Grocery Chain Apologizes After Atheist Activist Group Demands Store Decorate Ex-Muslim Cake

Cake-compressedFAIRFAX, Va. — A national grocery chain has issued an apology after a prominent professing atheist group submitted a complaint over a local store that declined to decorate a cake celebrating the third anniversary of an ex-Muslim group, stating that the requested wording might be offensive to employees.

According to reports, on May 31, a member of the Wisconsin-based Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF) contacted the Wegmans bakery in Fairfax, Virginia to request a cake that read, “Ex-Muslims of North America: Congratulations on three years!”

When FFRF phoned the location to confirm the order’s status, the representative was told by a bakery associate that the request could not be accommodated as the text could potentially be offensive.

It was later reiterated by the store that Wegmans declined the order because it did not want to take a side “one way or the other.” The supervisor stated that the store has “a lot of employees who are Muslim,” and that “employees may not know what this stands for.”

In turn, FFRF submitted a letter to the corporate office of Wegmans Food Markets, Inc. on Monday to allege that the Fairfax location had engaged in unlawful discrimination.

“Unlike the blatant discrimination some Christian bakeries have shown to LGBTQ Americans in the name of religious freedom, this appears to be discrimination against customers’ lack of religious belief—Wegmans essentially refused to serve a group of non-believers,” the correspondence read. “This raises serious concerns under federal, state and local civil rights laws.”

“Refusing to bake and decorate a cake for a group of ex-Muslims is refusing to provide equal enjoyment of goods, services, privileges, and advantages on the basis of religious identification,” it stated. “It is unlawful discrimination.”

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FFRF asserted that Wegmans’ declination of the order violated the federal Civil Rights Act, the Virginia Human Rights Act and the Human Rights Ordinance of Fairfax County. It requested that the cake be provided for free and that employees receiving training on the matter.

Wegmans Senior Vice President and General Counsel Stephen Van Arsdale replied promptly to the letter, advising that the order should have been fulfilled.

“Danny Wegman was very concerned about the incident described in your letter today, and asked me to look into it, which I have done with the Virginia division manager and the Fairfax store manager,” he wrote. “We have concluded that the bakery department made the wrong decision and that they should have made the cake as ordered. Our employees typically do an incredible job of serving our customers, but occasionally they make mistakes. This was one of those times, unfortunately, and we apologize.”

Van Arsdale also agreed to provide the cake at no charge.

While FFRF says that it is pleased with the outcome of the situation, others believe that Wegmans should be free to decline messages that it does not wish to write, just as Christians prefer to not engage in forms of personal participation at celebrations that violate their convictions.

A poll conducted by the outlet Opposing Views has found thus far that 67 percent of its readers believe that the store had the right to decline the order, while 33 percent said that Wegmans could not legally refuse.


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  • TheBottomline4This

    Glad the numbers are climbing of those who have left the evil islam. Congrats!!!

    • morgan

      You mean “another evil supernaturalism.” All supernaturalism is EVIL and CORRUPT to the core.

  • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

    What do these people have against cake? Why do they insist on trying to buy things that folks are not selling?

    • Theodore Fenton

      Apparently Wegmans DOES sell cake.

    • Peter Leh

      a bit of a confusing statement: “What do these people have against cake?”

      assuming “these people” are the atheist? They ordered the cake. how can they be against what they ordered?

      “Why do they insist on trying to buy things that folks are not selling?”

      you mean the cake on the menu? That cake Wegman is selling… but not selling?

      confusing indeed.

      • http://www.bing.com/ Martin Smit

        I propose that you are not confused, and you have nothing to say.

        • Peter Leh

          when quote you? I agree

  • Becky

    Congrats to ex-muslims from FFRF?? They’re both evil. They both teach lies and gravely mislead as many as they can.

    • Kieran Dyke

      Name one lie from FFRF. Provide evidence.

      (Or, is it Becky that is the deceitful party here?)

      • Joe

        You first. Name one lie found in the King James Bible. Provide evidence.

        • This style ten and six

          How about that story about the sun and moon standing still in the sky for about a day so that Joshua could slaughter more of his enemies.

          I don’t think I need to provide any proof that this is a blatant lie.

          • Jeremy Derby

            Actually you do need to provide proof of your claim that something is a lie. Your statement sounds more like you don’t believe something, just because you don’t believe it, does not make it a lie.

          • This style ten and six

            You obviously have not thought bout this. For the sun to appear to stop in the sky earth would have to stop rotating on its axis. This is obviously impossible.

            In fact the authors of the OT thought that earth was a flat disc covered with a hemispherical dome, the firmament. The sun, moon and stars moved around on the firmament so it was easy to believe that god could stop them. We have out grown such primitive beliefs.

            And by the way, that you believe something does not make it true.

          • Jeremy Derby

            Actually you are talking about a false assumption. Those that wrote the OT never though the earth as a flat disk, this was a false myth and theory that was later brought about to try and discredit them by claiming that those of the OT times and NT times believed in a flat earth, this was never actually true. I would encourage you to go the answersingensis page and look up the article on who invented the flat Earth theory. Considering the idea of a flat earth did not come about till nearly 300 AD, your claim seems to be a bit off.

          • This style ten and six

            Ha ha ha ha! Go to Answers in Genesis for information! The organization based on the big lie that earth is 6000 years old, you must be joking.

            I notice you haven’t addressed the sun standing still bit. I could list other biblical errors if I chose.

          • Jeremy Derby

            Considering you have not provided any source to the contrary I suggest you actually go to the source I provided and actually read what it says before you completely reject it.
            My belief is that everything in scripture is one hundred percent true to the genre that it is written. For example, historical sections are 100% true, poetic is 100% true to poetry, prophecy is 100% true. So yes I fully believe what scripture says about the sun standing still and say their are absolutely ZERO errors in God’s word. Since scripture represents approximately around 6,000 years from the beginning of creation till present day, than that two is what I believe. Rather than your a long time ago, or once upon a time myths of millions or billions of years.

          • This style ten and six

            Well, I see three errors in your post, not so many as in the bible but you should proof read.

            100% accurate phophecy! Nonsense. Most of it is self fulfilling. You are deluded if you believe everything in the bible and there is not much point in talking to you.

          • Jeremy Derby

            So the truth of it is you don’t believe a single thing scripture has to say, no matter how true it may be, and thus since I hold scripture up as truth, you aren’t going to believe anything I have to say, which will simply result in us talking in circles, which is sad because you could have learned a lot.

          • This style ten and six

            You seem to think I have no education, have done no reading. I think you are the one who has much to learn. To believe 100% in the bible requires a massive suspension of the critical faculties.

          • Jeremy Derby

            You are the one making accusing me of being deluded, giving the impression that I have no education. I simply said you could have learned a lot. Considering God is the only one that knows everything, we all have a lot to learn. To assume that you could learn nothing from me, assumes either you already know all that I know, or assumes that what I know is no value to you. Either way you are making assumptions about my knowledge and value. I have done lots of reading, I have earned a high level of education and continue to pursue more education. You fail to provide one lick of source of evidence to even back up your point of view, while I am gladly offering up sources and being completely open about my beliefs. You are the one who said that because I believe everything in scripture to be true than there is no point in talking to me. That falsely assumes that I know nothing. We all have a lot that we can learn.

          • This style ten and six

            That you accept the bible as 100% true and accurate shows exactly where you stand. You reject all scientific evidence of the beginning of the cosmos, the formation of our solar system, the beginning of life and the evolution of the myriad life forms we see today. In other words you are ignorant of modern science.

          • Jeremy Derby

            You are wrong. I accept modern science when they don’t use flawed dating methods. Nearly all dating methods they openly admit are only accurate to a few thousand years and beyond that it is all based on assumptions and guesses. There are many modern scientist that use the exact same evidence and study and say that it is proof of a much younger universe. I do not reject all scientific evidence, I reject evidence that is based on flawed methods and faulty assumptions. The conclusions that they come to are based on false assumptions. There is actually no evidence whatsoever to support macroevolution, which is the evolution you would be referring to if you support the theory of evolution. Microevolution which is simply slight modifications within a kind is supported, however it never changes the species from one to another. It just brings about different traits which is exactly what one would expect as the same type of creatures live in different areas of the world. You say I am ignorant of modern science, which I shows even more faulty assumptions, as I keep myself very well informed of what is going in the scientific community, as that is where my education lies, in science.

          • This style ten and six

            Your post shows you to be ignorant of modern science.

          • Jeremy Derby

            Which is based on your own opinion and false assumptions, rather than on actual facts.

          • This style ten and six

            The facts of evolution are well established. Only the ignorant deny them.

          • Jeremy Derby

            The facts of evolution are already what I shared to you, however you are choosing to deny those facts, so by your very own statement you are the ignorant one.

          • Joe

            FACTS
            About Evolution

            “Approximately 15 billion years ago, life began…”

            “No, it was more like 7 billion years ago…”

            “Uh, well, the earth probably began about…”

            “The strata may show…”

            “Well, we evolutionists don’t exactly agree about when, why or how the world began, but…

            Evolution is a fact and you are unscientific if you don’t believe it!”

            It is extremely interesting to me how educated fools have tricked the masses into believing in evolution. Evolution is not:

            repeatable,

            testable; or,

            observable.

            In other words, it
            doesn’t even qualify as real science. And I’m unscientific for
            believing what God has clearly told me about creation? Mmmm… You’ll
            never get me to believe a monkey is my uncle, a rat is my cousin, and
            that lice are my near kinsmen.

            “Through faith we understand that
            the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were
            not made of things which do appear.” —Hebrews 11:3

          • This style ten and six

            Approximately 15 billion years ago, life began…”

            “No, it was more like 7 billion years ago..

            You may have heard this from some crazy creationists but no scientist ever made those claims. The universe is 13.82 billion years old. Life began on earth 3.8 billion years ago.

            It is amazing to me that uneducated fools have tricked the masses into believing that Yahweh breathed on a handful of dust and created Adam. Evolution is true.

          • Bob Johnson

            He probably heard it from here –
            https://www dot jesus-is-lord dos com/evolfact.htm
            ( replace “ dot “ with “.” )

            In fact it is a direct cut (steal) of someone elses work.

          • Joe

            At the bottom of his home page in big letters is written, Public Domain.No Rights Reserved.May Be Distributed Freely. I never alluded to the fact that I wrote it myself. Your really something Bob. Hate the message so shoot all the messengers!

          • Bob Johnson

            Actually, if you check the jesus-is-lord website there is no such message at the bottom of the home page, nor anywhere else on the website.

            Second, even if such a message was on the website, the fact that you copied the text without modification and posted it under your own name constitutes plagiarism, which is an ethical problem for you. Intellectual property theft is theft. All that you might have achieved is the avoidance of the man-made laws of copyright infringement.

          • Joe

            The website is jesus-is-savior Bob and if you go to the bottom of that page you will find writen, “Public Domain.No Rights Reserved.May Be Distributed Freely”. Here is the definition of plagiarism:

            the practice of taking someone else’s work or ideas and passing them off as one’s own. Did I claim I wrote it myself. No Bob! Give me a break. You can’t even go to the right website to verify the claim. Ethical problem you say I have. You my friend have a wrong standing with God problem. An everlasting problem. I would quit worrying about me and start considering your eternal standing. You come off as somewhat intelligent yet you fell for Satan’s greatest strategy which is I do not exist, God does not exist. Wake up!

          • Bob Johnson

            You are correct the jesus-is-savior website does have the Public Domain policy as you stated. And that website may also have a copy of what you posted, however, that website is so poorly organized that it is difficult to find any particular information.

            My Internet search gave jesus-is-lord as the top hit for finding your text. Interestedly, the oldest post I found was a November 2011 Facebook copy of the text. Also another commenter, also named Joe, posted this exact text on a different article on this website just over two weeks ago.

            It is sometimes difficult to keep track, as both of the Joe users (yourself and this other person) are posting messages on this thread.

          • Joe

            Atheists on a Christian News Website trying to convince believers that we are wrong and they are right. Go figure.

          • Craig Reynolds

            ” Nearly all dating methods they openly admit are only accurate to a few thousand years” – Fine. So – PROVE these dating methods are inaccurate BEYOND the accepted range of a few thousand years – PROVE WHY Carbon 14 dating is unacceptable because it cannot pin a specific date of origin on any particular artifact. And while you’re at it, describe and validate the calendar system you’re using – Babylonian? Egyptian? Julian? Gregorian?

          • Jeremy Derby

            I don’t have to prove it considering the scientists that use it openly admit it. The specific calendar system I am using has no impact whatsoever on the accuracy or lack their of on dating methods so your question is not valid to the conversation at hand.

          • Edward MacGuire

            If you were educated in science (and paid for it), you should get a good lawyer and sue the institution for fraud because you definitely did not get what you paid for.

          • Jeremy Derby

            I don’t need to as they obviously did a good job with my education, considering I don’t rely on lies and deceit for my views of science.

          • Edward MacGuire

            In science things are correct or they are wrong.
            There are very few examples of “lies and deceit” in science, especially considering that there are over 1.5 million peer-reviewed papers published each year (2012 number approximate). Falsifying data is the kiss-of-death for any scientist. Dr. Steven Weinberg (Nobel Laurate 1979) in a recent interview said he was unaware of any examples of a violation of the standard codes of scholarly conduct and ethical behavior in Physics and Cosmology in the 50+ years he has worked in the field.

          • Jeremy Derby

            If your writing a paper based on a false belief and all of your peers that review your papers believe in the same false belief than there will be very little conflict on those papers. Just because a large percentage of scientist think something is true, does not make it true, they are making guesses based on flawed data and flawed dating methods. Whether someone is a Nobel recipient or not that does not change the fact that if they are swallowed up into the same delusion of several billion year old universe that has no actually real proof to support, versus a young earth/universe theory which actually is supported by the evidence, than they will always agree that it is billions of years old because they will never want to admit that they are wrong. They look at the exact same evidence, however because they go into looking at the evidence with the incorrect world view they come to the wrong conclusion.
            JD

          • Edward MacGuire

            If the first book of the bible did not exist no one would ever come to the silly conclusion that the earth is 6000 years old. Astrophysics, geology, genetics, particle physics, paleontology, archaeology, cosmology, chemistry all date things using very different methods and none show a young earth.
            When you look at the Andromeda nebula the light you see left there 2 million years ago. We know this because we know the exact amount of light radiated from objects like Cepheid variables and different type of novae, these objects exist there so we can calculate how far away they are. Any high school science student with data from a large telescope can make this calculation. It’s not a guess. It’s not a world view. It’ not a delusion. It is a fact.

          • morgan

            “….6,000 years from the beginning of creation (un)til present day.”
            HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH

          • Jeremy Derby

            You have no proof to the contrary to offer up, considering all dating methods that they try to use to say anything else all point to a few thousand years and are completely flawed beyond that, I would love to see your proof that does not rely on self admitted flawed methods to say anything else.

          • Joe

            You just don’t believe do you. Either you believe the word of God or you don’t. No big deal. So I am glad your convinced of what you believe, but you’ll never convince me otherwise. Have a good eternity!

          • This style ten and six

            Wow! Another who can turn off the cognitive faculty and believe the completly impossible.

          • Joe

            Spoken like a man without the Holy Spirit.

          • Joe

            Kinda of look like one too!

          • This style ten and six

            I don’t pay much attention to spirits which would have me believe that earth can stop rotating on its axis.

          • Joe

            Spirits (plural) . Wrong again. There you go with a false premise. Holy Spirit, as in singular. Please don’t comment or use the word of God to bolster your arguments. You don’t believe it. You don’t understand it.So why reference it. The author does not exist according to you.

          • This style ten and six

            I will comment however and use what arguments I please.

            The authors of the OT and NT existed, we just don’t know who most of them were. What we do know is that they were men.

          • GubbaBumpkin

            What we do know is that they were men.

            I have seen speculation that some of the books were written by women (Luke, Hebrews, Ruth)

          • This style ten and six

            Could be but I doubt it. Women were definitely second class citizens back then. Still are in that part of the wkrld.

          • Bob Johnson

            Spiirits (plural) – as in all the angles and archangels – the “Host of Heaven” if you will.

          • morgan

            Spoken like a man full of spirits (a drunk).

          • Joe

            Back to your bridge,troll!

          • GubbaBumpkin

            Which version of the discovery of the empty tomb do you believe? The four canonical gospels all disagree as to who was present, what they encountered, who they told about it. Do you believe all four of them?

            Do you believe both genealogies given for Jesus Christ? (Matt 1:1-17, Luke 3:23-38)

          • Kieran Dyke

            And, both of those genealogies run through Joseph, even though he allegedly wasn’t Jesus’ father.

          • Joe

            Luke is recording Mary’s genealogy and
            Matthew is recording Joseph’s. Matthew is following the line of Joseph
            (Jesus’ legal father), through David’s son Solomon, while Luke is
            following the line of Mary (Jesus’ blood relative), through David’s son
            Nathan. Since there was no Greek word for “son-in-law,” Joseph was
            called the “son of Heli” by marriage to Mary, Heli’s daughter. Through
            either Mary’s or Joseph’s line, Jesus is a descendant of David and
            therefore eligible to be the Messiah. Tracing a genealogy through the
            mother’s side is unusual, but so was the virgin birth. Luke’s
            explanation is that Jesus was the son of Joseph, “so it was thought” (Luke 3:23).

          • Bob Johnson

            So the Bible is not the inerrant Word of God, but is instead Luke’s explanation “so it was thought”?

          • Joe

            Come on Bob. With out a doubt the word of God is without error! The phrase ” as was supposed” refers to unbelievers during Christ time on earth did believe the virgin birth.

          • GubbaBumpkin

            Luke is recording Mary’s genealogy…

            Liar. Blasphemer. All Christians should condemn you for your lies about the word of God.

            Luke 3:3
            And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,…

          • Joe

            Pretty strong language coupled with no proof.Did I touch a nerve by proving all your talking points are bogus. And since you don’t believe in hell were would I be condemned to? Supposing I’m lying that is. and I’m not. And again, show me in the word of God were I’m wrong. By the way it’s Luke 3:23 and the phrase ” as was supposed” only means that unbelievers and Jews during Christ time on earth did not believe in the virgin birth. Hence Joseph being not his biological father. You don’t do well using the bible to make a point!

          • GubbaBumpkin

            And the number of generations from David to Joseph differs dramatically.

          • Joe

            The two genealogies of Luke is recording Mary’s genealogy and
            Matthew is recording Joseph’s. Matthew is following the line of Joseph
            (Jesus’ legal father), through David’s son Solomon, while Luke is
            following the line of Mary (Jesus’ blood relative), through David’s son
            Nathan. Since there was no Greek word for “son-in-law,” Joseph was
            called the “son of Heli” by marriage to Mary, Heli’s daughter. Through
            either Mary’s or Joseph’s line, Jesus is a descendant of David and
            therefore eligible to be the Messiah. Tracing a genealogy through the
            mother’s side is unusual, but so was the virgin birth. Luke’s
            explanation is that Jesus was the son of Joseph, “so it was thought” (Luke 3:23).

          • Joe

            Tomb version discrepancies are secondary accounts. As for the number and names of the women, none of the Gospels pretends
            to give a complete list. They all include Mary Magdalene, and Matthew,
            Mark and Luke also cite other women, so there was probably a group of
            these early disciples that included those who were named and probably a
            couple of others. Perhaps when the women came, Mary Magdalene arrived
            first and that’s why only John mentions her. That’s hardly a
            contradiction. In terms of whether there were/was one angel (Matthew) or
            two (John) at Jesus’ tomb, have you ever noticed that whenever you have
            two of anything, you also have one? It never fails. Matthew didn’t say
            there was only one. John was providing more detail by saying there were
            two. The most important thing Gubba was the TOMB WAS EMPTY!

          • Bob Johnson

            Plagiarized from Jesus Org from an article adapted from an interview with William Lane Craig and Norman Heisler

            http://www dot jesus dot org/death-and-resurrection/resurrection/do-the-resurrection-accounts-in-the-four-gospels-contradict-each-other.html

            replace “ dot “ with “.”

        • Jeremy Derby

          You make your comment sound like you think the King James version is the only accurate translation of the Bible.

          • Joe

            It is.

          • Kieran Dyke

            How do you know?

          • Joe

            King James bible comes from the Antioch text line (traditional) and all the others come from the Alexandria text line which is ripe with Gnosticism, Paganism and Arianism.

          • Kieran Dyke

            Why does this make the King James Bible true?

          • Jeremy Derby

            Please provide proof to this claim. I have studied into that claim in detail and found it to be very false.

        • Ambulance Chaser

          There are hundreds, but who cares? It’s not relevant to this discussion. If you’re really curious, you can read the Skeptic’s Annotated Bible.

          • Joe

            Name one. It all comes down to to faith. Have a nice eternity. By the way, don’t try to convince with your lies, it is kinda sad.

          • This style ten and six

            Noah’s global flood for starters.

          • Joe

            Faith!

          • This style ten and six

            Meaningless.

          • Joe

            You say that now

          • morgan

            What is that? A veiled threat? Stupid corrupt supernaturalists. When all else fails threaten violence. That’s what you clowns are all about.
            Filthy supernaturalists.

          • Jeremy Derby

            The Grand Canyon is pretty good evidence to support a global flood.

          • The Skeptical Chymist

            Ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!

          • This style ten and six

            Phooey!

          • morgan

            that’s very, very funny.

          • Kieran Dyke

            No. Faith won’t change anything. If what is written in the bible isn’t consistent with evidence, then it’s simply false, and no amount of deflectionist bleating will change that.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            So do you want an answer or not? Make up your mind.

          • Joe

            hmmm Skeptics Annotated Bible. I’m sure written by the inspiration of Satan himself. Yeah, I’ll rush right out and buy that.

          • This style ten and six

            You don’t believe in educating yourself then.

          • Joe

            You need to go back under your bridge

          • Bob Johnson

            You do not need to buy a copy. The Skeptics Annotated Bible is online and free. It is a copy of the King James Bible with highlighting and side notes to verses that Christian apologists need to clarify.

          • Joe

            Need to clarify? Why when the “commentaries” used to discredit the King James bible re bogus. Give me one example and I’ll prove it.

          • Bob Johnson

            How did Judas die? Matthew 27:5 or Acts 1:18
            http://skepticsannotatedbible dot com/contra/judas.html

            And this webpage then lists 17 Christian responses as to how to reconcile these Biblical texts.

          • Joe

            No, the Bible does not give two differing accounts of Judas’s death.The Bible critics say the following: “The Bible has mistakes. For
            instance, one passage says that Judas hanged himself, and another
            passage says that he fell and his guts burst out!” Bless their hearts,
            there is nothing illogical about the narrative those
            passages put forth. Is it not strange that Bible scoffers can speak the
            truth and, blinded by Satan (2 Corinthians 4:3-4), still miss it
            entirely? What they think is an error is actually truth in plain sight! Peter in Acts chapter 1, six weeks after Judas’ death describes Judas, “falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.” If
            we simply conflate Matthew’s account and Peter’s account, it makes
            perfect sense. Judas hanged himself and then died. Later, the noose
            broke and his body violently fell headfirst, spilling all of his guts on
            the ground. There is no contradiction concerning Judas’ death. Judas died once, and
            then, after death, his corpse was mangled. Judas died by hanging and
            then his lifeless body fell from the noose (probably because of an
            earthquake).

          • Joe

            …”17 Christian responses” …Do you think every Christian has all the answers to scoffers like you. And yet you claim all “17” responses are wrong, like that is going to bolster your scoffing.

          • Bob Johnson

            I have never claimed all 17 responses are wrong. I haven’t claimed any of the responses are wrong. I have, as you requested, pointed to an apparent contradiction in the Bible and show how a person can find answers to that contridiction.

            The Skeptic’s Annotated Bible makes statement that these responses are wrong.

          • Bob Johnson

            Precisely. Any straight forward reading of those two passages would lead a normal person to believe there is a contradiction. (The Skeptic’s Annotated Bible calls them contradictions not errors.) It is only with extra Biblical resources that we can track down how we have misunderstood the Bible.

          • Joe

            First, Judas died from strangulation (hung). Secondly, after he DIED, “falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.” That’s the precise facts. A straightforward reading, Let me ask you something Bob. Besides all the verses that you contend are contradictory, have you ever read a verses like these and understood them?

            1Corinthians 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of
            man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man,
            but the Spirit of God.
            12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the
            spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are
            freely given to us of God.
            13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s
            wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
            spiritual things with spiritual.
            14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of
            God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know
            them, because they are spiritually discerned.

            Spiritually discerned Bob. Do you have the Holy Spirit residing inside you?

          • Joe

            …”Precisely. Any straight forward reading of those two passages would lead a normal person to believe there is a contradiction”. A normal person, which you are referring to is a unbeliever, and destitute of faith and the ability to understand spiritually the word of God. Yet you put all your marbles and wisdom in the fact that you and the Skeptics Annotated Bible are somehow gospel truth.

          • Bob Johnson

            I will bet that you had extra-biblical help in discerning these two texts. In fact it appears to be plagiarism (stealing) from Shawn Brasseaux

            https://forwhatsaiththescriptures dot wordpress dot com/category/bible-contradictions-confusing-verses-simplified/why-does-the-bible-give-two-conflicting-accounts-of-judass-death/

            replace ” dot ” with “.”

          • Joe

            Stealing from Shawn? His articles can be used to further teach others and myself. That is like saying you plagiarized the Satanic Skeptics Hogwash! Were you self taught, or were you born a scoffer. I advise anyone reading this to visit and bookmark “For What Saith the Scripture”, “333 Words of Grace” and “Ambassadors for The Risen Christ Jesus”. Thank you Shawn, keep up the great work!

          • Ambulance Chaser

            You don’t buy it, it’s a website. And it’s 100% free. It’s the exact same King James Bible that you have sitting on your shelf, just with annotations that show where the mistakes, falsehoods and absurdities are. If you don’t believe me, open up your own Bible, read the website and follow along.

          • Joe

            The only absurdity, fake and falsehood is “The Skeptics Annotated Bible”.
            “the exact same” ehh? What are you a used car salesmen? You forget, the King James is the inerrant word of God not Satan’s “Skeptics Annotated”

          • Ambulance Chaser

            Are you unfamiliar with the definition of “annotated?” The text is the exact same as the King James Version, but with margin notes commenting on it.

            If you don’t believe me, go and look for yourself with a King James Bible on your lap.

          • Joe

            It is the margin NOTES that pervert, twist, falsify the written word of the King James Bible. The “notes” do not confirm the word of God as found in the King James bible they do the opposite!

          • Bob Johnson

            The entire field of Christian Apologetics is to explain this apparent disagreement between either various parts of the Bible or between the Bible and what most people today consider to be proper behavior. Without such lists the apologists would not be able to reconcile God’s views on a host of issues from slavery, women’s authority, free will, or the need for suffering.

          • Joe

            You said “God’s views on a host of issues from slavery,….” Let me provide you something to think about. Is Jesus Christ (God) ruling and reigning on earth right now. I don’t think so. If he was there would be no slavery, etc. Yes from the time of Adam to the death of Jesus Christ, God in various dispensation dealt with man accordingly. However now in our dispensation of the grace of God, God has set aside the nation Israel and it’s laws and favored status and now is dealing with both Jews and Gentile with no more distinction between us. Included in this new dispensation is the free gift of salvation and yes freewill to choose that gift or reject it. Start in the book of Romans and continue through to Philemon. Those are Paul’s epistles written to and for us today. Those are the epistles were we find are walk and will of God for us today. Satan has temporarily become the god of this world because of the fall in the garden. He is to blame for slavery, suffering etc.

          • Joe

            As well as our sin nature which we are all born with.

          • Joe

            In other words that’s where the “disagreements” arise from. They arise from people placing the gentiles under the laws and writings of the Old Testament. We as Gentiles were as Paul says here …
            Ephesians 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from
            the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants
            of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
            There is no confusion when you rightly divide the bible. All the of the bible is for us but not all of the bible is written to us or about us.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            No, they really don’t do any of that. They don’t “falsify” anything because they don’t alter or remove any of the text. They don’t “pervert” or “twist” anything for the same reason. They only comment on the text and point out errors in it.

            You would know all this if you would bother to go over there and read it. It’s not hard, and it’s free so there’s really no reason for you not to. Although I suspect that you’re probably afraid to because you live in Mortal Terror that you might read something that causes you to question the Bible.

          • Joe

            When it poins out errors it is saying what is written is false. Come on!

          • Joe

            I have no fear. I’m secure in the precious blood of Jesus Christ!

          • Joe

            Question the bible? The bible is Jesus Christ and no I do not question Jesus Christ I believe in His death, burial and resurrection unto eternal life.

            John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and
            the Word was God.

          • Joe

            And that does not mean the commentaries “annotations” found in the “wolves with sheep clothing” Annotated Bible.

          • Ambulance Chaser

            Right, but it’s not altering the text in any way.

          • Joe

            Do you now view the plain text of the King James Bible to have discrepancies and contradictions now that you have read the margins of the Skeptics Annotated Bible? The answer is obviously yes. Therefore Bob, is now the meaning of the verses of the King James Bible altered in your mind. I’ll answer that for you. Yes it has.

          • Joe

            Don’t you see, it may read on the left accurate but the intent on the right (the margin commentary) is to bring doubt,change,alter the INNERANT word of God

          • Ambulance Chaser

            The meaning of the words has not been altered. They still mean the same thing. It’s just that now I know which ones aren’t true.

          • Joe

            Scoffer!

        • GubbaBumpkin

          Name one lie found in the King James Bible. Provide evidence.

          “Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” – Matt 24:34

          • Joe

            He is speaking of the generation who witnesses all that he spoke of. Did you or they witnessMatt24:30 “…they
            shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with
            power and great glory.” Or how about this Matt 24:29 “…the sun
            be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the
            stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens
            shall be shaken:

            Nice try!

          • GubbaBumpkin

            No, they did not witness “the stars fall from heaven.” That would have wiped out all life on Earth. Science has told us a good deal more about astronomical bodies than was known 2000 years ago, including what stars are and their size relative to the earth.

            Also, your quotes are suspiciously choppy and out of context. It is almost as if you are “lying by omission.” It’s too bad you do not adhere to a religion that prohibits lying. Consider Mat 24:30 in its completeness:

            And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

            Are you claiming this was witnessed by all the tribes of the earth? Then how is it that no one outside Judea heard of it until missionaries spread the word, in some places not until hundreds or thousands of years later?

          • Joe

            The tribulation ( the time of Jacob’s trouble) the final 7 years. Those that are alive during that time period will witness those things spoke of in Matt 24.

        • Kieran Dyke

          No, that’s not how it works. The initial claim was that the FFRF teaches lies. I’m waiting for evidence.

        • morgan

          the whole stupid book.

          • Joe

            Go back to bridge troll!

        • C_Alan_Nault

          The Bible has god himself admitting he lied.

          Numbers 14:30 (KJV) Doubtless ye shall not come into the land, concerning which I sware to make you dwell therein, save Caleb the son of Jephunneh, and Joshua the son of Nun.

          He swore they would dwell there now he tells them they won’t.

        • C_Alan_Nault

          The Bible tells us god deliberately deludes people ( lies to them) so he can send them to hell.

          2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

          12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

          ( well, what can you expect from a god that ( according to the Bible) regularly punishes people for the sins of others?)

          God sends a spirit to lie to people & make them lie:

          1 Kings 22:21 And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the Lord, and said, I will persuade him.

          22 And the Lord said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.

          23 Now therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee.

          • Joe

            2 Thess 2:11 is speaking to unbelievers who like yourself reject the finish cross work and payment for your sins that Jesus Christ provides for you free. and verse 12 speaks of your fate not the fate of believers. 1 Kings his an account of God dealing with nation Israel and her enemies. It has nothing to do with you or I today. Do not take the words of God out of context or apply His word to you when He is not even speaking to you.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            The Bible specifically says “God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:”.

            This means that because god caused them to be deluded “they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness”.

            As I said, what can you expect from a god that (according to the Bible) punishes people for the sins of others?

            Neither of these actions ( deluding people so they become damned & punishing people for the sins of others) are the actions of a loving god.

            “Do not take the words of God out of context ”

            Can you present a context where it is moral to own other human beings as slaves? Both testaments of the Bible condone slavery, and the new testament says Christians can own other Christians as slaves.

            “or apply His word to you when He is not even speaking to you.”

            Now you claim to know the will of god & to know he ( or she, or it) isn’t talking to me?

          • Joe

            Why troll a Christian website anyway. Is it one of your Satanic mandates. Sorry old lies from your Daddy Satan sunk deep to your soul. Pathetic.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Sorry to disappoint you, but I’m not a Satanist. I’m an atheist, which means I don’t believe any deity exists & also that I don’t believe Satan exists.

            I noticed you didn’t point out anything in my post that was erroneous. I find it very amusing that when confronted with parts of the Bible they’d rather not know about, many Christians resort to name-calling rather than reasoned discussion explaining.

          • Joe

            That is a lie from the pit of hell and you continue to spread it.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            A lie? I am quoting the Bible directly. Are you saying the Bible is a lie from the pit of hell?

          • Joe

            You quote the bible directly then you take what is written and apply it to people it is not intended for. Then you comment on it erroneously. Pervert it. Twist it. Your a Scoffer, no big deal. You hate (or don’t believe he exists God). I get it. By the way, how did you muster so much faith to be an Atheist? My faith rests in Jesus Christ faith. Who does yours?

          • C_Alan_Nault

            “You quote the bible directly then you take what is written and apply it to people it is not intended for.”

            I didn’t apply it to anyone, I simply quoted what it said.

            “Then you comment on it erroneously. Pervert it. Twist it. ”

            Point out where my post of what the Bible says was erroneous, perverted, or twisted.

            “By the way, how did you muster so much faith to be an Atheist?”

            Not believing in something without evidence doesn’t require faith. Do you have faith that leprechauns don’t exist?

            ” Who does yours?”

            My faith in what? Be specific.

          • Joe

            You said “Point out where my post of what the Bible says was erroneous, perverted, or twisted.” and here it is ..”( well, what can you expect from a god that ( according to the Bible) regularly punishes people for the sins of others?)”. Give me an example. Most likely you are mixing the Nation Israel instructions together with instructions that belong to the individual Jew. You then said “Not believing in something without evidence doesn’t require faith. Do you have faith that leprechauns don’t exist?” Do you not understand the meaning of faith?

            Romans 8:24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope:for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
            25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience
            wait for it.

            You have faith that God does not exist. Is that specific enough?

          • Joe

            Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            Something hoped for doesn’t mean something that actually exists.

            “Evidence of things unseen” is meaningless, since evidence is the exact opposite of faith.

          • Joe

            Look, to you the word of God is meaningless, to mean it is the water of life! Words sometimes can not describe its significance to myself and other believers. It is fruitless to debate and reason with you any further on this matter. Have a good day.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            A god ( or goddess or multiple deities) may or may not exist.

            But even if someone proved a god exists, proving the Bible is an accurate account would be a separate issue.

            The fact that the Bible is filled with contradictions, scientific errors, & historical errors would suggest that the Bible is a collection of fables & stories, not the word of a god.

          • C_Alan_Nault

            ” here it is ..”( well, what can you expect from a god that ( according to the Bible) regularly punishes people for the sins of others?)” Give me an example.”

            1) I am presenting my opinion. Personally, I think that punishing someone for the sins of another person is wrong… you may think it’s OK.

            2) I’ll give you several examples according to the Bible:

            Everyone who has ever existed is punished for the sin of Adam and Eve

            GE 3:16 Women should suffer pain during childbirth.

            ( this punishes ALL women because of Eve’s sin)

            GE 17:14 A child is to be punished when his parents neglect to have him circumcised.

            ( this punishes the child because the parents didn’t have him circumcised… punishing the boy for the sin of the parents)

            DT 23:2 A bastard–and his offspring to the tenth generation–are to be punished for his illegitimacy and cannot enter a congregation of the Lord.

            ( so, some ancestors had a child out of wedlock & anyone born from that bastard — for 10 generations— are punished)

            God punishes children for the sins of their fathers, unto the third and fourth generations. (Exodus 20:5 & 34:7)

            This example is particularly disturbing: David sins & to punish him, god decides because David sinned, his wives ( plural) shall be raped in public by his neighbors. David repents & god decides to not have his wives raped… instead for his sin, god kills David’s child.

            2 Samuel 12:11-14

          • C_Alan_Nault

            ” Do you not understand the meaning of faith?”

            The definition of faith is: a belief that is not based on proof.

            “You have faith that God does not exist.”

            Wrong. I have seen no evidence a god exists, so I don’t believe a god exists.

            I assume you don’t believe in leprechauns, or Thor, Odin, Zeus, Apollo, etc because you have seen no evidence that they exist.

      • Becky

        The atheist group known as FFRF has spewed many lies, but there are two great lies they teach that have misled many and have caused great chaos in our country…

        The first great lie…there is no God.
        “The fool has said in his heart, ‘There is no God.’ They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none who does good.”
        Psalm 14:1 (Romans 1:28-32)

        The second great lie…the separation of Church and State is within the US Constitution.
        “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
        First Amendment of the US Constitution

  • Mythblaster

    “Opposing Views has found thus far that 67 percent of its readers believe that the store had the right to decline the order”

    That’s an indication of the level of ignorance of Opposing Views’ readers. If you go into business to serve the public, you’ve gotta serve everybody.

    • Ambulance Chaser

      No you don’t. You can refuse to serve any customer for any reason, unless that reason is the customer’s membership in a protected class.

      In this case, I think the store could legitimately argue that they werent denying service to the FFRF because they’re atheists or ex-Muslims or anything else. They were denying service because they felt the message they were being asked to write was offensive. would have happily served the same group if they were asking for a different message.

      Now, the flip side of that is that you can’t refuse service to an entire class and then hide behind “I’m not discriminating, I just don’t put this message on cakes” when “this message” is a neutral or positive statement about said group.

      So I really don’t know how this case would shake out if it went to trial.

      • GubbaBumpkin

        There was no “message” on the cake beyond the name of the group.

    • Cuda

      no you don’t

  • Nidalap

    Taking on the “protected class” whose members might just take it into their heads to take yours, hmm? That’s a bit more bravery than I’m used to seeing from the FFRF.

    Inspired by Orlando, perhaps?

    • Ambulance Chaser

      Are Ex-Muslims known for trying to take people’s rights away?

      • Nidalap

        I don’t really know. It’s irrelevant, however, since the CURRENT Muslims I was referring to actually are known for such…

  • Theodore Fenton

    Thank goodness for groups like Freedom From Religion Foundation. I’m a proud supporter.

    • hytre64

      That God for Jesus Christ. I’m a proud supporter.

  • Grace Kim Kwon

    Stores and bakeries should have full freedom. Atheists and Sodomites should bake their own cakes.

    • This style ten and six

      Stores have full freedom to sell their stuff; they don’t have freedom to discriminate.

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        You secular Americans are being too spoiled and being terribly bored, but don’t push your mental illness upon others. People have a right to common sense.

        • Theodore Fenton

          That’s hilarious! Pot, meet Kettle.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Remember Americans are not brighter than the Germans. Don’t go for atrocities.

        • This style ten and six

          Common sense tells me that there is no god who is interested in my affairs.

          • Jeremy Derby

            And common sense tells me that God is interested in you and your affairs. =)

          • This style ten and six

            I have done quite well without god’s interest, thank you.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            God created you. You must repent of your evil and ask Him for forgiveness. Read John ch. 3.

          • This style ten and six

            Are you calling me evil? You don’t know me, you have no evidence, so I suggest you back off with your insults.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            It’s a fact, not insults. The Holy Bible says everyone is a sinner. Read Psalm ch.14 and John ch.3 and repent of all your sins. The most evil sin is the unbelief in God.

          • This style ten and six

            Phooey! Or pfui if you prefer.

          • GubbaBumpkin

            The Holy Bible says that rabbits chew their cud, that bats are a type of fowl, and that insects have four legs. Read Leviticus 11.

      • Jeremy Derby

        Stores do not have the freedom though to force an employee to do something that violates their religious beliefs.

        • Grace Kim Kwon

          Exactly. People should stop demanding others to do evil. Freedom is for following God properly.

          • This style ten and six

            I guess following god properly is your way alone.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Read the Holy Bible. It’s the only reason your civilization has been superior than all the others and the USA was created. Today’s Ex-christian West’s infanticide and Sodomy are a cancer to the world. Don’t rush to fulfill the Revelation manually.

          • Bob Johnson

            And all this time I thought it was our nuclear hegemony. After all, it wasn’t until after WW II that we became a power in world affairs, let alone a superpower.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            No, you guys were pretty strong even before WW2. Strength and wealth mean nothing to a nation or empire when you have no godly descendants. The Western nations’ strength was a character; but that is forever lost in the absense of Christianity. Foreigners will occupy the land. The land belongs to God.

          • This style ten and six

            Relax, if you carry on like this you’ll do yourself an injury.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Liberty is for speaking up the truth. If people get afraid now, USA will be like Nazi Germany and it’ll be too late for everyone.

        • Ambulance Chaser

          Depends on what your religious beliefs are. If your religion forbids you to wash your hands after going to the bathroom, you better believe your employer can order you to “violate your religious beliefs.”

    • This style ten and six

      You are offensive, Madam.

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        Truth is offensive to sinners and facts are offensive to atheists. No submission to Sodomic West’s slave owners. Never again. You guys need Christianity to be proper. Immoral blasphemous Western culture offends Christians all the time. You guys should experience some hard time to regain humanity. You’ve been spoiled too much by the gentle churches for the longest time, and that’s one of the reasons the Western culture has plunged into hopelessly immoral state. Respect your parents.

        • Bob Johnson

          “No submission to Sodomic West”
          Places fist on ear. I can not help but read this and think of Monty Python’s, “Life of Brian”.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            American bullies should give up their slave owners’ mentality. Read “Uncle Tom’s Cabin.” Stop forcing people to do evil. No one should obey Sodom.

        • This style ten and six

          You tend to your knitting and we’ll look after ours. Fume away, same sex marriage is here to stay.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            No, same-sex “marriage” is not marriage according to God’s Word; you have no rights to demand the Christians or any moral people to condone it in any way.

          • This style ten and six

            It is here, call it what you like, it makes no difference.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            Truth is utmost important. The West is regressing because it ignores the truth unlike yesteryears. The West was the only civilization where many risked life to get the access to God’s Truth, the objective truth. The Westerners must re-study the Holy Bible and their own history instead of protecting sexual chaos like some madmen.

    • GubbaBumpkin

      Stores and bakeries should have full freedom. Atheists and Sodomites should bake their own cakes.

      How about black people? Should stores be free to refuse service to them?

      • Grace Kim Kwon

        Today’s Western nations’ evil is to treat the colored people and sexually immoral people in the same category. Being colored is God’s creation. Being gay or transgender is a willful sin. You guys lost common sense altogether when you lost Christianity. Stop forcing your depravity upon the poor nations. Enough atrocities from the rich pervs in the West.

        • Bob Johnson

          How, considering the vast number of Christians who have failed at both conventional and conversion therapies, can you call being gay or transsexual “willful”?

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            You think it’s okay and that’s the exclusive top reason that you got sick. Any sin is like that. It’s a defect of the culture. Read Romans ch. 1 to see how you got it. That chapter summarizes the US secular history. Read on to chapter 8.

          • Bob Johnson

            What makes you think I am sick? What sickness do you think I have?

            I asked you how you consider gays and transsexuals “willful” yet many spend much time and effort trying unsuccessfully to become heterosexual.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The term has wider meaning. Sickness = supporting of homosexuality and transgenderism, not just actually carrying the acts. The LGBT people have problems because of the culture’s permissiveness. Beliefs cause actions. They can change themselves by repentance and trusting in God alone. In any case, Sodomites must never demand others to condone in any way such depraved lifestyles. They can intimidate those who are cowardly or illiterate, but they can never overcome God’s people who hold onto the Word of God. The West must not persecute the Christians for refusing to obey Sodomites. It’s another new form of slavery and atrocities against mankind.

          • Jolanda Tiellemans

            They can intimidate those who are cowardly or illiterate,

            They didn’t intimidate me in any way and I’m not a coward or illiterate. Try again.

            They can change themselves

            No they can’t. Can you change to be no longer hetero? I can’t.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            It’s about mentality’s sickness. You are a willful complier because you grew up in such a culture, but Sodomites must not demand obedience to those who disagree with them. It’s a tyranny by immorality. Yes, they can change, once they admit that homosexuality is sin and trust in God for help. The permissive culture has been toxic to them.

        • GubbaBumpkin

          Was that a yes or a no? The Bible is very clear in its support of slavery and condemnation of miscegenation.

          • Grace Kim Kwon

            The Holy Bible commands no abuse of those who are under the authorities of another. Mankind will always have some types of employees that the Holy Bible must be applied. Abolishment of official slavery is a Christian conviction in the New Testament era. Mankind has no other. There will be always practical slaves on earth because some humans just refuse to use brain. (Victims of crimes are exceptions) Today, unwanted children are treated as sub-humans by willfully evil people and evil government bodies. You guys have no hope of carrying out any justice as long as you hate the Holy Bible. You need the Holy Bible to be saved and to become civilized humans.

  • Cuda

    This actually should be easy to defend, nothing in the requesting lettering suggest they are non-religious, based on that alone the case should be tossed ….

  • Peter Leh

    ““Ex-Muslims of North America: Congratulations on three years!””

    not hate speech.

  • Becky

    The atheist group known as FFRF has spewed many lies, but there are two great lies that have misled many and have caused great chaos in our country…

    The first great lie…there is no God.
    “The fool has said in his heart, ‘There is no God.’ They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none who does good.”
    Psalm 14:1 (Romans 1:28-32)

    The second great lie…the separation of Church and State is within the US Constitution.
    “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
    First Amendment of the US Constitution

  • Rev Donald Spitz

    Christians should not have to bake cakes for sodomites if they don’t want to.