism has just one tenet, the denial of the existence of any God”

            Not quite. It’s a lack of belief in a god, not necessarily a denial of one.

          • namelessghost

            Atheists have no religion. In what way is speaking out against religious proselytizing in public schools the same thing as proselytizing religion?

            They’re not saying “Don’t believe in any gods.”

          • Slidellman4life

            Atheists have no religion.

            Then explain the church.

          • Ronald Carter

            What church?

          • namelessghost

            What church?

            Now please explain how speaking out against religious proselytizing in public schools the same thing as proselytizing religion.

          • Slidellman4life
          • TheKingOfRhye

            I’ve been an atheist for more than half my life, and I’ve never heard of that one. There can be, and are, atheist churches and religions, (that one’s far from the only one….Unitarian Universalism, not necessarily atheist, but atheists are part of it…even the Church of Satan and that Satanic Temple bunch that seems to pop up in a story here once in a while) but atheism in and of itself is not a religion.

          • namelessghost

            I’m unfamiliar with that organization. As far as I can tell, there is no physical “church” building. Apparently, this so-called “church” exists solely to ordain atheists so that they may legally perform ceremonies previously performed by religious clergy.

          • The Skeptical Chymist

            If atheists were proselytizing their religion in schools, that would be illegal. Like you, I would stand against it. I have yet to hear of a school inviting an atheist to speak about how religion is nonsensical, or to hear of a coach telling his athletes they’re wasting their time with prayers, etc. Avoiding addressing these issues by omitting prayer from the school is not the same as proselytizing for atheism.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Atheism isn’t a religion.

            “Until you can prove God doesn’t exist, you merely have faith and “believe”.”

            Wrong. The people making the claim that something exists have the burden of proof. They have to prove their claim if they expect others to accept their claim as valid.

            Using your logic, until you prove all the Norse, Egyptian, Roman, Greek, Hindu etc gods & goddesses don’t exist you merely have faith and believe they don’t exist.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Christianity condones slavery.

            Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 )

            Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2 )

          • james blue

            What did I write that that responds to?

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Both testaments of the Bible condone slavery. That’s enough of a reason to reject it as a book for moral guidance.

          • teddyk kyddet

            Throw out all the paper money $$$ in your pocket because it is clearly a religious document as well as a government document. Next time you go to the store, bring your bag of shells.

          • james blue

            Isn’t that why the FFRF (or whatever group it was) tried to get it of the money?

          • PumperPickle

            In all fairness.. It’s not religious, it is deism. Just because it says ‘god’ on it, does not make it religious. The courts have ruled on this constantly and have all come to the same conclusion. Either way, I prefer credit/debit cards, thanks.

          • teddyk kyddet

            Sorry to burst your bubble but it doesn’t say “god”, it says “God” referring to God as thee God which is the same God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. I call him Lord, King, Ruler, Pantocrator, JESUS.

          • PumperPickle

            If that were the case, then it would be illegal.

          • namelessghost

            Sorry to burst your bubble, but it doesn’t say “God”, it says “GOD”.

          • teddyk kyddet

            You are correct. But let me ask all the unbelievers something. How can you in good or slight moral concise use anything that gives reference or recognition to God, GOD, or god and live with yourself? On a separate subject, I was watching a news clip on CNN tonight about ISIS in Raqa Syria where they beat women for not covering up and killed gays for being gay and rapped and enslaved little girls. Why dont you talk all this atheistic garbage to the Moslems? Afraid you may loose your heads and find out there is a GOD?

          • namelessghost

            We are bombarded with references to your god on a daily basis. Of course, I’d rather that all Americans were represented equally by our government, but I’m going to continue using our currency regardless. Why shouldn’t I? Do you think my lack of belief in your god makes me unworthy of my natural born American citizenship?

            Persecution of women, gays or minorities by anyone, anywhere, is reprehensible. Do you disagree? What makes you think I wouldn’t speak out against it?

            The reason you don’t see atheists speaking out against Islamic indoctrination in our public schools isn’t because we’re afraid of being decapitated by Muslims… it’s because it isn’t happening.

          • Slidellman4life

            But religion has no business in any affairs of government.

            According to whom? The Constitution doesn’t say so. And that letter written by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists? You know, the one SCOTUS used as the springboard for the unconstitutional ruling that said churches are not supposed to be involved in government matters?

            You actually read the letter, right? If so, then you are aware Jefferson’s intent was the exact opposite: He did not think government should be involved in church matters. Which, in light of the First Amendment, only makes sense.

        • james blue

          So if this principle happened to be a Muslim and he was inviting imams into school you’d defend it under the first amendment?

          • The Last Trump

            Yeah, freedom means freedom. You don’t get to pick and choose.
            And ban things you don’t agree with. Communists and fascists do that.

          • james blue

            Thanks for answering, but I did ask a different person.

          • The Last Trump

            Get a room then.
            Public forum junior. That’s how it works.

          • james blue

            Didn’t say you couldn’t opine, but unless you are him you cannot answer for him.

          • The Last Trump

            Can’t I?
            Just did.

          • namelessghost

            No, you didn’t. You answered for yourself.

          • George T

            The Last Trump: Yes, like freedom of speech including the right to yell *fire* in a crowded theater. You can do it, but there are repercussions. In this case the principal is violating conduct restrictions based on national law.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            Great. So you should have no problem with gay marriage, then.

          • Ronald Carter

            ZING!
            And WHAT a zing, too.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            Haha, thanks 🙂

      • bowie1

        I follow the Canadian Constitution and when I was in elementary school we sang O Canada (which still has the line God keep our land glorious and free), said the Lord’s Prayer and read a short passage from a Gideons New Testament. That was from 1958-1966. In High School it was a moment of silence.

        • Frank Dorka

          So, they respected a persons beliefs after you got to High School?

          • bowie1

            They probably did anyway. There was an IVCF (Intervarsity Christian Fellowship) club there for those interested in that extracurricular activity, something which seems to be challenged nowadays in some US Schools. I don’t know what the current situation is in Canada.

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        The Paris Peace Treaty of 1783: Click to read

        The Paris Peace Treaty was the document which formally ended the Revolution and granted the United States independence from Great Britain. In a real sense, the United States formally became a nation on September 3, 1783.

        When the United States became a nation, it was done in the “name of the most holy and undivided Trinity.” The preamble to this Treat states it is based upon the “Holy and undivided Trinity.” The concept of the holy Trinity is unique to Christianity. This statement means the United States was founded on the Christian faith.

        • Rob T

          Funny how they ditched that when they wrote the Constitution. Sorry.

        • TheKingOfRhye

          2 days and no one’s brought up the Treaty of Tripoli in response to that?

    • PumperPickle

      Atheism is not a religion, and they aren’t promoting atheism, they are promoting secularism.

      • bowie1

        A technicality. It comes to down to how the world is seen – with or without God.

      • The Last Trump

        Absolute nonsense.
        It’s a belief system based on faith. A religion.
        Let me know when you can prove God doesn’t actually exist.
        Then we’ll talk.

        • james blue

          Other than denying any God exists, what belief “system” is there to Atheism?

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Atheists don’t deny god exists. Atheists say they don’t believe a god exists because they have seen no evidence for a god.

            Theists can prove atheists are wrong by presenting evidence for a god/goddess.

          • james blue

            You are confusing atheist with agnostics

          • TheKingOfRhye

            You can be both.

        • George T

          The Last Trump:

          It’s a belief system based on faith. A religion.

          Incorrect (^_^)

          Let me know when you can prove God doesn’t actually exist.

          No atheist has claimed to be able to do what you ask. Your post is a Straw Man fallacy.

        • C_Alan_Nault

          Atheism is a non-belief ( not a belief ) based on the lack of evidence for any god.

          If you have evidence for god, you can prove every atheist is mistaken. Go ahead.

      • Slidellman4life

        What they are promoting is a godless society.

        • C_Alan_Nault

          As opposed to a society with god? One where we kill homosexuals, adulterers, women who weren’t virgins on their wedding night, people who worship a different god, people who worship no god?

          Oh, and we can own slaves.. both testaments condone slavery.

          • Slidellman4life

            That would be Islam. Not Christianity. Your ignorance and hatred is showing.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Apparently you haven’t actually read the Bible. Your ignorance is showing.

            Maybe you don’t read it & instead let your pastor tell you what it says. If that’s the case, you can be sure your pastor won’t tell you about all the nasty parts in the Bible.

            Here are the Bible passages proving all the claims I made about the Bible:

            Kill:

            – homosexuals

            “If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13)

            – adulterers

            “If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 )

            – women who weren’t virgins on their wedding night

            But if this charge is true (that she wasn’t a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father’s house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21)

            – people who worship a different god

            If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 )

            Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5)

            – people who worship no god

            They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)

            Slavery:

            Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 )

            Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2)

          • Slidellman4life

            1) The Old Testament scripture references apply to the Jews, not Christians.

            2) The New Testament references are not King James, which makes all the difference in the world. You see, King James uses the word, “servant, ” not “slave ” as others do. Servant indicates voluntary servitude. Slave does the opposite. Which is why I prefer King James.

            FAIL.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Whether the scriptures apply to Jews or Christians isn’t the point. The point is the passages demand killing people for the reasons listed. You don’t have an issue with such immoral laws?

            Also, since the Bible tells us Jesus was sent here only for the Jews ( Matthew 15:34 24 He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”).

            So to be a TRUE Christian, you would have to be Jewish and then convert to Christianity.

            As for your weak argument that the King James version uses a different word than slave, it doesn’t change the fact that they are talking about slaves.

            Can you point out the passage in the Bible that condemns slavery?

          • Slidellman4life

            “Whether the scriptures apply to Jews or Christians isn’t the point.”

            Of course not, to an anti-Christian bigot. Nothing you say here is relevant.

            And if you can’t tell the difference between slaves and servants, even after that difference has been explained to you, then you are an imbecile.

            Go away.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Anti-Christian bigot? Don’t believe Christians have any special status to me, I view all religions as ridiculous.

            You forgot to point out a Bible passage that condemns slavery.

            Here are some that condone slavery:

            You may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46)

            When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-2)

        • PumperPickle

          So.. I am promoting a godless society by posting the definitions of words on the internet?

    • namelessghost

      Fired from what?

    • MountainDewFan4

      What the atheists are promoting is something called Secularism. “the principle of the separation of government institutions and persons mandated to represent the state from religious institutions and religious dignitaries.”

      Promoting atheism would be if they asked the principal to say “God Does Not Exist” every morning.
      All they are asking him to do is say NOTHING one way or another about any religion or religious belief.

  • Sharon_at_home

    What do the students say? Do they object to the prayers etc.? Also the article said that the Principal ENCOURAGES the students: isn’t that what we’re supposed to do is encourage students to look at every thing as a possible learning curve? The students are quite able to make this decision for themselves. And Parents were never mentioned in the article either. What do they think of the Principal’s methods? Shouldn’t the people who are involved in the activity (and their parents) be the ones to say yea or nay to this?

    • Frank Dorka

      Maybe atheists should not have to pay taxes that teach your Christian children?

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        Maybe Christians should not pay taxes that support your atheist view.

        • Frank Dorka

          Tell me when, where or how they have ever done that? Can you?

        • james blue

          Other than not believing in any God what is an “atheist view”?

      • teddyk kyddet

        Its funny how you bring taxes into this. Nobody likes to pay taxes but the Lord Jesus did say “render to Ceasar what is Ceasar’s” meaning for us to pay our taxes. ON THE OTHER HAND…..Most Anarchists who dont believe in paying taxes also dont believe in God.

        • Slidellman4life

          The taxes thing is a red herring.

          The fact of the matter is the FFRF likes to stick their nose into things, citing the “concerns” of an anonymous individual, who never comes forward, leaving one to wonder if this person is a coward or if they even exist.

        • james blue

          “Most Anarchists who dont (sic) believe in paying taxes also dont (sic) believe in God”

          Got anything to back that up?

    • james blue

      If this principle happened to be a Muslim and he was inviting imams into school would you still defend him “encouraging”?

  • Grace Kim Kwon

    All students need Christianity for the truth, salvation, and morality. The government should pay for all private schools instead of unconditionally taking the side of one particular ideology of atheism. It’s been so unfair.

    • Frank Dorka

      I hope you are kidding, right? Do you know how “Christian only” you sound? There are people, (better than you) that do not have to believe in a god, and they are better Americans as well.

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        You’re not better then anyone sir – so get a life, were taking our schools back.

        • Frank Dorka

          As far as I can tell, the Christians have been in charge of public education all along. That is why it is failing. Where does it fail the fastest? In states where religion is the dominating force. You have only yourselves to blame.

          • teddyk kyddet

            They haven’t been in charge of it……THEY STARTED IT! Harvard 1638, Yale 1701, Princeton 1746, Dartmouth 1754, Columbia, William and Mary, Rutgers, Brown & UPenn and so on.

          • Frank Dorka

            Public Education. K-12. Get it? Payed for by all taxpayers…even atheists.

          • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

            Since the federal dept. of education has signed into law by President Carter it has become the dept. of indoctrination.

          • Slidellman4life

            That is so hilarious it almost doesn’t deserve a response.

            It’s not Christians that removed God from public schools. It’s not Christians that removed corporal punishment from same. Do not even try to pin that on them.

            No, there is a direct link between the above and the increase of school-related shootings. It’s been 31 years since I was a public school student, and such incidents were so rare they were an anomaly when I left.

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        You are wrong. Pagans do evil out of ignorance and illiteracy. Secular Westerners do evil knowingly because the West was a Christendom before. Christian Americans are the only good Americans; secular ones support blasphemy and infanticide and suicide and sexual immorality. There hasn’t been discovered exception to that yet. It is wrong to support abortion and sexual immorality. You need Christianity for salvation and also for your conscience to function properly. (John ch. 3)

        • George T

          Grace Kim Kwon: Stop bearing false witness (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Why are you laughing? Read the Holy Bible and learn your own history.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: Try reading more that the fictional Christian bible and really learn American history (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            America is a mere junk if it has no Christianity. You are another proof of the reality.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: Stop forcing slavery, incest, and rape on American children using your immoral religion (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The Holy Bible prohibit those and the Christians oppose those. The Western culture has only blasphemy, infanticide, disrespect of parents, and sexual immorality apart from Christianity. You guys need the Holy Bible to be human again.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            The Holy Bible prohibit those

            I’m pretty sure I’ve warned you about bearing false witness. Stop lying (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The Holy Bible tells us not to become any man’s slave. All the slaves who read the Holy Bible obtained freedom. You secular Westerners are persecuting the Christians because you hate them for bringing racial equality upon the earth. I prefer racist Westerners over perv Westerners, if I could have a choice. Racists leave us colored people alone but the perv Westerners and their mimickers corrupt the children. You need to read the Holy Bible to beat the evil slave owners; it’s the only way. The mankind has no weapon other than the Holy Bible against villains’ slavery. Christianity alone teaches sexual purity while secular West is oppressing mankind with mentally-ill sexual immorality. No submission to your Sodomic culture. No slavery to the well-fed rich. Never again. I won’t need your stupid apologies 100 years later. Stop your oppression NOW.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            Racists leave us colored people alone but the pervs corrupt the children.

            Painfully false and baseless assertion.

            I have to ask, did somebody do something to you in the past? It sounds like you’re harboring a lot of resentment that leads you to make broad, sweeping, slanderous claims about large groups of people based on race and belief.

            You need to read the Holy Bible to beat the evil slave owners

            You really need to stop telling people what to do.

            Stop oppression NOW.

            This statement I agree with! Let’s oppose religious fascists and tyrants from all faiths! How dare they impose and oppress!

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Secular Westerners must stop attacking Christianity; it’s like seeing men who attack their own conscience. People need Biblical instructions, otherwise, they hurt themselves and the defenseless. Christianity is good and moral and life-saving all over the world; secularism is immoral and oppressive and it conducts live human experiments. You need Christianity for morality. You hate Christianity only because you desire to continue the godless evil and immorality upon the earth.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: What happened in your past to fill you with such bigotry, anger, hatred, and fear?

            You hate Christianity because you desire to continue evil and immorality upon the earth.

            I don’t hate Christianity. It’s just a mythology. I oppose people who try to force their mythology on others, like you’re doing.

            I also want to state clearly that I don’t judge all Christians by your spiteful postings. I know from my parents and Christian upbringing that there are many good, kind Christians. I really wish you’d stop besmirching my memories of Christian life with your rage filled sadness.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            God bless you, Sister Grace, for your beautiful words of wisdom tonight. You are a light in the darkness.

          • George T

            WorldGoneCrazy:

            God bless you, Sister Grace, for your beautiful words of wisdom tonight.

            Beautiful little lies. False witness. Funny (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Thank you so much for your kind words. I’m sorry for my harsh words to George here, but secular Americans and their mental slaves are not illiterate poor starving pagans but only well-fed bored ungrateful parent-shaming rotten kids who bite the merciful feeding hands of the Church. These rotten descendants will only ruin the global children at this rate. I remember the noble Christian Americans of yesteryears. Today’s Americans got to be made respect their parents and their grandparents again. Secular youth also disgrace the dead people by the stupid zombie stuff. Zombies are far more righteous than these liberals who kill human babies and sell their body parts. Someone has to point it out somewhere, I thought.

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            Your words are not harsh – George is an insidious subversive troll who has no life. You speak the truth and the Truth offends. Keep up the great work, Grace!

          • Ronald Carter

            George is a breath of fresh air, and makes excellent arguments.

          • George T

            WorldGoneCrazy: Ad hominem. Can’t address my points, so you claim that I’m an internet troll.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: I don’t appreciate your slanderous, hate filled mischaracterization. Please stop lying about me. It only shows how spite and pain have filled your heart.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Man up. You guys are too feminized by the feminists. Also, you keep bullying the Christians even in the Christian news site because you never suffered real bullying or a hard time. Bullies bully because they never know what it means to be victims. Your generation is sick spoiled. Learn how the Frence massacred the Huguenots and feel sorry about the crimes instead of persecuting the Christians. Liberty is for God’s truth, not for bowing to West’s secular filth. Not then, not now. You guys never learn anything from history.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            Bullies keep bullying because they never know what it means to be victims

            …which is why I’m not bullying. I’ve been bullied. I’m simply correcting erroneous information. For example, you always post a lot of incorrect information to deal with.

            You guys never learn anything from history.

            The anger and sadness filled pot calling the kettle (me) black.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Why did you keep smiling? Read the comment section. You are the one who insulted my religion first. You guys even don’t have any logic or objectivity.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: You slandered and lied about my country first. I’ve been pointing out your errors and correcting them. Sometimes I smile because your absurd replies amuse me (^_^)

            You guys even don’t have any logic or objectivity.

            We do. Your prejudice (pre-judgement) of us wont let you see anything but lies tho. It’s like you’re wearing glasses that color everything you see with hate and fear.

            BTW, I’m still willing to discuss whatever happened to you in the past to cause all of this hate and pain to fill your heart.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The Huguenots are what is great about France. Never forget. America exists for Christianity because Christianity created the nation. America’s Founding Fathers would abhor any descendants like you who insult Christianity. You guys are not true Americans; you guys have no sane ideals apart from Christianity but just immoral dystopia. The land should belong to other people because it is God’s. It’s a fact that secular Westerners must stop attacking the Christianity. Christianity brings salvation to mankind and rescued Europe and America. The West has no conscience apart from Christianity. Something went terribly wrong in the last 3-4 decades in the for-ever well-fed Western nations. Water pollution, maybe, and you guys got a full stomach and a false sense of peace and are slandering the noble ones, as written in the Book of Jude.

            Don’t break the 5th commandment so much. You guys are better-off only because of your hard-working Christian ancestors. Don’t hate truths and facts. Don’t repay the good with evil. We Mongoloids suffered racism at the hands of the superior Westerners but their religion was astonishing good and had a lot of things to learn from; I didn’t expect to be bullied by their descendants because of my Christian faith in the 21st century. Global Christians have to speak up for the Christian Westerners to share in their troubles because we have received countless excellent things from the Christian missionaries from the West. Atheists only killed and polluted humanity and the planet. Not to submitting to the West’s Sodomic pervs and holding onto the Holy Bible is the key to retain freedom for all in the West, as always in human history. You need the Holy Bible and Christianity to get saved and be good.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: Blah blah blah…

            Something went terribly wrong in the last 3-4 decades in the for-ever well-fed Western nations.

            I’ll agree with this. Jerry Falwell and various other Christian leaders started urging people to interject their religion into government. Before that people considered each others religious rights and freedoms.

            We Mongoloids suffered racism at the hands of the superior Westerners

            Self-imposed racism. Assuming that Westerners are superior. I think you are my equal, and sister in humanity. I also think you’ve suffered some severe trauma in your past that you need to deal with. I’m willing to help if you’re ever interested.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The Western nations need Judeo-Christian values. Otherwise, you guys have no morality whatsoever. The Founding Fathers did not mention morality because they expected all Americans to be Christian or at least be respectful for Christianity. School rules(Constitution) do not have to say what the people are. No one imagined that Americans would deliberately and shamelessly seek the evil(sexual immorality) instead of the good(Christianity) after 200 years of independence. Unified Israel even lasted 500 years.

            You are not genuine. If you consider me as even your fellow human being, you’d never come to me insulting my good religion which I cherish more than anything else in this world. You say people need to be free from religion, but what you secular Westerners have as the core value is only abortion and sexual chaos and insane addiction as today’s society has proven. You actually value and respect no one and nothing but yourself; you just want to watch the religious people suffer because you cannot bully the colored people for being colored anymore and are being bored.

            No respect for God = No respect for any one or anything. I hope you’d face this reality and admit your own sinfulness. The fact is that the Westerners were indeed very powerful and superior and racist; it’s okay with me because every human being is racist, and the Westerners of yesteryears at least pretended to be Christian and did not blaspheme maliciously or force and fund sexual depravity. You need to be Christian to really help anyone. You need salvation by repenting of your blasphemy and believing in Jesus. Man cannot be good apart from God.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: Blah blah blah…

            If you consider me as even your fellow human being, you’d never come to me insulting my good religion which I cherish more than anything else in this world.

            That’s because I respect people who earn respect. A religion, only being a social meme, is incapable of earning my respect. I love my freedom from your religion, but you don’t seem to respect what I love or me as a human in that regard.

            You say people need to be free from religion

            No, I never said that. Don’t bear false witness.

            No respect for God = No respect for anyone or anything.

            A baseless logical leap on your part.

            Again, I feel terrible about whatever has driven you to this level of hatred and fear. What can I do to help you recover?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            All humans must be respected and cherished regardless because of being created in God’s image; it’s the Judeo-Christian teaching. You don’t respect Christianity or Christians because you desire to continue doing evil. Freedom from Christianity means slavery to sin. Atheism kills unwanted children in wombs and kills believers when it gains enough strength. Death is atheism’s sole desire. (Psalm ch. 14) You don’t realize things because you have only short history, which has been well-protected by the Protestant Church at that. Christianity brings life while atheism brings death. (John. ch. 10) The Western atheism also forces sexual immorality. People have rights to the God-given morality.

            Yes, atheists claim “freedom” from religion for everyone and oppress the Christians everywhere. Because you have no message of life, you must not silence the good Christians who provide the vital life-giving Gospel. People need the Lord to get saved and be free. Atheists proved that they respect no human life, and it is true that humans respect no one and nothing if they don’t respect God; today’s secular America is the proof. You guys are slaves to the 1% super rich who demand sexual depravity. If you grant my one wish, stop attacking Christianity and read the Holy Bible to gain understanding. Your hatred against Christianity is the reason of my grief. I know you don’t care a bit, but you must fear God to obtain life. (Proverbs ch. 1)

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            All humans must be respected and cherished regardless because of being
            created in God’s image; it’s the Judeo-Christian teaching. You don’t
            respect Christianity or Christians because you desire to continue doing
            evil.

            You just conflated two different things. There are many Christian that I respect. Not because they’re Christian, but because they’re respectable people. Your mythology has done nothing to earn my respect.

            The Western atheism also forces sexual immorality.

            Incorrect. Bearing false witness again.

            Yes, atheists claim “freedom” from religion for everyone and oppress the Christians everywhere.

            Stop lying. Atheist religious rights are freedom *from* other religions. Your freedom *from* religion (if you lived in The US) would be a freedom *from* having to adhere to Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, Norse, or any other religions practices.

            Your hatred against Christianity is the reason of my grief.

            Do you hate Buddhism?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            You don’t respect Christianity because your lifestyle is immoral and because you desire to continue blasphemy and infanticide and immorality in the society. The desire for sin is in your blood streams. (Psalm ch. 14) The Holy Bible is factual and utmost realistic. You kept saying “false witnesses” because the Judeo-Christian values taught you that honesty has values. Your Pre-christian savage ancestors were illiterate and didn’t even know lying was wrong. The Church educated them to be proper. Today, the Western atheists lie by saying nothingness created everything and force public schools to adhere exclusively to that lie.

            The Western atheists single out Christians for attacks because they are scared of the Muslims and the Eastern religions do not condemn atheists’ evil as the Holy Bible does. Untamed( Bible-believing Evangelical) Christians are true and intelligent but gentle and never retaliate and keep blessing everyone because of the Bible doctrines; that’s why the Western atheists bully only the untamed Christians. Bullies prey on easy targets. Tamed ones are not real Christian and they are under your control anyway.

            I do not hate anyone. You keep calling me hateful because I point out atheism’s crimes. Telling the truth is a form of true love. Asian Buddhists massacred the Christians and the atrocities lasted for centuries, but they did it out of ignorance. The Westerners who attack Christianity do the evil against the Christians with full knowledge, and that’s why you guys are the worst species that mankind has ever encountered. It is also a treason against your Christian forefathers who toiled for your safety and happiness. Happy is a man whose descendants are not today’s Western secularists. What a tragedy to work hard and only have immoral thugs who slander the forefathers as one’s own descendants. You must respect your parents. ( Exodus ch. 20)

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            You don’t respect Christianity because your lifestyle is immoral and because you desire to continue blasphemy and infanticide and immorality in the society.

            False accusation. I’ve already stated why I don’t respect Christianity.

            You kept saying “false witnesses” because the Judeo-Christian values taught you that unconditional honesty has any value.

            Incorrect. I’m using your terminology in an attempt to get you to pay attention. Apparently it’s not working.

            You keep calling me hateful because I point out atheism’s crimes.

            No. I say that because your posts read as both sad and angry at the same time. Maybe you’re not aware of the tone of your own words.

            Telling the truth is a form of true love.

            I’ve just told you the truth, again.

          • Bob Johnson

            You have said several variations of, “Death is atheism’s sole desire.” (taken directly from previous post)

            Your understanding of atheism might improve if you read some of the works of Albert Camus, Bertrand Russell, or Sam Harris.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Other nations know atheism much better than the Americans and the British do. You guys have been living in Neverland and are naive because you are thoroughly spoiled by the Church’s presence. If atheists had anything neutral and fair, they’d have left the Christians alone, but they never. Atheists hate Christianity because Christianity is the truth and moral, and you can’t stand the sight of crosses and churches and have to attack the believers in any way possible. You also believe in manual reduction of human population and in live human experiments. Normal humans do not attack the ancestors or their religions, but secular Westerners do because their hatred against Christianity is too intense. It is tragedy for the world to have to see the nudist Somic generation attacking their own good parents or ancestors in the West. You guys need Christianity to be moral; you have nothing good on your own.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Why are all your comments deleted? My comments are answers to a man named George. Do you have several accounts under different names? Why don’t you American men play fair nowadays? What’s wrong with you guys? Poor your fathers. Americans don’t have honesty or fairness apart from Christianity. All they think about is money, winning, and popularity. It’s pathetic. America needs Christianity to do what is right.

          • Bob Johnson

            Grace, my comments have not been deleted. It appears like the mods have banned and deleted George T’s comments as ALL of his comments have disappeared. I have only this one account and publish everything public under my name.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            I see. I’m sorry I thought you were George T and that you had deleted your own comments uploaded under his name. Christianity is vital, life-giving, good, and pure. Stop attacking Christianity or the Church because many of your ancestors and forefathers and parents got saved and immensely benefited by it. You guys haven’t been savage illiterate pagan at least for 1,600 years solely because of Christianity. ALL your philosophers wouldn’t have anything worthy to hear and would have stayed average if your civilization was without the Holy Bible. You guys are cheering only evil ones among the philosophers because you are too well-fed by the Church; you just want some strange warped ideas only to make yourselves godlessly autonomous in God’s created world. If you atheists had anything really good, you must leave Christians alone in the Western nations. All you offer is death and despair and suicide and sexual depravity because that’s the Western atheism. You need life, and the life is in Jesus Christ alone. Repent of your blasphemy as you should, to be forgiven and get saved. (John ch. 1-3)

          • WorldGoneCrazy

            There are a lot of sock puppets running around on this site, Grace: one or two extremist atheists, with multiple screen names – they are real zombies when it comes to their thinking.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Thank you. The atheists come to Christian sites and attack the Christians viciously. They can’t play fair. This is not anything American. American men are famous for being honest and fair. At least they strived for honesty and fairness because of being raised Christian. Secular American who attack Christianity are not American but invaders and parasites regardless of their origins. They don’t have American traits at all.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Yes, WGC, zombie is another thing I really think young people must give up. They disgrace the dead people like they disgrace their own parents and ancestors; the live liberals are far worse than zombies morally because live liberals kill unwanted children in wombs and sell their body parts and enforce Sodomy( endorsement of homosexuality) upon everyone. America has no morality apart from Christianity.

    • james blue

      So you are a theocratic socialist

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        USA is a theocracy. Read your independence document. Americans are to submit to God alone. My point for school matters is that it’s not fair for the government to just support public schools which are under the monopoly of atheism. Public schools exist to make children be able to read the Holy Bible, but now they are all under atheism. If US government would support atheism, they must support Christianity, too. They should pay for all Christian schools without demaning Christians to change the doctrines. This is a real fairness in democracy.

        • PumperPickle

          “My point for school matter is that it’s not fair for the government to
          just support public schools which are under the monopoly of atheism.”

          Correction, secularism.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Secularism = atheism + sexual immorality. Communism = atheism + massacre.

          • PumperPickle

            Care to show me what dictionary you used to gain those definitions?

            Also, Communism = atheism + guns + Russians + Stalin’s Mustache + massacre.

            I guess guns, Russians, and mustaches are evil to huh?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Observations. Atheists need Christians as cancer needs a body to mar. Christians do not need anyone but only Israel. Christians help everyone by teaching God’s truth. You guys corrupted a Christendom. Russia understood that and bounced back to the Orthodox Christianity 25 years ago. It seems it’s Sodomic West’s turn to be evil and get a hard lesson. You guys really didn’t need to go bad. Boredom is a horrible woe in Sodom. Empires perish but the Word of God is forever. ( Isaiah ch. 40)

          • PumperPickle

            “Observations. Atheists need Christians as cancer needs a body to mar.”

            So, you are comparing atheists to cancer now? Listen to yourself.

            “Christians do not need anyone but only Israel. Christians rescue everyone by teaching God’s truth.”

            According to their religion.

            “You guys corrupted the finest Christendom. Russia understood that and bounced back to the Orthodox Christianity 25 years ago.”

            I didn’t corrupt anything, I’m on the internet having a discussion on an internet comment section. If you are seriously that insecure, then I worry for you.

            “It seems it’s Sodomic West’s turn to be evil and get the hard lesson. So
            sad. What empire was heard of living for sexual depravity in all of the
            human history?”

            sexual depravity only according to your own religion.

            I see you still haven’t shown me that dictionary to prove your definition is correct..

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Read the Holy Bible. You won’t find anything worthwhile apart from the Word of God.

          • PumperPickle

            I do not consider the Bible to be the word of god.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: Judge not, lest ye be judged.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Yours is illiteracy. Read all of Matthew ch. 5-7. Jesus told us to judge with righteousness.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon: I really don’t care about your mythology, just like you think Islam or Buddhism are untrue mythologies (^_^)

        • james blue

          The 1st amendment disagrees with you that the USA is a theocracy.

          Can you provide one example of a public school teaching children that there is no God?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The creators of the Constitution expected every American to be Christian or at least respect Christianity. They had no other in mind. They opposed any denomination’s monopoly and suppression of not-membership to a church, and that’s it. Being Non-christian was considered as barbarism to American forefathers. Democracy and constitutions and amendments are junks if the people are atheistic and baby-killing and sexually immoral. Search atheism’s atrocities in US public schools. Teaching of evolution is, for one. They must teach Biblical creationism, too, to be fair and correct.

        • George T

          Grace Kim Kwon: The Declaration is not the founding document of our governmental structure. Stop bearing false witness (^_^)

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Constitution is a set of classroom rules, the Independence is the heart of America. The Founding Fathers expected all Americans to be Christian-educated and civilized. You are just ignorant of the USA.

          • George T

            Grace Kim Kwon:

            You are just ignorant of the USA.

            The pot just called the kettle black (^_^)

    • PumperPickle

      “All students need Christianity for the truth, salvation, and morality.”

      Truth about what is real about the world is gained by observation and experimentation. Faith is belief, which is anything but truth.

      Salvation is freedom from something. If anything, atheism is salvation from religion.

      Morality is an invented human construct. It is our basis for how we treat each other, and is different for everyone, even the religious. There are so many different religions out there with different moral rules, and people pick and choose what religion they want to follow, just like atheists pick and choose their morals. In other words, we are no more ‘moral’ than the religious.

      “The government should pay for all private schools and homeschooling
      instead of unconditionally taking the side of one particular ideology of
      atheism.”

      The government has not taken any sides on atheism, it is a secular government.

      “It’s been so unfair to the people.”

      It is perfectly fair. All religions get equal treatment, even lack of religion.

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        Atheism is evil. All atheism supports infanticide and suicide, but the Western atheism also spreads sexual immorality. Morality is decreed by the one true living God whom the Holy Bible teaches. Atheists have no morality and kill fellow human beings treating them as sub-human. The Westerners are being naive about atheism because they have been always well-fed by the Christian Church and were never ruled by atheism. The Western secularism means atheism plus blasphemy and sexual immorality. You feel fair because you are the bullies’ side and not the bullied. Everything is rosy for those who exploit others as long as they can exploit. You need Christianity for salvation, morality, and fairness.

        • PumperPickle

          Everything you said is just flat out wrong. I don’t even know where to begin.

          Okay, here goes..

          “Atheism is evil.”

          No, it is the lack of belief in god/gods.

          “All atheism supports infanticide and suicide, but the Western atheism also spreads sexual immorality.”

          Atheism does not support those things, it is a lack of belief in god/gods.

          “Morality is decreed by the one true living God whom the Holy Bible teaches.”

          According to your religion..

          “Atheists have no morality and kill fellow human beings treating them as sub-human.”

          We choose what moral principles to follow, just like you choose your religion. Pot calling the kettle black I see?

          “The Westerners are being naive about atheism because they have been
          always well-fed by the Christian Church and were never ruled by atheism.”

          I am not being fed anything from the Christian Church that I know of. Please elaborate. I agree though that we were never ruled by atheism.

          “The Western secularism means atheism plus blasphemy and sexual immorality.”

          No, it means all religions + atheism and people’s freedom to determine for themselves what constitutes as ‘sexual immorality’.

          “You feel fair because you are the bullies’ side and not the bullied.”

          Nobody is being bullied when all sides are given equal treatment.

          “Everything is rosy for those who exploit others as long as they can exploit.”

          Well, if you consider the first amendment to be an exploitation, then perhaps try to get rid of it, if you can.

          “You need Christianity for salvation, morality, and fairness.”

          No, YOU need Christianity for salvation, morality, and fairness. It is clear to me that you lack the basic human intellect and empathy to gain these things on your own.

          Next..

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Read the Holy Bible if you have to time to write to me like that. The Holy Bible declares that all atheists are evil fools. And they proved their such conduct all over the world especially last century, and this century in the West. You support atheism only because you are too young and do not respect your parents and because your nation has too short history and because you do not consider that religious persecution is wrong. (Psalm ch.14, John ch. 3)

          • PumperPickle

            “The Holy Bible declares that all atheists are evil fools.”

            So.. let me get this straight.. you are trying to advertise your religion to an atheist, by first telling him that your religion says that atheists are evil fools.. great selling point you got there.

            “And they proved their such conduct all over the world especially last
            century, and this century in the West. You support atheism only because
            you are too young and do not respect your parents and your nation has
            too short history and you do not consider that bullying is wrong.”

            So.. according to you.. I do not respect my parents.. and I do not consider that bullying is wrong.. just because I don’t believe that a deity created the universe…..

            How many other things are you going to accuse people of? You make yourself sound less and less convincing every time. I’m gonna avoid religion like the plague thanks to people like you, and so are all the other atheists reading this. If anything, you are doing us a service. Thank you ^^.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            You need to repent of your sins. Blasphemy, abortion, homosexuality, transgendrism, disrespect of parents, etc. are all sins against God and all unrepentance is hell-bound; you must admit the reality. Believe in Jesus as your Lord and Saviour to get saved. Read John ch. 3 and Romans ch. 8.

          • PumperPickle

            “You need to repent of your sins.”

            You haven’t even sold me on your religion yet, and you are now telling me to repent for ‘sins’? Go back to step one.

          • Charles

            Doesn’t need to be sold.. The Lord’s grace is free…

          • PumperPickle

            That wasn’t what I meant by ‘sold’.

          • Ronald Carter

            And if you refuse it, you burn in hell. Free gifts like that are not really free.

          • Charles

            Right… Because God has been here from the beginning.. Do you think it’s possible that he has a bit more knowledge about what’s going to work, and what wont? Also, if you live in sin, the Lord is giving you nothing more than you wanted. Sin is empty.. It’s holds nothing but despair, with righteousness being the exact opposite holding truth, justice, and love. To be a servant of the Lord, he wishes us to start becoming a more righteous person according to his will (Thank you Holy Spirit!). In the Lord’s world, there will be no sin.. He will be our God, and we shall be his people. We have been given a choice.. You will have to deal with your choices. Just like we all will.

          • Theodore Fenton

            Q troll

          • Bob Johnson

            So is the Dalai Lama an evil fool? Was Confucius an evil fool? Your view that the Bible is the only path to enlightenment needs serious reconsideration.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Dalai Lama and Confucius are/were not atheist. They seek/sought the good; Jesus Christ has everything they dreamed of. The Light has come to mankind. (John ch. 1) Tibet still lacks religious freedom because of Buddhism, not just because of China’s atheism. You secular Westerners are full of false dreams about raw humanity. Be realistic. Everyone is a sinner who needs Jesus Christ for forgiveness of sins and for salvation. Jesus is the Saviour of the world. ( John ch. 3-4)

          • Bob Johnson

            The Dalai Lama is a Tibetan Buddhist monk. He is the reincarnation of the Bodhisattva of Compassion. If, as you state Tibet lacks religious freedom because of Buddhism, how can you say the Dalai Lama is good? And considering both the Dalai Lama’s comments and Buddhist philosophy, how can you claim that he is not an atheist?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            You are wrong. I never said Dalai Lama is good. (Unlike the atheists, Buddhists SEEK the good. Ancient Greeks were that way, too, like all normal average human beings would). He is a sinner who needs Jesus Christ for forgiveness of sins and for salvation. When you secular Westerners claim to be Buddhist, it’s only because Buddhism does not proclaim any clear justice upon sinful mankind. Rid of your immorality and infanticide first and then claim some religions. Buddhism does not condone the secular Western style of immorality. No religion does such thing.

          • Jolanda Tiellemans

            The Holy Bible declares that all atheists are evil fools.

            Where?

            You support atheism only because you are too young and do not respect your parents

            Again, it seems that you know every single Atheist. I’m 47, always respected my parents, still do and I support Atheism. So try again, please.

            because you do not consider that religious persecution is wrong.

            Every persecution is wrong.

          • Charles

            “It is clear to me that you lack the basic human intellect”. Says the person who believes in Evolution.

          • PumperPickle

            Evolution is a scientific theory. Not a hypothesis like religion.

          • Charles

            Yes.. It is a theory, and very bad one.. So since you have ZERO actual scientific proof of it (Evolution).. Wouldn’t you say that requires “Faith” in your belief that Evolution happened with nothing to support it?

          • PumperPickle

            A scientific theory is a collection of facts and evidence that is supported by repeatable and testable results. Evolution is demonstrably true. It is possible for genes to be modified and manipulated when an organism is born. It is the reason we all look different and have different features. We are living proof.

            If evolution weren’t true, there would be no new flu virus every year. We have hundreds of Biologists that are creating new vaccines every year to counter the flu. Are you going to tell me that all those scientists are wrong and that the flu virus is not evolving?

            Regardless, I am not a Biologist. If you are open minded and actually willing to look for more proof, you can actually look for it by asking actual scientists. Ask an actual Biologist if you want proof.

          • Charles

            Theory:

            a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained.

            Fact:
            a thing that is indisputably the case.

            There is plenty of disputes among the believers of evolution, let alone those that don’t.

            “Evolution is demonstrably true”. Do tell? There isn’t a thing you could repeat in support of evolution. There are no facts, just speculation. What’s repeatable? Turning into a cat/dog? Mutation is how they survive. Using a virus, or bacteria as an example is a road that leads nowhere. God made life on earth adaptable (He can do those kinds of things).. Nothing to see here. We have never observed anything “Evolve” or show a beneficial mutation outside a virus or bacteria… There aways seems to be a loss of information, not a gain. Again, there isn’t any evidence to support evolution. Just speculation. Sadly, scientific “Fact” in today.’s world. simply means whatever they (Scientist) agree on how to brainwash you with ridiculous idea’s like evolution.

          • George T

            Charles:

            Scientific Theory: A well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method and repeatedly tested and confirmed through observation and experimentation.

            That’s Evolution (^_^)

          • Charles

            Since you can’t observe from “4 billion” years ago.. When this (ha ha. I’m sorry.. I just can’t stop laughing) supposedly started (Our solar system that is)….. How exactly are you going to create repeatable test to “Prove” evolution.. Nothing that we’ve observed has every substantiated anything about evolution in the animal kingdom for example (Transition species).. They don’t exist.

          • George T

            Charles: Your yardstick isn’t the measure by which science operates. Try learning a little about what scientists use to verify and validate theories.

          • Charles

            What might that be.. How do they “Determine”.. Better yet.. How do they verify it?

          • George T

            Charles: I just suggested that you learn more about science. I didn’t say I was going to teach you.

            Many community colleges allow people to read their materials online and some allow people to attend classes without earning a grade. Why not take them up on these offers to better educate yourself?

          • Charles

            You know how they determine the “Fossil Layer” age.. Because they said so… You know how they determine the age of the earth? Some brilliant scientific test you say? No, no… It’s because they say so.. Even though their test have shown nothing but errors. Tell me again, how they determined that evolution took place, or anything else for mater. You should seriously educate yourself.

          • George T

            Charles:

            You know how they determine the “Fossil Layer” age.. Because they said so…

            Incorrect. This is called a Straw Man fallacy (^_^)

            You should seriously educate yourself.

            I continue to educate myself every day. You’ve apparently broken that habit a long time ago.

          • Charles

            No.. That’s correct…. That’s how it’s determined..

          • George T

            Charles: No, it’s not. Your baseless assertion can be dismissed with a baseless refutation.

          • Charles

            Tell me.. How do they determine the age of the earth?

          • George T

            Charles: There’s a Smithsonian Magazine article titled “How Do We Know the Earth Is 4.6 Billion Years Old?” among other articles that you can read about the process.

            Tell me, what does that have to do with Evolution?

          • Charles

            Whatever, I know the answer. The answer is they have no idea.. They created test that would agree with their idea’s.. They have no idea how old the earth is, it wasn’t observable to us.. Numbers that they don’t like that show up in their methods of dating (Which are horribly flawed to begin with) they throw out.. Evolution has everything to do with it.. Can’t have evolution and not have a 3 billion year cycle of random life that mutates itself from seemingly nowhere..

          • George T

            Charles: Your argument from ignorance is pointless, but amusing (^_^)

          • Charles

            You don’t have a clue what you are talking about.. They aged it with radiometric dating “Among other test (Geological, etc).. Turns out that doesn’t work because they once thought that they could age the earth based on radioactive decay.. Problem is, the Sun effects the decay rate.. So unless you were able to measure the Suns activity from the beginning (Which of course we didn’t) we have no clue.. Don’t like that answer? Talk to Standford.

          • George T

            Charles: Further validated to be far older than 6000 years by the distance of stars, red shift measurements, and other observed points of data.

            So go on, how else are you not invalidating Evolution?

          • Charles

            How exactly do you verify a distance you can’t reach. The distances are incredibly vast, we can’t verify that. I’ll put that in the dark matter files..

          • George T

            Charles: We’ve measured the speed of light and the distance required for red shift to occur.

            I know. You wont understand, and your pride will lead you to assume that I don’t understand and you’ll return to your “god of the gaps” assumption. Your willful ignorance amuses me (^_^)

          • Charles

            Look.. The “Rules” for big and small aren’t even in agreement. Relativity, and Quantum Mechanics.. God has you completely stumped.. It’s laughable…

          • George T

            Charles:

            Look.. The “Rules” for big and small aren’t even in agreement.
            Relativity, and Quantum Mechanics.. God has you completely stumped..
            It’s laughable…

            I’d assume you’d just channeled the spirit of Deepak Chopra, but he’s not dead. That word salad probably sounded coherent in your own head (^_^)

          • Ronald Carter

            Man…have you come across Oboehner? Biggest evolution hater (not just denier) I have ever seen.

          • George T

            Ronald Carter: Yup. I’ve had exchanges with Oboehner in the past. Not sure if those are his honest beliefs. Sometimes I suspect he’s just playing the contrarian.

          • Ronald Carter

            I had thought so too until I read his anti-Catholic posts, which are as hateful and ignorant as everything else.

          • PumperPickle

            You are comparing a laymans theory to a scientific theory.

            “Do tell?”

            Knowledge is earned by those who seek it. Ask a Biologist to show you proof.

            “There isn’t a thing you could repeat in support of evolution.”

            Proof?

            “Mutation is how they survive.”

            That is evolution.

            “Using a virus, or bacteria as an example is a road that leads nowhere.”

            I just gave you an example of evolution.

            “Just speculation. Sadly, scientific “Fact” in today.’s world. simply
            means whatever they (Scientist) agree on how to brainwash you with
            ridiculous idea’s like evolution.”

            So far, it sounds like only you are the one making the speculations. If you want proof, go ask a Biologist.

        • Jolanda Tiellemans

          Again, *facepalm* Seriously? Yeah of course you are.

  • Emmanuel

    Hey Atheists, Chicago had 63 people shot and killed over this 3 day weekend. If prayer, morals and standards does not fix this, how will your nothing help?

    • Frank Dorka

      Since when is it the responsibility to keep the 83% Christians in check in this country. If you cannot control your own, why should we have to? “In God We Trust” on police vehicles isn’t the work of atheists, you know.

    • james blue

      How many of the perpetrators do you think are Atheists?

      • Emmanuel

        Does it matter? This Principle is trying to help and they are trying to stop him. So, what does that group have to offer to stop the shootings.

        • james blue

          It matters if you are trying to blame atheists for the shootings.

          • Emmanuel

            When did I blame the atheists? My point was, prayer is needed and atheists are trying to stop the one thing that could help. But, atheists provide no alternatives.

          • james blue

            No doubt many of the shooters believe in God.

            I pray every day, but I don’t think it will solve anything. If you think it does then if (God forbid) you come down with a life threatening injury or disease try praying instead of seeking medical help.

            Our prisons are full of people who pray or were raised in prayer. One quote I’ve seen used by activist Atheists I happen to agree with— It’s not religion they lack, it empathy.

          • Emmanuel

            I agree, some of the shooter probably believe in God but they chose to do the wrong thing. I will pray and seek medical care because medicine is biblical. right?
            I agree with that statement, they do lack empathy. now the question becomes, when did they lose that empathy? how do they get it back? or do they still see it as immoral or moral? And what are the atheists providing to get these answers?

        • PumperPickle

          Umm, the same things all cops do to try to prevent and stop those things?

          • Emmanuel

            Many different ways to stop crime. Police force is important, education and knowledge and also prayer and hope.

    • PumperPickle

      We have morals and standards, but prayer seems rather inefficient. Why don’t you pray them back to life for us?

      • Emmanuel

        I believe that we can pray them back to life before believing that you guys have morals and standards.

        • PumperPickle

          I believe that we have morals and standards before I can believe that you can pray them back to life for us.

          After all, if we didn’t have any morals or standards, why aren’t we all out killing people and disobeying the law? If anyone is disobeying the laws here, it is the religious for trying to proselytize their religion in public schools.

          Heck, I’d believe ‘anything’ before believing praying even works at all.

          • disqus45324hd

            Call out to Jesus and he’ll show you that prayer works.

          • PumperPickle

            Are you implying I never called out for Jesus?

          • disqus45324hd

            How can you call out to Jesus and not believe in prayer?

          • George T

            disqus4532hd: When you call out and realize that you’re talking to yourself, it calls for a serious reality check.

          • PumperPickle

            I don’t know, you tell me.

          • Emmanuel

            This is grade level here but see my point.
            So you get your moral compass from our laws, ok and I understand. Now, the law does not say cheating on your spouse is against the law, are you ok with being cheated on or cheating?
            if it’s not a law, then it’s OK? Don’t get angry when your spouse goes out on you.
            It’s not ok in the bible, it’s a sin. Does is happen in the church? yup, but it’s still wrong. Should christians not do it? yes. It’s wrong no matter how you slice the pie.
            Going back to this story, we are trying to show the kids that this is wrong. It’s wrong legally and also morally and spiritually. We are trying to tell the kids to look to God for guidance and for direction through prayer.
            Now where is the harm in this? What ever your religion or belief, go to that higher source for guidance and direction.

          • PumperPickle

            “So you get your moral compass from our laws”

            No, I get it from my empathy for other human beings.

          • Emmanuel

            But, if your empathy is different than mine, who’s right? why have laws?
            Hitler’s empathy was not like yours, he was right and you are wrong. Jesus had great empathy but many don’t follow his lead. was he wrong then?

          • PumperPickle

            I don’t care. If Hitler thinks he was right, and I think I am right, then we are against each other. Simple as that.

          • Emmanuel

            So everyone has their own “right.” Why have laws, limits and wrongs. So, my right, Biblical, should not bother you.

          • PumperPickle

            “So everyone has their own “right.””

            Exactly. Now you are getting it.

            “Why have laws, limits and wrongs.”

            Because certain actions affect others in various different ways. Would you like to live in a world where stealing is okay? It all boils down to power. Those who like to steal don’t have the power, but we do. Thus, we can enforce those laws for our own best interest.

            “So, my right, Biblical, should not bother you.”

            It doesn’t bother me as long as you don’t try to shove it down my throat.

      • The Last Trump

        Oh?
        Keep your secular “morals and standards”.
        In case you hadn’t noticed, your brand of morality isn’t faring too well.

        • George T

          The Last Trump: It’s worked for over 200 years.

          • Slidellman4life

            Troll. Flagged.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: I sincerely urge you to stop bearing false witness. Just because you don’t like what I’m saying doesn’t mean that I’m a troll (^_^)

          • Slidellman4life

            When you say something you know to be false with the intent of inciting anger and/or responses, you are trolling.

            Own it.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: I haven’t said anything false. I’m amused that you’re getting angry tho (^_^)

          • Ronald Carter

            You do that all the time yourself.

        • PumperPickle

          It’s working fine for me. Maybe you just need to practice more.

      • disqus45324hd

        Perhaps their prayers have been answered and have a new life in Heaven with Jesus Christ.

        • PumperPickle

          Well until any testable results are given that prove that prayer is a causation (and not merely a correlation) of supernatural phenomena in the universe, the only thing you have to rely on is faith.

          • disqus45324hd

            The Holy Bible is full of testimonials. And yes you have to have faith.

  • calduncan

    Do the obvious thing: Play the race card. If the lefties can do, so can we.

    • Frank Dorka

      You are already used to playing the religious card, aren’t you?

      • teddyk kyddet

        No religious card. Religion killed the Son of God. Let us play the card of history shall we? YOUR DEAL FRIEND!

        • Frank Dorka

          First you have to believe in a god and then the fact that he had a son, right? Has nothing to do with an education.

      • Dallas

        You, sir, are the very definition of a troll.

    • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

      Great idea! I’ll do it:

      These FFRF cowards are going after this principal because he’s black. They think that black people are a push-over. It’s a completely racist ploy. They cannot bear the thought of black people who do not bow to their white superiority.

      • Frank Dorka

        Suck that stupid remark right back into your brain. There is no conflict with atheists and any race. We leave that up to the Christians.

        • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

          The FFRF is a front for white supremacist atheists who think that their white atheism is superior to black Christians’ Christianity. They think their white skin evolved from the primary goo to give them the right to rule over black school principals by reason of religion – their own atheism showing them as part of the master race that is fit to survive while they beat down the stupid and ignorant races that cling primitively to religion.

          • George T

            Martin Smit: There you go again. Lying, because you can’t address the real merits of the situation.

          • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

            George T, you racist! Now you’re defending the white atheists in their meritless fight against this black teacher! You even insinuate that their racism has merit! Take your white atheism back to France where it came from!

          • George T

            Martin Smit: Not a teacher. He’s a principal.

            You can’t even get that simple detail correct (^_^)

            Stop building Straw Man fallacies and ad hominem defenses and address the real issues.

          • Frank Dorka

            You are anass.

      • George T

        Martin Smit: Don’t bear false witness. You’ve created a Straw Man and are attacking it instead of dealing with the real discussion.

        • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

          There is no real discussion here, just white atheist trolls stomping on defenseless black victims. If there was a real discussion, you would mention something of substance, but racism doesn’t work that way: you just bark and bark and bark that your white supremacist atheist dictates are not lapped by by the ignorant masses.

          • George T

            Martin Smit: That’s right. Lie for Jesus. I’m sure your bearing false witness will be forgiven, right? Isn’t that how murderers are absolved of their sins (^_^)

          • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

            You white atheists love to call others liars, without even bothering to state what the truth of the matter is. Atheists do not even believe in the existence of truth, but you want to tell Black Christians how to behave, simply based on your superior racial characteristics, exemplified by your atheism. The truth is that you are inferior to the humble people you would crush, but you’re so busy thinking you are clever you cannot see it. Your sins will never be forgiven, because you love your sins more than the truth.

          • George T

            Martin Smit: You call me racist, but you’re the one assuming you know my race (^_^)

          • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

            You’re supporting the white man’s atheist war on a black man’s Christianity. That makes you a racist, and it doesn’t matter whether you are from Argentina or Japan.

          • George T

            Martin Smit: Aaaaaahahahahahaha!! Nice try at a recovery from that gaffe, racist (^_^)

  • Josey

    When I was in school decades ago, there was a lot more atheism being taught than religion, they are ridiculous in their claims. They are promoting atheism so if this principal is fired, this atheist organization should be banned along with all their propaganda they promote! And also any reading of the Bible or praying done by teachers or administrators which was far and few inbetween had no bearing on my acceptance of Christ later in life. I didn’t take offense at any of it and my feeling is most kids don’t either, if they don’t believe, I’m sure they go on with their lives regardless just as I did in school. No one can cause a individual to accept the truth, God in His mercy must reveal the truth to each individual HIs way. Now, good seeds can be planted but that goes both ways and God can be the only one who gives the increase on the seeds taking root and the devil can also plant bad seeds against God through organizations that are ungodly such as the FFRF and believe me they are planting more seeds than Christians in schools now days. I’d much rather have my child prayed for and taught to live right than have their heads filled with godless lies and that was my sentiment even before becoming one of God’s born again children. Just look what removing God from schools has brought to many cities, no accountability with kids murdering kids w/out a conviction about it, even giving themselves marks on their bodies as if a trophy to show how cruel they can be or look tough.

    • Frank Dorka

      I do not think that by having secular education you can blame atheism for the woes of the world. It would be fine with you if this principal were a Muslim and promoting “his” ideas of a god onto your Christian babies?In America, you cannot have it both ways.

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        America was founded on three documents: The Declaration of Independence; The Paris Peace Treaty of 1783, and the Constitution. These documents give conclusive proof that America is a Christian nation. One does not need a law degree or a degree in history to grasp this truth.

        • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

          The body of the Constitution makes no reference to God. The Constitution honors the Christian Sabbath. The President was given 10 days to sign a bill into law. The counting of the 10 days does not include the Sabbath. This is found in Article 1, Section 7, and Clause 2
          “If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten Days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the Same shall be a Law,”

          “Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven and of the Independence of the United States of America the Twelfth In witness whereof We have hereunto subscribed our Names, GEORGE WASHINGTON – President. and deputy from Virginian.

          When the Constitution was completed on September 17, 1787, it was signed by the delegates then to be ratified by the states. The delegates signed the Constitution in the “Year of our Lord.” This is a direct reference to Christianity. This is found in Article 7.

          • Frank Dorka

            So?

      • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

        The Declaration has many references to God throughout the document. The most famous one is that men are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights.

        • http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/fisherhl Mr. Avatar

          Here are more references to God found in the document:
          Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God”
          Appealing to the Supreme Judge of the World”
          With a firm Reliance on the Protection of Divine Providence”

          The Declaration of Independence does not identify the God whom they are addressing. This could be left open to interpretation and opinion

          • Frank Dorka

            The Declaration made no laws. Please keep up.

          • Bob Johnson

            The Declaration of Independence is, technically, a British document, directed to the King of England, who is head of the Anglican Church. Therefore, since the colonies were claiming to be going over the head of state we might assume that the Supreme Judge would be the Anglican (Episcopalian) God. As an aside, many folks on this website do not concider Episcopalians to be Christians.

  • Josey

    Luke 17:1,2 vs1 Then said he unto the disciples, It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come! 2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.

    • George T

      Josey: Whatever! Thanks for the non-sequitur (^_^)

  • Slidellman4life

    There was some FFRF clown in here a week or so ago, swearing up one side and down the other they aren’t specifically going after Christianity.

    This news item proves him a liar.

    That aside, the fact these anti-Christian freaks do not want God in public schools, but have no problem seeing five-year-olds being taught homosexuality as well as where, when and how to pray to Allah says everything you need to know.

    • Chris Clayton

      Hold on. FFRF is concerned about ANY religion that being pushed on public school students. It is just the case that Christianity is most common. For example, they recently complained about special accommodations for Muslim students in a public school in Maryland. You most often just hear about their concerns about Christianity since there are so many Christian teachers, Christian principals, and Christian reporters, like above, that put their religion first and our Constitution second.

      • Slidellman4life

        Do you have a link?

        • George T

          Slidellman4life: On the 4th of February Andrew Seidel posted on a website called Patheos a summation of non-Christian legal actions involving The FFRF. This was posted in response to a claim matching yours from Fox News. Apparently I can’t post the link without being moderated, so please look for this article using the details I provided above.

          The posting name is “Answering Fox News: Why doesn’t FFRF ever ‘go after’ Islam or other religions?”

          • Slidellman4life

            This is a red herring. That, and I did not ask you.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: But I gave you a legitimate, valid, and informative response. If you don’t accept it then you should check yourself for bias.

          • Slidellman4life

            It is not relevant to this conversation as I did not ask you.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: Andrew Seidel is a FFRF lawyer. He compiled a blog entry of the information you requested from Chris Clayton. I tried to provide a link but those are moderated here.

            I really wish you’d quit lying.

          • Slidellman4life

            I did not ask you or Andrew Seidel. And calling me a liar for saying so is projection and trolling.

            I am sick of this. Where are the mods?

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: This is an open forum. Given your response, I have to assume that you were hoping your intended target wasn’t informed. I must’ve thwarted whatever you had planned by providing the information you requested.

            I ruined your attempt to troll another poster.

            Funny (^_^)

      • George T

        Chris Clayton: I posted this in response to Slidellman4life. I hope you find this information useful in response to his demands and accusations…

        On the 4th of February Andrew Seidel posted on a website called Patheos a summation of non-Christian legal actions involving The FFRF. This was posted in response to a claim matching yours from Fox News. Apparently I can’t post the link without being moderated, so please look for this article using the details I provided above.

        The posting name is “Answering Fox News: Why doesn’t FFRF ever ‘go after’ Islam or other religions?”

    • Frank Dorka

      As with David and the Goliath, FFRF goes after the worst offenders of the Constitution…Christians. When other religions get as bad, FFRF will go after them.

      • PumperPickle

        When will those Fundamentalist Christians ever learn to behave?

      • Slidellman4life

        Dumbest comment of the day.

        • Frank Dorka

          It’s your book.

          • Slidellman4life

            Red herring. Try again.

        • PumperPickle

          Care to elaborate on why this comment is so dumb, or are you just spouting hot air?

          • Slidellman4life

            Certainly. Dorka is making a comment based on the phantasmagorical notion the Constitution prohibits religious expression. I stand by my response.

          • PumperPickle

            “Dorka is making a comment based on the phantasmagorical notion the Constitution prohibits religious expression”

            Nowhere has he stated that. You are clearly lying.

          • Slidellman4life

            And you clearly have poor reading comprehension skills. Either that, or you have never read the Constitution.

            I seriously wish people like you would go away. My head hurts when I find myself having to engage the idiots in the room.

          • PumperPickle

            So you have not given any arguments, and instead have resorted to insults? Gee, no wonder people are moving away from Religion so fast..

            “And you clearly have poor reading comprehension skills. Either that, or you have never read the Constitution.”

            Neither.

          • Slidellman4life

            Then you’re just trolling. Flagged.

          • PumperPickle

            You are the only one here who is trolling.

            Just a suggestion, when trolling try to work more on how you present your insults. It’s all about proper execution.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            You can “read the Constitution” ten thousand times, and you won’t get any closer to understanding how it applies in a given situation. The original text of the Constitution is ambiguous and open-ended.

            To truly understand Constitutional law, you have to read cases.

          • namelessghost

            “I seriously wish people like you would go away. My head hurts when I find myself having to engage the idiots in the room.”

            I haven’t seen you engage any idiots yet.

          • Josey

            It’s dumb because FFRF isn’t going after any other religion and there is plenty of proof of other religions involved in schools.

          • PumperPickle

            “It’s dumb because FFRF isn’t going after any other religion”

            Proof?

          • james blue

            Posted several links with examples of them going after a Muslim teacher, Buddhists shrines on public property, city sponsorship of a Ramadan festival and something about the Dalai lama. But it is waiting approval before the site will publish it.

            FFRF has also made public statements against claims that Islam is “the religion of peace.”

            So yes they do go after other religions

          • George T

            Josey: Incorrect. Andrew Seidel posted an article named “Answering Fox News: Why doesn’t FFRF ever ‘go after’ Islam or other religions?” on the Patheos website detailing non-Christian legal efforts.

    • George T

      Slidellman4life: On the 4th of February Andrew Seidel posted on a website called Patheos a summation of non-Christian legal actions involving The FFRF. This was posted in response to a claim matching yours from Fox News. Apparently I can’t post the link without being moderated, so please look for this article using the details I provided above.

      • Slidellman4life

        It is just as apparent I do not care what you think. It has been proven here and elsewhere you are a liar and a troll. As are all of the anti-Christian bigots here.

        • George T

          Slidellman4life: Oh! Keep bearing false witness! Do it in the name of heaven. You can justify it in the end (-_^)

          • Slidellman4life

            Troll. Flagged.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: I hope your god forgives you one of these days. The road to hell is paved with your good intentions, specifically lying for Jesus because you can’t defend your point.

          • Slidellman4life

            You won’t stop trolling until the mods step in and do it for you, am I right?

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: I haven’t trolled at all. You’re bearing false witness.

          • Ronald Carter

            I wouldn’t worry, the posts he flags are rarely removed.

  • james blue

    I don’t think he should be fired, but he should cease this practice. leave religious raising to the parents.

  • Theodore Fenton

    Do kids not go to Sunday school anymore?

    • TheBottomline4This

      Sadly most Sunday Schools I have seen are lightweight distraction while parents attend Church. We decided early in our kids life to keep them in service with us. We gave them something to quietly do if they got restless, but since it was only about an hour, they were usually fine. A kid who can’t sit still long is usually a kid that is allowed to do whatever they want at home.

  • nullhyp0thesis

    I’m a secular Jewish person in IL. What right does this principal have to decide what religion my kids are?

    • Josey

      He isn’t deciding what religion your kids are, he is sharing his faith is all, it’s up to you as parents to teach your children your beliefs and teach them not to take offense at his faith. Got news for you there are muslim teachers teaching your children too but don’t see it any news about them being fired for it, you won’t even hear about what they are teaching in the news, the only way you’ll find out about it is if your child tells you, that’s how out of touch you are and at least this principal is sharing a faith that includes Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, jewish man if you truly are what you claim.

      • George T

        Josey: The Wallace v Jaffree ruling clearly shows that government representatives in schools are prohibited from proselytizing or organizing religious activities.

        • Slidellman4life

          Wallace v Jaffree is unconstitutional as per Amendment One.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: Wallace v Jaffree is upholding the 1st amendment. If you truly believe your assertion, then provide evidence.

            Don’t bear false witness.

          • Slidellman4life

            The First Amendment gives the people the right to practice their religion. It does not restrict it. Gotta love your projection.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: It gives citizens the right to practice their religion. It doesn’t give our government any religious rights, especially any right to indoctrinate children into one religion. That is clearly stated in the Wallace v Jaffree ruling, which you apparently haven’t read.

      • nullhyp0thesis

        >”Jewish man if you truly are what you claim.”

        I know it’s been a while since we had to wear armbands with the Star of David on it to identify us, but yes, I am a Jewish man.

        As for the faiths of teachers, no problem. They can believe in whatever they like. I’ve got friends who are Muslim and grew up with them. Faith is not an issue. The issue is that he is promoting his religion to them. You could teach religion without promoting Christian prayer. But that is not his job either. It’s to administrate the school. Period. Proselytizing his religion using his position of authority to impressionable children in a public school is unconstitutional and the very long jurisprudence on this issue makes that very clear.

  • Chris Clayton

    The author does herself a huge disservice by using words used in the founding of private colleges to argue for how public schools should act. Thomas Jefferson said there should be a wall of separation between church and state. That Supreme Court has agreed that same wall should sit between the rules that govern a private university and the rules that govern a state-run school.

    • Slidellman4life

      Jefferson believed church should be protected from the government. Not the other way around.

      • Bob Johnson

        So how do you protect all churches when you allow the government to dictate a certain religious view?

        • Slidellman4life

          What? That makes no sense.

          • George T

            Slidellman4life: Exactly, Bob Johnson just showed that your assertion makes no sense.

      • Josey

        They twist it don’t they?

        • Slidellman4life

          For people who don’t believe in God, they sure hate Him.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Amen!!!!!

      • Jalapeno

        You cannot protect the church from government if you do not also protect the government from church.

        If the government dictates a certain view based on religious beliefs, all opposing religious beliefs immediately lose their protections and equal ground.

        • Slidellman4life

          But the Constitution doesn’t say that.

          Now, see, this is what I am sick and tired of: People who will talk about the Constitution when it is clear they have never read it. They can’t find “freedom of speech,” “freedom of religion,” “the right of the people to keep and bear arms,” etc, but have no problem locating “separation of church and state”,”freedom from religion,” and “right to kill your unborn child in the name of convenience.”

          The idea government and religion are supposed to be two wholly separate entities to the point a public school teacher is supposed to check his Christian faith at the door is absolutely not reflected in the Constitution. No, it clearly says Congress cannot create its own religion or keep people from practicing theirs. Notice this also does not say government is not allowed to have an opinion rooted in religion.

          (I do not care what people in black robes say if it doesn’t reflect what the Constitution says.)

          The idea behind these deliberate lies and distortions coming from the godless left is the want to remake this country in its own image, as has been admitted by people at this website. They believe a godless society would be a better society. Funny, though, Josef Stalin thought so, too.

          I reject such Marxist, anti-American and anti-God thinking. As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord and talk about Him wherever and whenever we please. Period.

          • Jalapeno

            Of course the constitution doesn’t say that, it’s not intended to be a fully-comprehensive explanation…it’s a basis.

            “Notice this also does not say government is not allowed to have an opinion rooted in religion.”

            It’s not actually spelled out, it’s a necessary step in the protections of religions, and the intent of the protection clauses is clear. Jefferson even understood that, even though the constitution didn’t directly say it.

          • Slidellman4life

            It’s not actually spelled out, it’s a necessary step in the protections of religions, and the intent of the protection clauses is clear.

            Dude, it’s not spelled out. It’s not there. Period.

            If you are going to insist on staying in this delusion, then you need professional help.

          • Jalapeno

            Then..why do you think Jefferson considered it to be an actual thing?

            Why did the courts decide that it was a relevant part of how to protect the churches?

          • Slidellman4life

            Then..why do you think Jefferson considered it to be an actual thing?

            What are you talking about? “Separation of church and state?” He believed religion should be protected from the government, not the other way around. And you can be certain he wasn’t thinking about keeping people like this principal from talking about Jesus Christ.

          • Jalapeno

            Okay, so..you understand that even Jefferson took understandings from the constitution instead of blindly following the exact words and keeping it to that?

            “He believed religion should be protected from the government, not the other way around”

            Can you separate church and state without separating state and church?

            If they’re separate, the separation must go both ways.

          • Slidellman4life

            That is not what Jefferson said, primarily because he did not believe it.

            You would like it to go both ways, to the extent of seeing this principal fired for having the gall to even mention Jesus Christ. We are supposed to have a secular, godless government, according to you.

            You are severely delusional. You think this is a communist country. Why don’t you try China? In fact, you can have a great big God-hating cakewalk right through Tianamen Square if you wish. But leave the rest of us the bleep alone, capsice?

          • Jalapeno

            The “wall of separation between church and state” was his words.

            “You think this is a communist country. ”

            Nope..I think this is a constitutional republic.

            So..how do you protect the church from government without protecting the government from the church?

            If one religion gets to change the governmental policies or use the government to validate their religion, how do the other religions protect themselves from that if they disagree?

          • Slidellman4life

            The “wall of separation between church and state” was his words.

            Yep. Have you read the actual letter? I would wager not.

            Nope..I think this is a constitutional republic.

            But not for long, if you get your way, right?

            So..how do you protect the church from government without protecting the government from the church?

            Why don’t you go back in time and ask Karl Marx that question? That’s closer to his way of thinking than Jefferson’s.

            I’m done with you.

          • Jalapeno

            Of course I read the letter. I don’t use quotes if I don’t know the context.

            ” But not for long, if you get your way, right?”

            Of course, I don’t make up crap about other people’s views either.

            Intellectual honesty. Try it.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Glad I’m not the only one who knows Jally needs professional help. They come on here thinking they have the upper hand, but just end up showing their ignorance.

          • Slidellman4life

            Can you actually believe this crap?!? This clown hates Christian speech so much he is willing to pull garbage out of his tuchis to justify it.

            There is nothing rational or reasonable about this thinking.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Their ignorance is their bliss.

  • PumperPickle

    I think being fired is a bit much, but I still think some form of punishment should be in order.

    • The Last Trump

      Force him to convert to atheistic liberalism.
      That’ll teach him.

      • George T

        The Last Trump: First, how would you *force* anyone to convert to anything?

        Second, your proposal is a violation of religious freedom rights. I would fight you to defend this citizens rights to his Christianity when he’s not working.

        Stop being a hypocrite.

  • TheBottomline4This

    Oh please, there are worse things than him sharing about Christianity. He’s not forcing anyone to convert is he? That is what islam does and will do to each of you when they can at some point. Will you resist their allah? Will you?
    Schools teach all kinds of things beyond the original intent of academic subjects. There is a lot of social causes, sex ed, abortion info, homo and trans being taught as normal and other things pushed in schools and getting kids to tell what happens at home…which is none of their dam n business. THOSE is worse than scary ole’ Christianity.

    • Frank Dorka

      Great, then let’s have Satanist principals to be allowed to preach as well.

      • TheBottomline4This

        Since satan is against anything good…no thanks.

        • PumperPickle

          But Satanists perhaps see you as the ‘not so good’ type. So, why should your judgement be given special privileges over other peoples religious beliefs?

        • Slidellman4life

          He is throwing that out to mock you. Flag the troll and move on.

          • Jalapeno

            It’s interesting that you want to flag people just for suggesting an opposing viewpoint.

          • TheBottomline4This

            That’s what happens for us when we go to sites that aren’t Christian. They do the same thing. Tell them to stop flagging us…basically clean up your own yard before you complain about us doing it. Some Liberal sites even block those with an opposing opinion.

          • Jalapeno

            Haha, yeah.

            So..some liberal sites are also just as anti-opposing viewpoint as people around here, therefore people standing up for it are okay?

            Way to take the high road.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Get back to work Jally. Your view isn’t welcomed here anymore than our view is welcomed on Liberal sites. But you keep trying.

          • Jalapeno

            Oh man, you don’t want me here?

            How ever will I survive??

            Again..high road.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Jally, Jally, Jally 🙂

          • TheBottomline4This

            Oh I know, they’re easy to spot, even the fake ones who claim to be Christians, but obviously aren’t…like Gal5.

    • PumperPickle

      “sex ed, abortion info, homo and trans being taught as normal”

      Nobody cares if you consider it ‘normal’ or not. It’s called education. If you don’t like education, go to a private school in the bible belt.

      • TheBottomline4This

        Your ignorance is your bliss.
        Simply put, the fact that there are animals that exhibit what we might call homosexual behavior does not change the fact that homosexuality is a sin for human beings.
        Some animals eat their young, but that doesn’t mean it is okay for humans to be cannibals.
        Dogs eat their own vomit, but that is definitely not good behavior for us to emulate. Some insects devour their partners after mating.
        We cannot use animal behavior as a basis for morality or to justify our chosen actions.
        So…your point???

        • PumperPickle

          “does not change the fact that homosexuality is a sin for human beings.”

          It was never established as a fact to begin with. It is a religious belief.

          “Some animals eat their young, but that doesn’t mean it is okay for humans to be cannibals.”

          You are comparing homosexuality to cannibalism? Seriously?

          “Dogs eat their own vomit, but that is definitely not good behavior for
          us to emulate. Some insects devour their partners after mating.”

          Not for us, no.

          “We cannot use animal behavior as a basis for morality or to justify our chosen actions.”

          can you please elaborate on that point?

          “So…your point???”

          I’ll say it again. If you don’t like education, then don’t go to school.

          • TheBottomline4This

            You have contradicted yourself Pickle…
            “If it happens in nature, then it is normal.”
            But then you say to the dog vomit…
            “Not for us, no.”
            Seems you’re the one who is void of education.

          • PumperPickle

            It is completely irrelevant to your original premises. I concede that I was incorrect on that one point, but you still have yet to give any justification as to why homosexuality shouldn’t be taught in public schools. You have accomplished nothing. Enjoy your brownie points I guess..

          • TheBottomline4This

            Your ignorance is your bliss.

          • PumperPickle

            So, you don’t have any good arguments left, so now you have resorted to playground rhetoric? Troll harder.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Why are you even on a Christian page???
            To Troll is your only reason.
            I don’t go on gay pages or mentally ill trans pages. I’m not driven to try and share the Truth with the ignorant and blinded, yet you are here, because you seek Truth. You are open to it somewhere inside or you wouldn’t be here.
            You will not win anyone here that does know the Truth to your view, so it seems you are the one who is accomplishing nothing. So enjoy your brownie points I guess. You can tell the perverts you defend you are atleast trying.

          • PumperPickle

            I was reading the news, and wanted to engage in a wholesome debate. I was greatly disappointed by all these poor arguments. I expected better.

            “You will not win anyone here that does know the Truth to your view, so it seems you are the one who is accomplishing nothing.”

            Actually, I have accomplished quite a lot. I’m not here do turn you into an atheist, I am here to establish the facts that you cannot proselytize in a public school, you cannot prevent evolution, sexual education, or any of those things from being taught no matter what you believe, and even if your cognitive dissonance prevents you from taking what I have to say into consideration, other open minded individuals will.

            You aren’t the only one reading this.

            I am sick and tired of the religious trying to enforce their theocracy and limit education just because of their own selfish beliefs. It has to end.

          • TheBottomline4This

            You’re a fool and your ignorance is your bliss.

            Per Pickles Disqus…”Sometimes goes as SuperSanic, PumperPickle, or SargentSillyNipples. Just your friendly neighborhood atheist. Debating religious fundamentalists since disqus got disqusting.”

            You are a joke dear. A blinded joke 🙂

          • PumperPickle

            Troll harder. C’mon, you have to put more backbone into it.

          • Charles

            “you cannot prevent evolution”… ha ha.. I know, it doesn’t exist.. Why would we?

          • PumperPickle

            It’s in the curriculum whether you believe it exists or not. How do you suppose you are going to get rid of it?

          • Charles

            Should have never been allowed without alternate theories..

          • PumperPickle

            Why not? If you are implying ‘Creationism’, it is not a scientific theory, it is a hypothesis, at best.

          • Charles

            “But you still have yet to give any justification as to why homosexuality shouldn’t be taught in public schools”.

            Here you go.

            Fast Facts

            • Gay and bisexual men are more severely affected by HIV than any other group in the United States.

            • Among all gay and bisexual men, black/African American gay and bisexual men bear a disproportionate burden of HIV.

            • From 2008 to 2010, HIV infections among young black/African American gay and bisexual men increased 20%.

            Gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men (MSM)a represent approximately 2% of the United States population, yet are the population most severely affected by HIV. In 2010, young gay and bisexual men (aged 13-24 years) accounted for 72% of new HIV infections among all persons aged 13 to 24, and 30% of new infections among all gay and bisexual men. At the end of 2011, an estimated 500,022 (57%) persons living with an HIV diagnosis in the United States were gay and bisexual men, or gay and bisexual men who also inject drugs.

            The Numbers

            New HIV Infectionsb

            • In 2010, gay and bisexual men accounted for 63% of estimated new HIV infections in the United States and 78% of infections among all newly infected men. From 2008 to 2010, new HIV infections increased 22% among young (aged 13-24) gay and bisexual men and 12% among gay and bisexual men overall.

            • Among all gay and bisexual men, white gay and bisexual men accounted for 11,200 (38%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among white gay and bisexual men (3,300; 29%) occurred in those aged 25 to 34.

            • Among all gay and bisexual men, black/African American gay and bisexual men accounted for 10,600 (36%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among black/African American gay and bisexual men (4,800; 45%) occurred in those aged 13 to 24. From 2008 to 2010 new infections increased 20% among young black/African American gay and bisexual men aged 13 to 24.

            • Among all gay and bisexual men, Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men accounted for 6,700 (22%) estimated new HIV infections in 2010. The largest number of new infections among Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men (3,300; 39%) occurred in those aged 25 to 34.

            HIV and AIDS Diagnosesc

            • In 2013, in the United States, gay and bisexual men accounted for 81% (30,689) of the 37,887 estimated HIV diagnoses among all males aged 13 years and older and 65% of the 47,352 estimated diagnoses among all persons receiving an HIV diagnosis that year.

            • In 2013, gay and bisexual men accounted for 55% of the estimated number of persons diagnosed with AIDS among all adults and adolescents in the United States. Of the estimated 14,611 gay and bisexual men diagnosed with AIDS, 40% were blacks/African Americans; 32% were whites; and 23% were Hispanics/Latinos.

            • By the end of 2011, an estimated 311,087 gay and bisexual men with AIDS had died in the United States since the beginning of the epidemic, representing 47% of all deaths of persons with AIDS.

            • In 2011, CDC data showed that 80.6% of MSM with diagnosed HIV infection were linked to care, 57.5% were retained in care, 52.9% were prescribed antiretroviral therapy (ART), and 44.6% had achieved viral suppression.

            Estimates of New HIV Infections in the United States for the Most-Affected Subpopulations, 2010

            Source: CDC. Estimated HIV incidence among adults and adolescents in the United States, 2007–2010. HIV Surveillance Supplemental Report 2012;17(4). Subpopulations representing 2% or less are not reflected in this chart. Abbreviations: MSM, men who have sex with men; IDU, injection drug user.

            Prevention Challenges

            The large percentage of gay and bisexual men living with HIV means that, as a group, gay and bisexual men have an increased chance of being exposed to HIV. Results of HIV testing conducted in 20 cities as part of the National HIV Behavioral Surveillance System (NHBS) indicated that 18% of gay and bisexual men tested in 2011 had HIV and that HIV prevalence increased with increasing age.

            Many gay and bisexual men with HIV are unaware they have it. Even though the NHBS study showed that the overall percentage of gay and bisexual men with HIV who knew of their HIV infection increased from 56% in 2008 to 66% in 2011, there were still many who did not know they had HIV. Among those infected, only 49% of young gay and bisexual men aged 18 to 24 years knew of their infection, whereas 76% of those aged 40 and older were aware of their HIV infection. Fifty-four percent of black/African American gay and bisexual men knew of their infection, compared with 63% of Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men, and 86% of white gay and bisexual men. People who don’t know they have HIV cannot get the medicines they need to stay healthy and may infect others without knowing it. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) recommends that all gay and bisexual men get tested for HIV at least once a year. Sexually active gay and bisexual men may benefit from more frequent testing (e.g., every 3 to 6 months).

            Sexual risk behaviors account for most HIV infections in gay and bisexual men. Most gay and bisexual men acquire HIV through anal sex, which is the riskiest type of sex for getting or transmitting HIV. For sexually active gay and bisexual men, the most effective ways to prevent transmitting or becoming infected with HIV are to be on antiretroviral medications (to either treat or prevent infection) and to correctly use a condom every time for anal or vaginal sex. Gay men are at increased risk for sexually transmitted diseases (STDs), like syphilis, gonorrhea, and chlamydia, and CDC recommends that all sexually active gay and bisexual men be tested at least annually for these infections and obtain treatment, if necessary.

            Having more sex partners compared to other men means gay and bisexual men have more opportunities to have sex with someone who can transmit HIV or another STD. Similarly, among gay men, those who have more partners are more likely to acquire HIV.

            Homophobia, stigma, and discrimination may place gay men at risk for multiple physical and mental health problems and affect whether they seek and are able to obtain high-quality health services.

            What CDC Is Doing

            CDC awarded $55 million over 5 years to 34 community-based organizations to provide HIV testing to more than 90,000 young gay and bisexual men of color and transgender youth of color with the goals of identifying more than 3,500 previously unrecognized HIV infections and linking those who have HIV to care and prevention services. Additionally, CDC’s MSM Testing Initiative seeks to identify at least 3,000 MSM with HIV who were previously unaware of their infection and link at least 85% to care.

            CDC is aligning surveillance and program activities more closely. For example, more people living with HIV should be linked to care, receive continuous care and antiretroviral treatment, and achieve a suppressed HIV viral load—the most important goal for maximizing a person’s health as well as reducing the risk of transmission. By increasing the reporting of CD4 and viral load data across the country, CDC will aid health departments and clinicians in monitoring treatment progress toward viral load suppression. Currently, CDC estimates that only 25% of the 1.1 million individuals with HIV have their viral loads adequately suppressed.

            CDC supports biomedical approaches to HIV prevention. Pre-exposure prophylaxis (PrEP), which involves taking antiretroviral medications prior to becoming exposed to HIV, can reduce the risk of HIV infection in individuals at substantial risk of infection. Post-exposure prophylaxis, which involves taking antiretroviral medications soon after possible exposure to HIV, also plays a role in HIV prevention, but should be not be considered a primary means of HIV prevention. Also, while HIV treatments can dramatically improve the health of HIV-positive persons who are treated, they also have prevention benefits: individuals whose HIV viral loads are suppressed have a greatly reduced chance of transmitting the virus to their partners.

            Through its Act Against AIDS campaigns, CDC aims to provide MSM with effective and culturally appropriate messages about HIV prevention. The Reasons/Razones testing campaign features Latino gay and bisexual men sharing their reasons for getting an HIV test. Testing Makes Us Stronger encourages black gay and bisexual men to get tested for HIV. Let’s Stop HIV Together focuses on raising awareness of HIV and AIDS and combatting complacency and stigma by increasing support for people living with the disease. Start Talking. Stop HIV. encourages gay and bisexual men to communicate about testing and other HIV prevention issues.

            CDC also funds state and local health departments and community-based organizations to support HIV prevention services for MSM.

            Read more about CDC activities to reduce HIV risk and improve the health of MSM.

            a The term men who have sex with men (MSM) is used in CDC surveillance systems. It indicates a behavior that transmits HIV infection, not how individuals self-identify in terms of their sexuality.

            b New HIV infections refer to HIV incidence, or the estimated number of people who are newly infected with HIV each year.

            c HIV and AIDS diagnoses are the number of persons diagnosed with HIV infection and the number of persons diagnosed with AIDS, respectively, during a given time period. The terms do not indicate when the persons were infected.

            That’s all the reason you should need.

          • PumperPickle

            Women are also more likely to get STD’s. Even if gays do have a higher chance, it cannot stop them from being gay. So much for that wall of text.

          • Charles

            No it probably won’t stop anyone from doing what they want, but the numbers should concern you.

          • PumperPickle

            Yes, they do concern me, which is why I believe people should be more safe when having sex.

      • Josey

        I think his point is that they teach all of those things so why be afraid of a principal sharing Christianity which is wholesome and far better than all those other degrading things being taught and yet no one is fired for teaching worse things but why would anyone think you would get the point of TheBottomline’s point since you advocate all the other things…pffft…shows where your heart is and how great the darkness is in you.

        • PumperPickle

          “why be afraid of a principal sharing Christianity which is wholesome and far better than all those other degrading things being taught”

          There are classes that teach Christianity but don’t proselytize it. It’s called World Religions.

          I don’t see anything degrading about any of those things.

          “and yet no one is fired for teaching worse things but why would anyone
          think you would get the point of TheBottomline’s point since you
          advocate all the other things”

          I advocate education. Do you have a problem with that?

          “shows where your heart is and how great the darkness is in you.”

          So, I am a dark and evil individual for supporting education. Okay, makes perfect sense.

        • Mountain Dew Fan

          Better? A religion which teaches you that if you masturbate you will spend all of eternity burning in a fiery Hell !
          A religion which teaches bigotry and hated and teaches that anyone who does not behave exactly as you do should be shunned and treated as an abomination.
          Oh yeah, those sound like a wonderful concepts to teach your children.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Share the Scripture references for your accusations.

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            They were just generalizations.
            Christianity teaches that those who sin will burn in Hell …. masturbation is considered by many to be a sin. (Matthew 5:30)
            Most Christians teach that homosexuals, atheists, etc. should be treated as inferior. I’m sure there are quite a few a few references to that one, Leviticus 20:13 for example.

      • Slidellman4life

        Are you then saying coprophilia and coprophagia are normal? They, too, happen in nature.

        And another strawman bites the dust.

        • PumperPickle

          See my later posts. I was incorrect on that definition.

    • Mountain Dew Fan

      Yes, there are much worse things … and I seem to recall a whole bunch of priests who were involved in some things that were much, much worse.

      What this principal is doing is against the law! How can you condone a principal breaking the law? What a fine example to the children he must be! I can imagine little Johnny saying to his mom… “I know it’s illegal to smoke pot … but Principal McGrone breaks the law and alot of people are fine with it. “

  • Coach

    This man is violating his role as a principal, doesn’t he know there’s a separation between church and state? Or maybe, he recognizes that God is sovereign and we ought to obey Him rather than men.

    • PumperPickle

      You are right. God wants us to follow the first amendment and obey the law. I know because god told me so.

      • TheBottomline4This

        Your ignorance is your bliss

        • PumperPickle

          troll harder.

          • TheBottomline4This

            Yes you are Trolling harder. That is why you will keep projecting that.

          • PumperPickle

            troll harder, young padawan.

      • Slidellman4life

        Blatant troll. Flagged.

      • Coach

        Your god is the god of this evil age, not the one true god, it’s obvious that you’re faithful to him, but I warn you, he’ll be cast into the lake of fire at the judgement throne of Jesus Christ, along with everyone not written in the book of life. Repent of your sins and turn to Christ, the one who has the power to cast body and soul into hell, whom you’ve mocked your entire life, in spite of the fact that He’s given you life and can take it away in an instant. Before you say “oh you’re trying to scare me into believing”, consider the fact that false converts will be cast into the lake of fire, many of whom go to church and appear to be godly. So unless you be converted, you will suffer the wrath of God that abides on you currently.
        Jesus Christ, the sinless Son of God took on human flesh, was born into the world He had made of a virgin in a stinking stable, was despised and rejected by those who claim to serve God. He performed miracles, clearly seen by multitudes of healing, casting out demons, raising the dead. He was betrayed by one of His disciples, suffered the wrath of God at the hands of sinners and rose from the grave to be the mediator for all who will believe on Him. Why couldn’t God just forgive people without Christ’s suffering?, because that would make God unjust. Because God is good, He must punish every bit of evil. Because God is eternal, the offense is greater. If a boy lies to his teacher, he gets a 0, he lies to his parents, he gets grounded, lies to police, he gets arrested, but all sin is against an infinitely holy God. There’s no neutral ground with God, you’re either a savant of God having been saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, or His enemy.

        Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
        Christ died for the ungodly that would later repent and believe on Him and one is saved by trusting Him alone, not “good” deeds, not reforming one’s behavior, not repeating a prayer, not being baptized, no by faith alone in Jesus Christ. I suggest you start with reading the Bible. By mocking Christianity on a Christian site, you waste your life, which is as a vapor in comparison to eternity. I speak as one raised on the religion of the age along with some Christian teaching, who held to being a Christian and repeated tons of prayers, but God saved this religionists out of his sin, out of his bondage to pornography, I don’t say that as a sob story, but as praise to the all powerful God, who is gracious to whomever He wills to be, not because of my so-called good deeds, but in spite of them. To God alone be the glory and He will be glorified in either saving you for Himself or casting you into the lake of fire. If you could but get a glimpse of His infinite worth and how you a finite creature have insulted Him. Repent and trust the Lord Jesus Christ. Have no confidence in yourself. You must be born again, by the sovereign grace of our Lord Jesis Christ.

        • PumperPickle

          “You must be born again, by the sovereign grace of our Lord Jesis Christ.”

          No, the real god is cheesus crust. Free pizza for all who repent.

    • Mountain Dew Fan

      Nowhere in the Constitution or in any law in this country does it say, “It’s OK to violate the law if you think that God wants you to”. Nope. The law is the law regardless of what invisible creature you prefer to believe or not believe in!

      • Coach

        You can hate the truth, that doesn’t change it, fact is God, who is infinitely holy commands all men everywhere to repent. You’re a slave to sin and serve the desires of your master, the devil, as I once did, but have been set free by the power of Jesus Christ, who took on flesh and endured the wrath of God on behalf of sinners. You hate a man for proclaiming that truth and defend those who encourage human sacrifice to their false gods (I’m almost certain, you can’t deny this)
        As it is written:
        There is none righteous, no, not one; There is none who understands; There is none who seeks after God.
        They have all turned aside; They have together become unprofitable; There is none who does good, no, not one.
        Their throat is an open tomb; With their tongues they have practiced deceit; The poison of asps is under their lips
        Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness
        Their feet are swift to shed blood;
        Destruction and misery are in their ways;
        And the way of peace they have not known.
        There is no fear of God before their eyes. Romans 3:10-18

        You are condemned and awaiting judgement, I assure you it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

        Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
        And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
        For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. John 3:18-20

        • MountainDewFan4

          Your version of the “truth” is very strange. You seem to think that everything that is written in a book over 2,000 years ago is “the truth”.
          Have you ever thought that maybe, just maybe that book is NOT the truth? Perhaps it was just written as a piece of fiction?

          • Coach

            Yes, I could see how that would be the conclusion of someone who’s never read the Bible. Your willfull ignorance doesn’t excuse the fact that you will stand before the Lord Jesus Christ, but you assume that by mocking and denying the truth, it goes away.
            Jesus said “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words never will” Consider how many revisions the average textbook goes through, yet the Bible’s truth is unchanging. Every prophesy has been fulfilled exactly as prophesied, the apostles suffered immense persecution as Jesus said they would. Believers today suffer immense persecution and testify of being radically transformed by the power of the gospel.
            I bear personal testimony of the gospel’s transforming power. I was full of cursing and bitterness, envy, and perverted lust, but God has transformed me and though I am not perfectly sinless, nor will I be in this lifetime, I thank God that He’s redeemed me from the depths of my sinfulness, so the idea of the Bible being fiction is completely foolish. You mock a holy God and praise a beverage brand, while cursing the God who gave and sustains your life. Repent and believe on Jesus Christ.

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            OK, everything that you are saying all comes from that one book.

            “Every prophesy has been fulfilled exactly as prophesied”.
            Oh please tell us more about these. Remember for a prophesy to be fulfilled, you must have proof that the prophesy was written BEFORE something happened, and you must also have proof that whatever the prophesy was ACTUALLY happened IN REAL LIFE, not just in the Bible.

            Also it would be cool if the prophesy wasn’t so vague, like “Someone will rise to power and then be killed”. That’s way too easy to predict.

            I’d be real impressed if the Bible actually said something like, “and in the year 2016, David Bowie, Prince, and Harry Potter star Alan Rickman will all die”. If this God is so amazing why can’t he make impressive predictions like that??

          • Eileen Dennis

            Did you ever stop and-wonder where you came from or how the earth was created how is the design of life the air that you breed where you go when you die it’s all in the bible there is no other book that will tell you that read it ask God to Gide you and lead you to come in your heart to forgive your sins he will do so

          • MountainDewFan4

            You assume that everything that is written in the Bible by a handful of people over 2,000 years ago is more accurate then the combined knowledge of millions of scientists, botanists, physicists, etc. ?

            If I ever need an answer as to how the earth was created … I would put more credence in what the scientists of today’s day and age have to say about it, rather than what the words of some people who thought the Earth stood still on huge pillars!

            Samuel 2:8 (NASB)
            For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s,
            And He set the world on them.

            Job 9:5-6 (NASB)
            Who shakes the earth out of its place,
            And its pillars tremble;

          • Eileen Dennis

            The bible was written by the Holly Spirt through man

          • MountainDewFan4

            If God can create the universe, create all life on the planet, create the sun, the moon, all the stars … why can’t he write a book by himself? Ever think of that?

          • Eileen Dennis

            As a Christian trying to spread the good news to you about Jesus Christ because there is a heaven and a hell consernd about the souls of others that’s all

          • Eileen Dennis

            So do you believe you came from rock a monkey or a fish how stupid is that

          • MountainDewFan4

            You believe that man was created from dirt, and that women were created from ribs? How stupid is that?

          • Coach

            God has perfect knowledge of all things, but unlike your neighborhood church throwing Super Bowl parties to impress your carnal mind, God converts sinners, giving them a new nature as He has mercy on whom He wills and whom He wills, He hardens.

            Romans 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

            In real life, the empty tomb is there, the place where the temple stood that Jesus said would be destroyed. The Bible says in the last days there will be mockers, men will be lovers of themselves, etc. Those who desire to live godly lives are persecuted in some way, evil men and imposters grow worse and worse.
            Research how the apostles died, tell me what you find prior to your next foolish statement, tell me if you’d endure that to defend your atheism.

          • MountainDewFan4

            I seriously have no idea what you are trying to say. Perhaps you should try speaking in English instead of Bibleish.

            I don’t care what your Bible says happened to Jesus or the Apostles or anyone for that matter … it’s all a story, a series of myths loosely tied together. All of the supernatural events which are written about in the book, NEVER HAPPENED!

          • Coach

            Answer me this question, is it wrong to murder? How do you determine your answer?

          • MountainDewFan4

            I take into account the general social norms of the country I live in, the local and federal laws, along with what my parents have taught me, lessons which I have learned throughout my life and then also try to decide if is something which I think that I would want someone to do to me or someone I care for. All of these above responses tell me it is wrong to murder.
            Of course the other thing that I would have to take into account is the circumstances … are there ever times when murder is justified … perhaps … if murdering someone would save the lives of millions of people … perhaps it is justified … is killing someone in war considered murder? What if that person is an innocent child who happens to have been born to parents of you enemy?

            So you see there really is no clear right or wrong answer … of course in my opinion it is almost always wrong, but I don’t need a book written thousands of years ago to tell me that.

          • Coach

            You’re saying there is no right and wrong, it’s all subjective, so the principal shouldn’t teach Christianity in a school of violence, because you don’t like it. So according to your thinking, there’s nothing wrong with kids being molested if it fits the general social norms.
            Overall, you’re saying, I’m a pretty good person Proverbs 20:6 Most men will proclaim each his own goodness,
            But who can find a faithful man?
            You sound like the average American “I do right by my fellow man, pay my bills, I’m not a bad person” Not intending that in a mocking way, but consider this, you’re a criminal in the highest court in the universe. God who is eternally existing Father, Son, and Spirit; created all the universe, not out of necessity, but His good pleasure to do so. In the grand scheme of all the universe,the planet earth is but a speck, you exist as a speck on a speck and insult the God who created and sustains your life. You’ve violated every law He’s gave. You’ve done evil while ignoring conscious and calling it good.
            Consider
            Surely You set them in slippery places;
            You cast them down to destruction.
            19 Oh, how they are brought to desolation, as in a moment!
            They are utterly consumed with terrors.
            Deuteronomy 32:35 Vengeance is Mine, and recompense;
            Their foot shall slip in due time;
            For the day of their calamity is at hand,
            And the things to come hasten upon them.

          • MountainDewFan4

            No, I didn’t say that the ONLY thing to take into consideration is the social norms. That is just one of the many items which I listed. What I was saying was that in some cultures some things are considered perfectly “normal” where here in the United States we might not consider it moral.
            For example, there are some cultures where the adults in a family walk around completely naked in their own homes. This is something that I personally would never do, but for them it’s acceptable.

            Also, I never said that the principal should not teach Christianity because “I don’t like it”. He shouldn’t do it because it is illegal. Of course, I happen to agree with the law. I believe that religion is something that should be taught to your children by your own family, friends, churches, etc. It is not something which should be taught in schools because not everyone believes in the same religion. Go ahead, teach our children that 2+2=4, and show them how light refracts to make rainbows. These things are universal.

            I’m sure that you would agree that you don’t want the principal of a school to teach your child Islamic principles, or to teach them Satanic Rituals, or any other religion which your family does not adhere to. Similarly, those people who are not Christian do not want their children to be taught Christianity.

          • Coach

            Actually, public schools teach direct opposition of Christianity. If I tell students they shouldn’t have sex outside of marriage, I’d be told I was enforcing my beliefs on the students, yet when a boy wants to change in a girl’s locker room, it’s called equality.
            I could show students a video of people having sex and that’s educational, but if I say “the Bible says” I’m breaking the law and need to stop. If a student walks around the school and brags about how many girls he’s been with, it’s appropriate for a teacher to applaud him, but the student who walks around proclaiming the gospel of Jesus Christ, he must be stopped, because an evil world will tolerate the rape of women before hearing about Jesus Christ.
            There’s no such thing as being neutral when it comes to the truth.
            He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad. Matthew 12:30

            You do the devil’s bidding by calling good evil and calling evil good.

            Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
            Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness;
            Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
            21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes,
            And prudent in their own sight!

            I have to agree, that by teaching Christianity, he’s violating the law, but when the law goes against the world’s sin, they change the law and celebrate breaking it. How many principals are there who drive drunk, use illegal drugs, etc.

            Fact is Christians take consequences for what we believe, chaplains being discharged, a local college student being expelled for his Christian beliefs not fitting those of his college’s counseling program, no refund, nothing. Pastors being arrested for public proclamation of the gospel in ur “free” nation.
            The cost of following Christ is high, but consider the even greater cost of going against Him.

            The wicked shall be turned into hell,
            And all the nations that forget God. Psalm 9:17

            Psalm 7:10 My defense is of God,
            Who saves the upright in heart.
            11 God is a just judge,
            And God is angry with the wicked every day.
            12 If he does not turn back,
            He will sharpen His sword;
            He bends His bow and makes it ready.

          • Coach

            Why, so much anger, you have no idea what the Bible says, you just know you hate God. You are arrogant in your unbelief. You love your sin and the Bible tells the truth about you. Your heart is full of evil, lust, envy, hatred of good, but what I hear you saying is Hey coach stop worshipping Jesus and serve the sin nature, forsake the truth, return to the darkness, don’t you quote that Bible, I don’t like it. Because of Christ, I am no longer a slave to sin, no longer blinded to the truth, no longer addicted to porn. I couldn’t go back to the world even if God said I wouldn’t be judged for it.

            Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”Galatians 3:13

            Galatians 1:11 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. 12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.

            13 For you have heard of my former conduct in Judaism, how I persecuted the church of God beyond measure and tried to destroy it. 14 And I advanced in Judaism beyond many of my contemporaries in my own nation, being more exceedingly zealous for the traditions of my fathers.

            15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb and called me through His grace, 16 to reveal His Son in me, that I might preach Him among the Gentiles, I did not immediately confer with flesh and blood,

          • Eileen Dennis

            Did you ever thought what if there right and you could be wrong that there really is a God

  • Eileen Dennis

    When you give a atheist a inch they take a yard Christians should not be silent in the first place and let this happen Jesus spoke truth to the people or no one will be in heaven Christians have a voice need to use it or we will be responsible not let athiest take over

    • Mountain Dew Fan

      Um. All that the atheists are asking is for the principal of a school to OBEY THE LAW OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA! Gee, is that asking too much?

      • Slidellman4life

        What law would that be? I don’t recall hearing of a law passed that restricted religious expression. Maybe that’s because the Constitution says no.

        • Mountain Dew Fan

          If you actually read the article, the author points out that not only what the principal is doing is illegal and unconstitutional, but the principal actually admitted that he knows what he is doing is “crossing the line”, and continues to do it anyway. What he is doing violates the Establishment Clause. Here is a definition of the Establishment Clause from the LegalDictionary website.

          Establishment Clause:
          A clause in the First Amendment of the United States Constitution that prohibits the government from establishing an official religion, or taking actions that favor one religion over another, or over or a non-religion.

          The principal is a representative of the government because he works for a PUBLIC school. So he may not take ANY ACTIONS that favor one religion over another or over a non-religion.

          • Slidellman4life

            I’ve read the Constitution. The First Amendment says Congress can neither create its own religion nor keep people from practicing theirs. That’s it. All of this gobbledygook that you reference isn’t in there as it wasn’t intended to be, and it sure as hell wasn’t meant to be used as a weapon to abridge an individual’s right to free speech because of where he works.

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            Well … no one will ever know what the original intention was. However, the definition which I gave you is the one which the current Supreme Court of the United States currently uses. In fact, there is something called the “Lemon Test”, to determine if something the government is doing violates the Establishment clause.

            Under the “Lemon” test, government can assist religion only if (1) the primary purpose of the assistance is secular, (2) the assistance must neither promote nor inhibit religion, and (3) there is no excessive entanglement between church and state.

            So clearly what this teacher is doing violates number (2) as he is clearly trying to promote religion.

            I’m sorry that you do not like the way that the Supreme Court has interpreted the Establishment Clause, perhaps when you become a member of the Supreme Court, you can change it … until then … THIS is what the law is, like it or not.

          • Slidellman4life

            1) The “Lemon Test” is unconstitutional and therefore irrelevant.

            2) I ignore rulings that are unconstitutional. Whether you like it or not.

          • George T

            Seidel4life:

            1) The “Lemon Test” is unconstitutional and therefore irrelevant.

            Just because it’s not in The Constitution doesn’t make it unconstitutional. Chocolate cake and elephants aren’t in The Constitution. Are those unconstitutional also?

            2) I ignore rulings that are unconstitutional. Whether you like it or not.

            Good luck with that (^_^)

          • MountainDewFan4

            So ….. I guess what you’re trying to say is that YOU, slidellman4life, know the law better than ALL of the members of the Supreme Court of the United States, and more then all of the judges in the United States and better than all of the lawyers in the United States. Wow! Now that’s impressive!

          • Slidellman4life

            It means I am a Constitutionalist. If the Constitution says one thing, and a man or men in black robes say otherwise, you go by what the Constitution says. You want to change it? Get an amendment.

            It is not written anywhere that we have to accept and abide by a judge’s ruling, especially when they are legislating from the bench, as that in and of itself is unconstitutional (see: separation of powers).

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            Oh, so then to you it’s perfectly legal to steal your neighbor’s car, rape someone, or even murder someone?? Because NONE of those are actually mentioned in the Constitution.

            Believe it or not the Constitution does not cover EVERY SINGLE possible situation which may arise in this country. Therefore, there needs to be a group of people who’s job it is to interpret the Constitution and apply that interpretation to those items which are not specifically covered. The Supreme Court of the United States does just that and they have interpreted the Establishment clause to mean exactly what I stated previously.

            Don’t like it, write to the members of the Supreme Court and have them change it, or try to get yourself appointed to the SCOTUS and then you can change it.

          • Slidellman4life

            *facepalm*

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            What’s wrong? You finally see how silly your comments are?

          • Slidellman4life

            No. I am dumbfounded by your amazing stupidity.

            Oh, so then to you it’s perfectly legal to steal your neighbor’s car, rape someone, or even murder someone?? Because NONE of those are actually mentioned in the Constitution.

            Only a complete moron would write something like this.

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            “1) The “Lemon Test” is unconstitutional and therefore irrelevant.
            2) I ignore rulings that are unconstitutional. Whether you like it or not.”

            Only a complete moron would write something like this!

          • Slidellman4life

            A moron? Me? Hardly.

            See, if I was a principal or a teacher, and I wanted to talk about Jesus, I would. You gonna tell me I can’t? You can talk about homosexuality to kindergarten-age kids, you won’t bat an eye when you have kids being taught how to pray to “Allah,” but don’t talk about my Lord and Savior, not because the Constitution says so, but nine men in black robes do?

            Setting aside the hypocrisy, just what are you going to do about it? Are you going to fire me? Have me arrested?

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            Yes, I would tell you that you can’t talk to me about religion, I would bring it up with the school board and you could be fired. Many teachers have been fired for doing just that! Look up the names Walter Tutka, John Freshwater, and Robert Hudson to name a few. Also let’s see what happens to Principal McGrone.

            As a teacher or principal, If you do something against the law you can be fired. It’s as simple as that. Whether YOU personally think that it should or shouldn’t be illegal has NOTHING to do with it! Sorry.

            Also, I don’t believe that there are any PUBLIC schools that where “you have kids being taught how to pray to “Allah”.

          • Slidellman4life

            Yes, I would tell you that you can’t talk to me about religion, I would bring it up with the school board and you could be fired.

            Spoken like a true five-year-old. “Mommy! That man said ‘Jesus!'”

            Ever hear the words, “Build a bridge and get over it?”

            Look up the names Walter Tutka

            He was fired for mentioning the Bible and giving a student his personal copy of the New Testament in response to a student’s question. But the school district said it was insubordination. The matter was brought before the EEOC who ruled the school district acted in retaliation for Tutka’s speaking of Christianity, and as such violated the law.

            John Freshwater

            who apparently burned a cross onto the arm of a student

            and Robert Hudson

            When we reached out to Palm Springs Unified School District to comment on why Hudson was being let go, they were unable to comment due to confidentiality laws.

            The district did send us a potion of the education code stating, “Instruction about religion shall not promote or denigrate the beliefs or customs of any particular religion or sect, nor should a preference be shown for one religious viewpoint over another.”

            http://www
            .kesq
            .com/news/local-teacher-says-religion-may-have-cost-him-his-job/39255274

            Also, I don’t believe that there are any PUBLIC schools that where “you have kids being taught how to pray to “Allah”.

            https://www
            .youtube
            .com/watch?v=Z7-I9Qp3d4Y&feature=player_embedded

            Of course, the Freedom From Religion Foundation responded:

            https://www
            .youtube
            .com/watch?v=mlj_2ivCMlQ

          • Mountain Dew Fan

            Yes, a 5 year old might say that … but a grown up would state, “The principal of a school, by law, is not allowed to promote one religion over another. This is a violation of the Establishment Clause and he should be reprimanded for doing so. Furthermore, by his own accounts, he knows what he is doing is wrong, yet he continues to do it. ”

            Hmm… sounds like YOU need to “Get over it”. This IS the LAW. There is NOTHING that YOU can do to change that regardless of how many times you say that you think it is unconstitutional or whatever, it IS THE LAW, so GET OVER IT!

          • Slidellman4life

            So. You start the comment saying, “…what a grown up would state…” but you end it screaming. Like a five-year-old.

            Is this because you realize you lost the argument and so you are throwing a tantrum?

            Either way, I’m not impressed.

            Have a nice day.

          • MountainDewFan4

            So it’s OK for YOU to tell me to “Get over it”, but it’s “throwing a tantrum” when I tell YOU to “Get Over it”. Well played. Typical religious thinking … whatever YOU do is OK, but when someone else does the same thing, THEY are the ones who are wrong.

          • peanut butter

            See there… a COMPLETE circle!

          • peanut butter

            You can see that the atheists write down and memorize every name that they think they have beaten down. Arguing with an atheist IS like arguing with a 5 year old. They go around in circles so they don’t have to admit their fault when you prove them wrong. And they always try to place the blame on somebody else.

          • Eileen Dennis

            Jim Caviezel Testimony (Actor Who Played Jesus in The Passion of the Christ Film)
            Christus Rex 712,337 views please watch its on YouTube

          • Ambulance Chaser

            And yet, the entire country abides by the Supreme Court’s rulings. So I guess that is how it works, regardless of your opinion. But feel free to continue shouting, alone, as the rest of the country walks past you in the other direction.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            And in any case, SCOTUS’ authority to decide the law IS written somewhere. Article III of the Constitution:

            “In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.”

          • Ambulance Chaser

            Does that apply to everything, or just laws? I mean, would you travel to Honduras right now? I mean, zika is an unpleasant thought if ever there was one. Do you intend to will it out of existence as well?

          • peanut butter

            Here’s Thomas Jefferson’s explanation of ‘separation of church and state’. As a matter of ‘FACT’ this is where the original term came from.

            Letter to the Danbury Baptists

            January 1, 1802

            To messers. Nehemiah Dodge, Ephraim Robbins, & Stephen S. Nelson, a committee of the Danbury Baptist association in the state of Connecticut.

            Gentlemen

            The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing.

            Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should “make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

            I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.

            Th. Jefferson

            What it meant was to build a wall of separation, to keep the state from keeping citizens from using their right of freedom of expression of their religious beliefs, because the government has no right to establish one church as the single religion of America, like they had in England. Not the other way around. There is the explanation that you claim that “no one will ever know”.

          • MountainDewFan4

            Yes, I agree that is what Thomas Jefferson said. However, would he agree that having the government endorse one single religion over all others is very similar in nature to establishing one religion as the single religion of America? We’ll never know … however the SCOTUS do agree that this is how the Establishment Clause should be and will be interpreted.

          • namelessghost

            “The First Amendment says Congress can neither create its own religion nor keep people from practicing theirs.”

            That’s not what it says at all. You’re just making stuff up.

          • Slidellman4life

            Then why don’t you tell me what you believe it says.

          • George T

            Seidelman4life: I’ve already told you how SCOTUS says. They are the ones in charge of interpreting it. I agree with their interpretation. It’s reasonable, and allows everyone to practice whatever religion they wish.

          • peanut butter

            Hogwash!

          • MountainDewFan4

            What a well thought out and articulate argument. Care to expand on that?

          • Bob Johnson

            One could point to all the cases FFRF has lost or point to court cases were judges, governors, public schools, and other government employees are encouraged to set aside US law and use Divine Law instead. Of course reality is that slowly but most assuredly the FFRF keeps winning and the Establishment Clause remains to be a force against theocracy.

      • Eileen Dennis

        God wrote the law so obey gods law Matthew 22:37
        Jesus declared, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’

        • MountainDewFan4

          Gee … I’m sorry, but the United States of America is not a Theocracy … If you’d like to live in a country which observes God’s Laws over federal laws … perhaps you should move to Iran ??

  • Chris Decker

    Only an athiest can state that saying the name of Jesus and praying could mean that the US is becoming a Theocracy. The athiests should preach their religion elsewhere and leave people in peace.

    • TheBottomline4This

      If they don’t believe and think there isn’t a God, they should not be bothered by someone who isn’t real anyway, right?
      I don’t believe in unicorns, but won’t try to stop a principle from saying they’re real. SInce I don’t believe in unicorns…..if I hear him say they’re real, I’ll just smile and know they’re not. Why would I cause him problems unless I had an agenda? Hmmm.

      • Mountain Dew Fan

        If you do not believe in Zeus, would you want the principal of your children’s school to announce over the loudspeaker, “God does not exist, Zeus is the creator of the universe.” Of course not. Religious beliefs are something which the family should be teaching their children. Public school personnel should not be telling your students that their religious beliefs are incorrect and instead they should believe in this other religion. That is ILLEGAL!
        Religion is fine in your home, your church, etc. It is NOT OK for teachers or principal to promote religion in a public school!

        • Bob Johnson

          Yes, I would be upset,. As for the creation of the earth that was when Chaos yawned and brought forth Gaia (Earth), Eros,, the Abyss, and Erebus. Then came the Titans . Zeus is the sky god who ruled as king of the gods. He was a child of the Titans Cronus and Rhea

          • MountainDewFan4

            Damn it Bob, you’re not supposed to tell everyone the truth about how the Earth was created … now everyone is going to want to put little Zeus statues on their dashboards, and I just don’t have enough to go around. 😉

          • Bob Johnson

            Just send them a plastic swan – same thing really – only a little bit more kinky.

    • Mountain Dew Fan

      The atheists DO NOT want the school to promote their “religion”. They want the school to not promote ANY religion.
      They don’t want the principal to say on the loudspeaker, “God is great, let’s all pray to him”. This would promote Christianity which is illegal.
      They also do not want him to say, “God does not exist, stop praying”. This would be promoting atheism which is also illegal.

      All they want him to say about religion is …. NOTHING.

      Schools should not (and legally can not) promote one religion over another! This principal knows that what he is doing is illegal, but continues to do it anyway!!!!

      What would you say Chris, if the principal every morning told the students to kneel down, face the east and pray to Allah. Would you still say something like , The Christians should preach their religion elsewhere and leave people in peace???? Of course not! You would DEMAND that the principal was fired immediately … and I would agree with you because, as I stated before, a principal can not promote ANY religion!

  • dakdakdakdak

    If you think the FFRF is wrong, just imagine that the principal said “Allah” and “Mohammed” instead of “God” and “Jesus”.

  • ComeOnPeople!

    You are only allowed to promote perversion , atheism (which is a religion by the way), & Muslims but none of that Christian stuff that will promote love, honesty and doing right. NONE of that! How convenient for a corrupt government to control learning. History is repeating itself.

    • Jalapeno

      Secularism and atheism are not the same thing.

    • Mountain Dew Fan

      Who is promoting atheism in this story?

    • George T

      ComeOnPeople!: Atheism is a statement of lacking belief in a god or gods. Do you not know the defining qualities of a religion? Maybe that’s why your confused.

      • TheBottomline4This

        In your last sentence it’s you’re, not your.

        • George T

          TheBottomline4This: Your right! Thanks for the help, buddy (^_^)

  • Georgie Franklin

    Don’t pray in my school and I won’t think in your church.

    • TheBottomline4This

      As long as my tax dollars are paying for your school I can pray there anytime I want. I doubt you’d be in my Church, it would make you think.

      • Mountain Dew Fan

        Um … MY tax dollars are paying for MY school as well. So I would hope that in MY school all of the teachers and principal would obey the law.

        • TheBottomline4This

          As long as my tax dollars are paying for your school I can pray there anytime I want. Now if you want to change it to where my taxes won’t be paying for your school, then and only then will I not pray there. Until then…..

          • MountainDewFan4

            You actually can pray in you school or in my school. As long as you are not a teacher or a principal who is leading the students in prayer, or in one way or another endorsing or demeaning a religion to others.

    • gizmo23

      You won’t think anywhere.

    • Carlo

      Don’t prey on our kids.

  • C_Alan_Nault

    Christianity condones slavery.

    Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 )

    Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2)

    • TheBottomline4This

      It is estimated that there are today over 25 million people in the world who are subject to slavery: forced labor, sex trade, inheritable property, etc How are you helping them?

      • C_Alan_Nault

        How are Christians helping them? Their own “holy” book has no problem with slavery.

        • TheBottomline4This

          Each person, whether religious or not chooses if and how much they can or will help any wrongdoing in society.
          The purpose of the Bible is to point the way to salvation, not to reform society.
          Each of us are responsible for our choices that can affect society. I doubt you or I are responsible directly for the sad situations people in the world are suffering that are subject to slavery: forced labor, sex trade, inheritable property, etc. It is others beyond us who have caused or allowed those things to happen. Again…how are each of us addressing and helping those in these situations??? We should think about that and encourage others to also.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            “The purpose of the Bible is to point the way to salvation, not to reform society. ”

            The Bible tells the story of a vindictive capricious god that punishes people for the sins of others and takes great care to dictate what people should & shouldn’t eat, how their hair & beards should be trimmed, what they should & shouldn’t wear, a yet says nothing about slavery being bad.

            He also provides us with a long list of people we are to kill ( homosexuals, women who weren’t virgins on their wedding night, people who worship a different god, people who worship no god, etc.

          • TheBottomline4This

            So you hate God. Why even come on a site that is pro God? I don’t waste time on sites that are anti God, since I can’t change anyone’s mind on there, so I’m not sure why you are even here.
            It’ good you know “so much” about a book you don’t seem to care for. It’s good you know God is a He.
            It’s sad you have a twisted view of the Bible. The Bible includes things that are positives and negatives…that is how life is. Life has it’s positive and negative things. Look at the years after the Bible was in hand. There have been positive and negative things happen since then.
            If man is SO bright on his own without God, then why since the Bible came about hasn’t man made things better??? A lot of time has passed and things are still bad in many areas, if not worse. Why hasn’t mankind fixed all of that???

          • C_Alan_Nault

            I don’t hate god, I don’t believe god exists.

            “Why even come on a site that is pro God? ”

            I stumbled across the site and read the headline “Atheist Activist Group Wants Illinois Principal Fired for ‘Promoting Christianity’ to Students”. As an atheist, activities by atheist groups interest me, particularly when the group exposes illegal activities by theists.

            “It’s sad you have a twisted view of the Bible.”

            Point out where I misrepresented what the Bible says.

            ” The Bible includes things that are positives and negatives…that is how life is.”

            Sure. But the Bible isn’t life. The Bible is purported to be the word of god ( some believers call it the inerrant word of god). If it is the word of god, you should expect it to be perfect. Instead we read of a god who punishes people for the sins of others & condones slavery while taking great care to tell us how to trim our hair & beards, & what clothes to wear & which to avoid.

            Since the Bible does have so many immoral guidelines & laws, and so many errors and contradictory passages, there is no reason to believe it is anything more than a collection of fables & myths written by anonymous authors.

            “If man is SO bright on his own without God, ”

            Who has said this? I haven’t made that claim.

            “then why since the Bible came about hasn’t man made things better??? A lot of time has passed and things are still bad in many areas, if not worse. Why hasn’t mankind fixed all of that???”

            If you are a Christian, why haven’t you made everything better by praying? According to the Bible, Jesus said anything you ask for in prayer will be granted if you have even the smallest amount of faith.

            Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!

            Matthew 17:20 For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.

            Matthew 21:21 I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, ‘Go, throw yourself into the sea,’ and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.

            Mark 11:24 Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

            John 14:12-14 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I go to the Father. Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.

            Matthew 18:19 Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            ” Again…how are each of us addressing and helping those in these situations??? We should think about that and encourage others to also.”

            Sure. And religion isn’t needed when addressing & helping those situations.

    • Semp

      Wow, thanks SO much for bringing that up.
      Millions of Americans own slaves! It’s awful!
      I just looked at the calendar, it says it’s June 2, 1850.

      Oh, wait….

      • MountainDewFan4

        He is not saying that anyone currently owns slaves … The point he is making is that this Good and Holey book that Christians devote their lives to actually condones slavery.

        This book which is supposed to show Christians how to be moral, never once mentions “Thou Shall Not Own slaves”. Oh you can’t cook a goat in it’s own mother’s milk (or something like that) because that is a sin. You can’t take the Lord’s name in vain …. oh yeah that’s REAL important to make sure to point out. but not once … not once in the book which gives humanity ALL of it’s morals, does it mention that slavery is a bad thing!!

        • Semp

          OK, so you hate Christians for things that happened over a century ago, things we had no control over?

          Since you hate us because our holy book does not condemn slavery, then by that logic you should hate Americans because the US Constitution in its original form did not condemn slavery. The Founders talked about “freedom,” then formed a nation where slavery existed in all of the states at that point. So, go flip your middle finger at all Americans for the sins of the Founders. See how many friends that makes for you.

          You must be pathetically bored and unhappy if you have nothing in your life but blaming Christians for slavery, which ended in 1865.

          • MountainDewFan4

            I never said I hated you or Christians.

            Christians always state how they are so moral because the Bible teaches “perfect” morals which come directly from God. They also state that there is no way that atheists can have morals because they do not believe in God or the Bible.

            My point here is that the Bible IS NOT a perfect set of morals. The slavery topic is just one of a large number of questionable moral issues discussed in the Bible.

            Also no one ever said that the Constitution taught morals. It is simply the framework for our system of government. You are comparing apples and oranges.

      • C_Alan_Nault

        Apparently you have reading comprehension problems.

        No one has said Americans own slaves.

        I am only pointing out that according to the Bible, owning slaves is OK, and the new testament condones Christians owning other Christians as slaves.

        That being the fact, there is no reason anyone should use the Bible as their source for moral guidance.

  • Mountain Dew Fan

    For everyone who thinks that this teacher wasn’t doing anything wrong. Please answer this one simple question.

    What would you do if Every Morning the principal at the PUBLIC school where your children went to asked everyone to kneel and then led the entire school in a prayer to Allah?
    Would you:
    A) Say “That’s OK, he has every right to religious freedom and he can express his religious beliefs anyway he wants to.”
    B) Say, “Wait a second, he can’t force his religion onto MY children .. that’s not HIS job … that’s MY job”.

    Think about it… which would you say?

    • TheBottomline4This

      It’s easily avoidable for those of us who homeschool or have homeschooled 🙂

      • Mountain Dew Fan

        Ok … you got me there. But of course this article isn’t about a homeschooling principal 🙂

      • Ambulance Chaser

        That doesn’t answer the question.