26 Dead Following Mass Shooting at Texas Church

SUTHERLAND SPRINGS, Texas — 26 people were killed on Sunday after a gunman walked into a Baptist church in Texas and began firing.

According to reports, a man now identified as Devin Kelley, 26, walked into First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs at approximately 11:20 a.m. and opened fire on the 50-member congregation. He was dressed in all black, and was wearing tactical gear.

26 people have now died from their injuries—23 inside the building and two outside, with one member dying at the hospital. 20 others have also been hospitalized. Among those killed was the 14-year-old daughter of pastor Frank Pomeroy, who was not present this morning. One woman was pregnant.

“My dad saw the gunman run into the church building and then he heard shots and saw people running,” local resident David Flores, 26, told CNN. “People covered in blood and screaming. It was pandemonium everywhere.”

A local resident engaged Kelley outside of the church with a rifle, causing the gunman to flee. He was later found deceased in his vehicle in nearby Guadalupe County.

The FBI and Texas Rangers are currently investigating the situation, and according to Fox 5 News, authorities are working on removing the bodies.

“There are no words to describe the pure evil that we witnessed in Sutherland Springs today,” Gov. Greg Abbott said during a press conference Sunday evening. “There are 26 lives that have been lost. We don’t know if that number will rise or not; all we know is that’s too many, and this will be a long, suffering mourning for those in pain.”

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“We ask for God’s comfort, for God’s guidance and for God’s healing for all those who are suffering,” he continued. “As governor, I ask for every mom and dad at home tonight—that you put your arm around your kid and give your kid a big hug and let them know how much you love them, knowing that we support each other.”

The tragedy is stated to be the worst mass shooting in Texas history. A motive is not yet known.

As previously reported, on Sept. 24, a shooting also occurred at Burnette Chapel Church of Christ in Antioch, Tennessee. Emanuel Samson, 25, killed a woman in the parking lot before entering the church and injuring seven others. Samson later told police that he had “heard voices” prior to the act.


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  • This style 10/6

    And still the NRA will insist that there should be no control on the kind of guns allowed.

    • Lark.62

      Yes. How many more Americans will die because we cannot stand up to gun manufacturers?

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        “How many more Americans will die because we cannot stand up to gun manufacturers?”

        right …. blame the tool and the tool maker …… not the tool USER …… what tool you are ………….

        • james blue

          So the problem isn’t guns, it’s people with guns?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope ….. it is BAD people with guns …..vs. ….. GOOD people with guns …… and if more of the people in that church had been carrying …… there probably would not be a pastor with a dead child ….

            Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
            Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

          • james blue

            So……… Should we try to make it slightly more difficult for bad people to have guns?

            As for the other part of your comment. The right “good guy” with the right temperament, well trained and practiced “might” be able to limit the deaths caused buy the bad person with unlimited access to guns, there’s no guarantee. The wrong “good guy” person with a gun, poorly trained and not practiced in that kind of situation is just as dangerous to themselves and those around them as the bad guy.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sure …. where is your “bad person detector” ………. oh, right …. gotta go invent that ….. let me save you some time ….. there are no “good people” ….. no …. not even one ….

            “The right “good guy” with the right temperament, well trained and practiced “might” be able to limit the deaths caused buy the bad person with unlimited access to guns, there’s no guarantee.”

            hmmmmm ….. “with the right temperament, well trained and practiced” … yeah … MASSIVE HOLES in that line of logic …… so like maybe just the police with guns ….. so you desire a police state …… REALLY ……. “buy the bad person with unlimited access to guns, there’s no guarantee” …. i am going to assume you meant to type “but” …… again …. THERE ARE NO GOOD PEOPLE ….. just those that act “good” at the right time ….. and the more people who are armed ….. the greater the possibility that will occur when the time comes …..

          • james blue

            Well the shooter in this instance. A wife beater, a child beater who was dishonorably discharged from the military. DO you think there might have been some indication with him?

            Seems you are going the strawman AND projection route with the “right person” response.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            typos are not a problem …….. and the “y” and the “t” are right there also …… but anyway …. there were all kinds of “indications” ………. so what ……… Paddock had absolutely no “indications” …….. so what good is it to rely on that kind of ILLOGIC ……..

          • james blue

            Could you retype that in English for me?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            there were all kinds of “indications” ………. so what ……… Paddock had absolutely no “indications” …. all of his guns were obtained LEGALLY …….. so what good is it to rely on that kind of ILLOGIC …….. that somehow you can keep the mentally ill from anything ….. you GROSSLY underestimate the human ingenuity to commit evil …………

          • james blue

            Who has said it would end all incidents? Murder is illegal, yet that hasn’t ended murder, so should we just legalize it?

          • Maxwell Edison

            You can either provide a single, verifiable instance (with citations) of a firearm acting completely on its own accord and committing a violent crime (ie an armed robbery) or you can shut your flipping mouth.

          • james blue

            You must be the captain of your kindergarten debate team.

          • Maxwell Edison

            Sounds like you want to wallow in the complete abandonment of common sense and logic and get away with it.

            Why else would you throw out stupid insults and red herrings?

            The challenge stands. Put up or shut up.

          • james blue

            By all means quote where I said any gun acted alone Jerome.

          • Maxwell Edison

            Red herring.

            Admit you have nothing and remain silent.

          • james blue

            Are you on drugs?

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            Why would you say that to a *Christian* on a *Christian* site?

          • james blue

            What makes you think he or she is a “Christian”?

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            james what you and your Atheist friends are doing to Maxwell and the other Christians is causing my heart to grieve for them. You know he is a Christian. That is why you and your friends are harassing him so much. That is the greatest proof that he is Christian. You and your fellow Atheist are doing him wrong as well as the other Christians on this site. I pray God will stop you and stop your fellow Atheist from doing this to Christians.

          • james blue

            Now you are accusing me of being an Atheist. I suspect just like all your other accusations you cannot provide any proof.

            Thou shall not bear false witness. You might wish to think about that.

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            I am accusing you of hating Christians so much that you come here to harass.I pray for Gods Justice for what you are doing to Christians. My heart grieves for the Christians you hate.God knows what you are doing and why you are doing it.

          • Honestly! LOL It’s the Inquisition!

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            james, You asked me what makes me think Maxwell is a Christian. Your comment you made to him shows me he is a Christian. Your bragging about him being banned an other names also shows me he is a Christian. There are some Atheist who you are connected to who are saying the same things as you are and are also bragging about the banning.This also proves he is a Christian.I will continue praying for his protection as well as the other Christians on this site.These Christians are my brothers and sisters in Christ and I love them

          • james blue

            I am not a mod, but as far as I can tell he was banned for trolling. He made zero “Christian” comments, made things up about people (as you are doing). Harassed others. He was banned and has come back under a different name to bypass the will of the site owners.

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            You and your fellow Atheist troll the Christians on this site. You all should be ahamed of yourselves. You and they are cruel.

          • james blue

            Have you noticed that I only ever REPLY to them (and you) when they (and you) reply to a comment of mine? I don’t go around (unlike you) harassing them. You have still to provide a single example of me doing what you have accused me of, but if you don’t like my comments feel free to not read or respond to them, Better still you have the ability to simply block me.

            I suspect something about you, but I haven’t posted it as (unlike you) I don’t accuse people without evidence.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope …. it is SIN that is the problem ….. the weapon is entirely inconsequential …… a supposed “pressure cooker” was used in Boston …. wanna ban them too …………

          • james blue

            My comment history is open to public view, please feel free to link to any comment I’ve ever made saying ban guns.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you are pushing for more restrictions on the purchases of weapons …. anything can be a weapon ….. the only purpose of continued restrictions in the face of the 2nd amendment is to ban …. either on an individual basis or collectively ….. i dont have to search your history ….. it is right here on this page …… how was the haircut ……….

          • james blue

            Again please feel free to quote from my history and back up your accusation. You can also quote this page.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i already did …….

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Gun-Controlled Chicago Nearing 600 Homicides for 2nd Time Since 2003 …….. hmmmmmmmm ……………

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Japan knife attack: At least 19 dead
            26 Jul 2016 … (CNN) At least 19 people were killed and 26 injured in a stabbing spree at a facility for disabled people west of Tokyo, making it one of Japan’s …

            HURRY ….. BAN ALL THE KNIVES ………….. HURRY, HURRY, HURRY ……………………

            STAND UP TO THE NKA ………….. (national knife association) ………….

          • james blue

            Hmm, just discovered it’s time for a haircut, my eyes rolled back so far

          • Yep. You got it.
            Criminals don’t register their guns or get them legally. The Texax shooter wasn’t allowed to legally own a gun, but of course, this doesn’t stop a criminal.

            I’m glad I had my shot gun when someone tried to break into my house. Didn’t even have to use it. Just cocked it behind the door. 🙂 Worked like a charm.

            We are the only country with the Constitutional right to bear arms.

            The first and biggest sign of a dictatorship is an unarmed populace. Which is why HItler instituted a national gun registry. So he knew right where to go to disarm the population.

            Our right to bear arms not only deters crime and protects us from criminals, but also from our government, which was the reasoning for our 2nd amendment right.

            Don’t let politically correct morons lie to you and weasel your gun bearing rights away. You WILL regret it.

          • james blue

            So because people can buy guns illegally we shouldn’t have any prohibitions on certain people buying them?

          • There are prohibitions on certain people buying them. Like if you have any kind of a record, any domestic violence or violent crimes, criminal record, etc.

            But of course that is exactly why CRIMINALS get guns illegally. To get around the restrictions that prevent them from getting a gun legally.

            So the problem is NOT legal gun owners, but people who get them illegally. The criminals are the ones you need to go after.

            That’s like, if one person went around stealing cars, and you took cars away from everyone. Makes no sense.

            Why would you punish law abiding citizens, and take guns away from them so that they can’t defend themselves against the criminals?

            If you go after LEGAL gun owners, then only the criminals will have guns since they ignore the law. And that just RAISES the crime rate.

            Plus, the first sign of a dictatorship is an unarmed populace. Why do you think Hitler created a federal gun registry? So he knew where the guns were before he took them away. The worst thing you could do is punish LEGAL gun owners. We NEED a second amendment.

          • james blue

            Okay, but how does a gun store tell who is legally entitled to purchase guns. My comment history is open to public view, if you can find anywhere I’ve suggested guns should be banned for law abiding people, please link to it.

            I do not think a background check infringes on my right to own guns, actually amend that to background checks DO NOT infringe on my right to own guns….Because I pass them.

          • ?? They do a background check on you, of course. I never said that background checks infringed upon my rights. I did say that any national gun registry or database was a very bad idea, though. So not sure where this came from.
            YOU said that we should have prohibitions on people that buy guns, and I said that we already did. So your question is?

          • james blue

            I think you have missed the point of that comment and the context regarding what it was a reply to.

          • I think you missed my point. YOU said that we should have prohibitions on people that buy guns, and I said that we already did. Pretty simple. If you have a further point, then spit it out.

          • james blue

            I didn’t say we don’t have restrictions.

          • Then why ask this question: So because people can buy guns illegally we shouldn’t have any prohibitions on certain people buying them?

            ?? Spit it out, man!

          • james blue

            Because of what you wrote about people buying guns illegally.

            What you apparently think my question says and why it apparently offends you so much is a bit of a mystery

          • You suck at answering questions. I wasn’t the one that posted anything previous to your post, for one.

            For another, I was never offended by your question. I just asked you to explain what you meant.

            And you still haven’t explained what you meant.

          • james blue

            Oh well, I guess you are going to have to live with that.

          • LOL! I’m so deprived!

            What a troll. 🙂

          • What does this mean?
            And what are you indicating with ” So the problem isn’t guns, it’s people with guns?…………… Interesting. ” ??

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        FYI ………… REPORT: Armed Citizen ‘Engaged’ Killer, Ending Rampage … and ….. TEXAS SHOOTER LIKED ATHEIST FB PAGES & SJW CAUSES
        Also was a fan of CNN

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        You mean like how many Native Indians died because they were unarmed? Remember, the first thing dictators have done is unarm the masses.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        Japan knife attack: At least 19 dead
        26 Jul 2016 … (CNN) At least 19 people were killed and 26 injured in a stabbing spree at a facility for disabled people west of Tokyo, making it one of Japan’s …

        HURRY ….. BAN ALL THE KNIVES ………….. HURRY, HURRY, HURRY ……………………

        STAND UP TO THE NKA ………….. (national knife association) ………….

    • Mark0H

      As if you cared about these people. They were Christians, the people you don’t like.

      • This style 10/6

        Don’t be ridiculous. I like many people who are Christians, church goers and I certainly don’t want to see anyone shot.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      you live in canada …… what do you care what the gun laws are here ….. take your crocodile tears elsewhere ……….

      • This style 10/6

        Being Canadian doesn’t mean that I don’t regret pointless killing, wherever it may be.

        I wish that the US had as few or fewer killings than we have. I do have American relatives.

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          blah, blah, woof, woof ……. you are a castrated nation …… have fun with that ….. no REAL men up there ……

          • This style 10/6

            You are among the most unpleasant, rude, thoroughly nasty people I have ever met. You go well with your hero, Trump. I have only ever blocked one person and you will be proud to be number two.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Trump is not my “hero” ….. did not even vote for him …… so not sure what that is about other than your prejudiced opinion ……….. i have never blocked anyone …… and you can count yourself in that group ………..

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You’re wrong about that. Remember the attack on our House of Commons and how quickly that was put to a stop. We have a huge host of problems right now with a very ineffective leader, but we had a good, Christian leader for 10 years while you guys had Obama.

          • This style 10/6

            We do have problems but they are mostly caused by the man presently heading the US. Trudeau is well respected in Canada and around the world.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            That’s nonsense. Donald Trump can’t control what happens here. Justin Trudeau isn’t respected here or anywhere in the world. He’s laughed at. His own father didn’t want him running for office because he knew it would be the name and not the talent that would get him elected.

          • This style 10/6

            I guess you are a Tory so nothing Trudeau does will be acceptable to you and Trump is the man.

            Look at NAFTA, softwood lumber for ways in which Trump is affecting us.

            Trudeau is not laughed at and will be in power for the next 6 years at least. The Tories election of Scheer guarantees that.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            I’m not affiliated with any party. That’s one of the great things about Canada – we have plenty of choices.

            NAFTA isn’t responsible for Trudeau bringing in policies that are fueling anti-Semitism, encouraging crime against average Canadians and leaving us defenseless, or bad border policies that very well may annihilate our Canadian principles.

          • This style 10/6

            Trudeau is not bringing any such policies.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Sure he is. Look at the “immigrants” he’s allowed in, in stark contrast to the ones Harper brought in. Look at who he’s put in charge of what policies. Canada is slowly dying unless something drastic happens.

          • This style 10/6

            Nonsense. He brought in 25,000 Syrian refugees, otherwise the immigration policy stays the same.

            Your last two sentences are just babble. If you have a case, make it.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            I already have made the case, and your attack at actual statistics is laughable.

            Look at who he’s brought in. Look at the crime rate where they have settled. Look at the amount who are collecting welfare. Look at the government programs that pay businesses to hire these “refugees” in place of already existing Canadian employees.

            He’s done nothing to stem anti-Semitism like Harper did. He’s done nothing about the increasing crime rates. He’s done nothing about improving the lives of average Canadian citizens.

            He’s a traitor.

        • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

          We have plenty of killings. In my neighbourhood, we have crime committed by recent “refugees” and there’s not a whole lot we can do about it. We’re like sitting ducks while we are repeatedly victimized.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      TEXAS SHOOTER LIKED ATHEIST FB PAGES & SJW CAUSES
      Also was a fan of CNN …..

      Hey, YOUR kind of people ……………..

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      FYI ….. REPORT: Armed Citizen ‘Engaged’ Killer, Ending Rampage ……

      hmmmm ….. guess it really DOES work to have an ARMED citizen …………….

      • This style 10/6

        27 dead and 24 wounded is working!

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          yep ….. saved the state the price of a trial and his “appeals” …… but guess what …. he is not killing anyone else …. IS HE ………

        • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

          It would have been even worse had not that citizen been armed.

        • Maxwell Edison

          Blatant troll. Flagged.

      • james blue

        The sheriff is saying the suspect shot himself.

        • Maxwell Edison

          And???

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            He’s intentionally repeating fake news. It’s been widely reported that the killer fled as soon as someone returned fire, and that he was shot between the armor by an armed patriot who wouldn’t back down.

          • james blue

            Then it wasn’t a “good guy with a gun” who stopped him. Didn’t you read the comment that was in reply to?

        • NCOriolesFan

          That too beside the gunshot from the civilian.

          • james blue

            I’ve seen no reports confirming the civilian hit him only that he shot at him.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Two shot, one fatally, outside church in Fresno ,on Sunday and police were involved in a standoff nearby with someone believed to be the gunman, the Fresno Bee reports.

      hmmmm …. seems like the only way for your side to win ….. you know …. the A-Theistic worldview folks ….. is to call for “gun control” after every shooting ….. until the people are fully disarmed and then it will be a FREE FIRE ZONE at all churches ………… this is only going to accelerate …………… and this is the outcome of your “ideas” of what is right ….. thnx ………..

    • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

      The guy wasn’t supposed to have a gun in the first place. By the way, it was an armed citizen who took the shooter out. If anything, this is further proof that citizens should all be armed.

      • james blue

        But it was an armed citizen who did the killing of the church members.

        • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

          Bad guys will always get illegal weapons. Good guys need them to keep order. Why do you think the Bible talks about not bearing the sword in vain?

          • james blue

            Please read this carefully as it is very specific. You wrote “this is further proof that citizens should all be armed.” This reply has nothing to do with the 2nd amendment or gun laws.

            There are bad people who should not be armed because they are bad, there are mentally ill people who should not be armed because they are not stable. Then there are good people who should not be armed because they are incompetent numbnuts.

            The “right”good guy, well trained and practiced with a good temperament, might be able to stop or limit any death toll from a bad guy, but a poorly trained or incompetent numbnut is just as much danger to themself and those around them as a bad guy. I personally know many people who are wonderful law abiding citizens, but I wouldn’t trust them with a spit wad let alone a loaded firearm.

            So NO, not all citizens should be armed.

            I’m going to repeat, this response is not about the right to own firearms.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            That was a whole lot of babble without much substance.

          • james blue

            Okay, well I’m an adult, so………

    • Maxwell Edison

      The NRA didn’t do this. Try again.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      there should be control on it ….. the EXACT same control that the government has ….. what is legal for them to own is legal for us to own ……

      • james blue

        Civilians should be allowed to own intercontinental nuclear missiles?

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          if they can build one ….. it is proprietary design ……. and all that entails ……….

          • Bob Johnson

            Why proprietary? DARPA contracts puts inventions into the public domain.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            paid for by the government ….. belongs to the government ….. the inventors did not really profit from it ….. and if it was “in the public domain” …… then the Rosenberg family have a really big lawsuit to win ……..

          • Bob Johnson

            From DARPA website’s “Fundamental Research page,

            “Consistent with national policy and DoD Directives, DARPA fully supports free scientific exchanges and dissemination of research results to the maximum extent possible.

            Definition
            “Fundamental research means basic and applied research in science and engineering, the results of which ordinarily are published and shared broadly within the scientific community, as distinguished from proprietary research and from Industrial development, design, production, and product utilization, the results of which ordinarily are restricted for proprietary or national security reason.” [National Security Decision Directive (NSDD) 189, National Policy on the Transfer of Scientific, Technical, and Engineering Information]”

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            whoop – de – doo ………. try following the thread ………….

          • Bob Johnson

            Classified Los Alamos weapon’s research is not DARPA.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            right … so …. PROPRIETARY ………….

          • james blue

            Wow

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Japan knife attack: At least 19 dead – CNN
      26 Jul 2016 … (CNN) At least 19 people were killed and 26 injured in a stabbing spree at a facility for disabled people west of Tokyo, making it one of Japan’s …

      HURRY ….. BAN ALL THE KNIVES ………….. HURRY, HURRY, HURRY ……………………

      STAND UP TO THE NKA ………….. (national knife association) ………….

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Man charged with killing his mother, sister, and family friend inside …
      12 Aug 2017 … “He became enraged, went to the garage and obtained a large hammer, it’s called a framing hammer,” said Fitzpatrick. “With this framing …

      D.C. man convicted of murder in 2014 killings of his two roommates …
      25 Jul 2017 … Four high school friends called themselves “the Wolfpack” and shared a house in Shaw — until prosecutors say Jeffrey Neal used a hammer to …

      HURRY ….. BAN ALL THE HAMMERS ………….. HURRY, HURRY, HURRY ……………………

      STAND UP TO THE NHA ………….. (national hammer association) ………….

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      once again ……. Gun-Controlled Chicago Nearing 600 Homicides for 2nd Time Since 2003 …….

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Based on the arbitrary definition of a shooting involving at least four deaths, there had been 130 mass shootings in the United States as of June 6, 2017, going back over the last 51 years. (This does not include gang killings, killings that began as other crimes such as robberies, and killings that involved only the shooter’s family.)

      Information about how the guns were obtained is incomplete, but 248 different guns were used, at least 141 of which were obtained legally and at least 39 of which were obtained illegally; handguns were the most common weapons used, usually more than one, each of which takes about two seconds to reload, making limited magazines (commonly incorrectly referred to as “clips”) a minor inconvenience.

      None of the shooters were known to be members of the NRA.

  • Grasshopper

    Who knows what the solution is, or if there is one? We can’t have church ushers frisking people who walk in, and we can’t tell newcomers they are not welcome. It would be interesting to know if some of the megachurches, which have large staffs, have some sort of security system set up. As horrible as it is to read about the people in this small church, just imagine if a shooter – or several – decided to start firing at the congregants at one of the big churches like Joel Osteen’s.

    • Robin Egg

      As a matter of fact, I have an extended family member who is part of the security team for a large 1000 member church in a western state. They patrol the perimeter and the inside of the church; have ear pieces like secret service; train monthly and most are former military and law enforcement. There is going to be a need to defend ourselves from would be murderers and more and more churches are coming to that realization.

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        Synagogues have had to do that for some time.

        • Robin Egg

          Yes. Unfortunately, our Jewish brethren are all too familiar with this abhorrent behavior.

      • NCOriolesFan

        My 500+ attendee church has a security team as well, plus I’m a usher. I’ll be the first in line to give my single life in place of all the married fathers in the church.

        • Robin Egg

          What a beautiful comment. Bless you

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    TEXAS SHOOTER LIKED ATHEIST FB PAGES & SJW CAUSES
    Also was a fan of CNN
    NOVEMBER 5, 2017

    • This style 10/6

      He was a bible teacber at one time.

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        For a very short time. He certainly wasn’t one now.

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          never was one ………..

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        sure …… and a FALSE CHRISTIAN ….. SO WHAT …………. a RAVENING wolf among the sheep ……. an infiltrator ………

      • Maxwell Edison

        Not the least bit relevant. His Facebook page indicated he was an atheist.

        You have to be a serious sphincter to come in here and suggest any connection to Christianity. Flagged.

    • Tangent002 ✓

      The shooter’s ex-in-laws frequented the church, so it’s looking more like an extension of his domestic violence tendencies.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        REALLY …… so the shooting of so many CHILDREN ….. NOT CHILDREN of the family …… like the pastors daughter ……… that was just an “extended family domestic violence” incident …………. FAIL …… TRY AGAIN ………..

        • Tangent002 ✓

          Why didn’t he pick a bigger church, if the intent was to ‘kill Christians’? No, he chose this particular church because of its ties to his ex-wife.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            he did have a connection to that church …. but YOU want ME to tell you why he chose that particular church …… he did spend time there …. and out of the number of people he shot ….. children were high on his apparent list ………. 18 MONTHS OLD …… and we are going to try to decipher that ………… really ……….

            “They were not here yesterday. So we don’t know why he actually showed up yesterday.”

            CHURCH KILLER ‘PREACHED ATHEISM’…
            SECURITY GUARD AT RESORT…
            AIR FORCE REJECT…
            TARGETED EX-IN-LAWS CHURCH…
            COURT-MARTIALED FOR ASSAULT ON SPOUSE, CHILD…
            SICK FACEBOOK RANTS…
            Wore White Skull Face Mask…
            8 members of ONE family dead…
            Youngest Victim 18 Months…
            Deadliest shooting at house of worship in history…
            SMALL TOWN: A Post Office, No Traffic Light and Now Mass Murder…
            Locals pursued fleeing gunman at 95mph…
            Sharpshooting plumber hit him through gap in body armor…
            Hero describes how tracked him down…

            “But his mother-in-law was not inside the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs when Kelley sprayed the congregation with gunfire.”

            “– Those killed ranged in age from 18 months to 77 years old, Martin said. The toddler’s family gave the girl’s age as 17 months.
            — Ten of the 20 people wounded remain in critical condition Monday, authorities said. And virtually no one at the church was left unscathed, Tackitt said. “I think nearly everyone had some type of injury,” the sheriff told reporters Monday.
            — After Kelley left the church, he was confronted and shot by an armed resident. After Kelley was shot, he called his father, telling him he didn’t think he was going to make it, Martin said. That’s when Kelley shot himself.
            — It was not immediately clear whether Kelley died from the self-inflicted gunshot wound or from the shot by the resident. “However, investigators found evidence at the scene that indicates the subject may have died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound,” Martin said.”

          • NCOriolesFan

            I would not doubt that Vegas set him off too coming so close to that massacre.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            there was another incident in Fresno as well as at John MacArthurs church (Grace Community) the same day ……….

            According to witnesses, a man approached John MacArthur, screaming in his advance while MacArthur began his sermon. Security subdued the man and removed him out the back entrance of the building. This isn’t a repeat of August 2015, in which a Scottish crazy man rushed the stage to announce himself a prophet and accuse MacArthur of heresy for believing in cessationism. After that, GCC security installed velvet ropes, which seemed to slow down the interloper this time.

            Yesterday, the assailant was able to only make it a couple steps, and when hesitating at the ropes, was grabbed by the security team and hauled off. One GCC member told us, “Some goofball tried to go up on the stage from the organ side. He had to climb over the rope our security had to install (thanks to our Scottish prophet) and he didn’t get two steps up the stairs until security jumped him. He was rambling something about God not speaking to us anymore or some such nonsense and something about Pharaoh. The took him out the back door…”

            The assailant was apparently not unknown at the church, and had been at Grace Community Church on a previous occasion, arguing about theonomy and asserting that the church was Israel. Security already had a restraining order against the man for that previous encounter at the visitor’s center. Reportedly, the previous incident was approximately a week ago.

            persecution of the church in this country seems to have begun in earnest ……….

    • MCrow

      You do know that this rumor was started on a self-declared fake news site, right?

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        Daily Mail ……..

        EXCLUSIVE: ‘Creepy, crazy and weird’: Former classmates say Texas gunman was an ‘outcast’ who ‘preached his atheism’ online before killing 26 in the state’s worst ever mass shooting
        Devin Patrick Kelley, 26, shot dead 26 people and injured 24 others in Texas
        Walked into First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs in Texas and opened fire
        He was wearing black, tactical gear and carrying a military style assault rifle
        Kelley was shot by local Stephen Willeford, 55, and died after a car chase
        Former classmates have described him as an ‘outcast’, ‘creepy’ and ‘weird’
        Another said he talked ‘about how people who believe in God were stupid’
        LinkedIn reveals Kelley was an Air Force veteran and ex-Bible studies teacher
        He was court martialed in 2014 for two counts of assault on his spouse and child
        He was living in New Braunfels, a suburb of San Antonio, and was married

        • MCrow

          …and it was started on freedumjunkshun, who are a fake news site that tries to fool conservative readers into believing their outlandish claims.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            whatever lets you sleep at night …………

          • MCrow

            Truth helps me sleep quite well, thanks

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you do not know truth ……… you reject truth ………

          • MCrow

            The truth is this was done my a mentally disturbed, abusive man who was out for revenge and personal reasons, not some grand political conspiracy. It’s tragic, it’s sad, and the fact that so many were killed for one man’s vendetta shows how dangerous things are. That’s the truth

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “not some grand political conspiracy”

            hmmmm ….. this must be for someone else …… i have not posited “some grand political conspiracy” ……………. unless you are the one who is “a mentally disturbed, abusive man who was out for revenge and personal reasons” ………. and you still do not know the truth …. you reject truth ….. and that is independent of this story ……….

          • MCrow

            You posted his political affiliation as a motive for his crime. The more police investigate, the more evidence comes up that this was motivated by his personal hatred of his in-laws

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope … and i actually do not know what his “political affiliation” is ….. nor do i care …. it may have been part of a group of headlines ….. but it is irrelevant to what he did ..

          • MCrow

            Right…you posted about his political affiliations because you felt they were irrelevant. Please tell me you don’t expect me to take that seriously?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            well … if you think i did then show me where i commented about it ….. otherwise this is not really a point of i am going to continue on about ……….

          • MCrow

            “TEXAS SHOOTER LIKED ATHEIST FB PAGES & SJW CAUSES
            Also was a fan of CNN …..

            Hey, YOUR kind of people ……………..” < You again

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            ok …. so you want to make SJW (social justice warrior) a “political affiliation” …… sorry …. dont see it ….. it makes him an anarchist …… and being an A-THEIST that fits right together …… SJW is just another lie he told himself ….. so what else you got ……….

          • MCrow

            Hey, he led a Bible study! Your kind of people! Also, Hitler ate food.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            hehehee ………. well he was not on FB proclaiming his A-Theism because he was a christian …………. you can label horse manure as rose petals …… do make it so ………

          • MCrow

            You mean the bad photoshop jobs? Yep. Great “proof,” there. Again, someone did that specifically to troll right wing fundies and you ate it hook, line, and sinker

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i offered no proof of anything …………. and again ….. whatever helps you sleep at night ……

          • MCrow

            “I offered no proof of anything” Truer words were never spoken.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            it is not up to me to prove the truth to you …….. and in any case …. you reject the truth by the lies you want to believe ……….. by the lies your continually tell yourself ….. that God does not exist …..

          • MCrow

            How convinient for you. Your evangelization tactics explain why Christianity’s numbers continue to flag

          • MCrow

            Also, as an area host, he definitely was not one. Any affiliations have been show to be fake, false flags to discredit real anarchists and if you think this sounds familiar it’s because you do it every time there’s a Christian shooter

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “Any affiliations have been show to be fake, false flags to discredit real anarchists”

            LOL ………………

            “every time there’s a Christian shooter”

            except for one at an abortion clinic 20 years ago ….. cant think of any ….. so not sure what you are talking about ……

          • MCrow

            That’s because it’s always “no real Christian” every time one of your number does something bad

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope …. he was one of yours ……. an A-Theist ………. i guess that makes him “No True A-theist …. erm ….. No True Scotsman ” ….. LOL ….. you are trying to be funny arent you ……….

          • MCrow

            He may have been an atheist. So what? The only thing unifying atheists is that we don’t acknowledge a deity. That’s like making a unified statement about people who don’t like baseball.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            what unifies A-theists is there rebellion to God ….. and the denial of the reality that he exists …. and they KNOW He exists ….. and deny it by the lies they tell themselves ……… and then try to get everyone else to believe their lies …… that is your only reason for being here ….. to demonstrate your defiance of God …….

          • MCrow

            Again, declaring atheists “know” some divinity exists is telling. You honestly think that everyone thinks exactly the same way you do, which is undeniably false and also incredibly arrogant. I’m mostly here to interject reality into your echo chamber. I don’t comment on what I deem “internal affairs” for that reason. I don’t overmuch care what you do in church, but I do care what people do in the public sphere

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            GOD has declared ….. A-Theists LIE about it …….. to themselves and the world ……..

          • MCrow

            Really? Which god?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            again … you KNOW which God ….. the one you lie to yourself about ….. just like you just did there ……….

          • MCrow

            Personally, given the state of the world, I’m a fan of Azathoth as a theory: blind idiot god who creates and destorys without being even aware of what is going on. Matches the state of the universe far better than an omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolant deity who does…what, again? Oh, right, according to you, saves a few people at random to live with him forever while condemning the rest to eternal suffering because he created them knowing they would suffer, die, and tortured them for it.

            It’s why I’m glad there isn’t a god: if there was, and it even remotely resembled yours, then the universe was created by a sadist

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            blah, blah …. YOU KNOW which God we are talking about …… now you are just a troll …..

          • MCrow

            I know which god we are talking about, and I’ve told you that I think he’s as real as any other deity: not at all. I’m simply saying that given the state of the world (and the behavior of Yahweh), that If such an entity was real, it would not be worthy of worship

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            well i just looked at all my posts on this story ….. i find no mention of his “political affiliation” …… so it seems you are misremembering ………… try the blue pills ……….

          • MCrow

            “TEXAS SHOOTER LIKED ATHEIST FB PAGES & SJW CAUSES
            Also was a fan of CNN” < Posted by you more than once, in fact.

            *whistles a tune*

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            answered ….. SJW is not a “political affiliation” ……

      • barclaylin

        Yes. It is not true. But isn’t that what the Kremlin intended when it started the troll factories and the “disinformation” campaign aimed at confusing and dividing Americans? They succeeded.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        again ……….. Gun-Controlled Chicago Nearing 600 Homicides for 2nd Time Since 2003

        • MCrow

          Disversionary. We are discussing the hoax you posted earlier

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sure …. again …. whatever helps you sleep at night …….

          • MCrow

            And again, the truth does help me sleep at night

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and again …. you do not know the truth …. the truth is a WHO ….. not a what ……..

          • MCrow

            Sure, and she’s a lovely lady

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

            and you still do not know Him …. you reject Him …….. and you reject truth …..

          • MCrow

            Jesus said that, and why should I believe him? Let me guess: because he is the truth? And how would I know that. Because he said so…

            Circular reasoning at its finest. Or most drab

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “and why should I believe him?”

            you dont ….. as you reject truth … you do not know truth ….. you do not know Him ….. you reject Him ………….

          • MCrow

            Still circular reasoning at its most banal

    • barclaylin

      In Feb. 2017 Trump reversed restrictions on selling guns to the mentally ill– simply because it was Obama who imposed them. He didn’t care how much his action would hurt the public, he just wanted to delegitimize anything Obama made law.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        interesting opinion …….. why do i care ………..

  • michael louwe

    https(colon)//heavy(dot)com/news/2017/11/devin-kelley-p-sutherland-springs-church-shooter-patrick-kelly/
    .
    Seems, Devin Kelley was an evil atheist(= was court martialled) who infiltrated the Church as a Sunday School Bible teacher. Maybe, he retaliated after the Church excommunicated him for untowards behavior toward the children, eg homosexuality/pedophilia. Hence, he even shot a 4 y o boy.

  • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

    More violence from another atheist.

  • Maxwell Edison

    I just started reading the comments, but I wholeheartedly expect an atheist pig to come and celebrate this.

    • Tangent002 ✓

      This atheist finds the attack wholly reprehensible.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        on what basis ….. they are just bags of protoplasm that came together by accident ….. in the A-theist worldview …… it was just accidental stardust bumping into other accidental stardust from the A-theist worldview …. and “reprehensible” on what basis ….. good and evil REQUIRE a THEISTIC worldview ….. and you come here and spout that UTTER NONSENSE ………. SHEEEEESH ………

        • Tangent002 ✓

          Empathy. Why do you require a God to tell you killing people is wrong?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            welll …….. ummmmmm …. BECAUSE HE DID …….. and He did not have to write it to tell us ….. He placed that knowledge in EVERY PERSON ….. YOU included …… but that is NOT THE POINT …… YOU ….. as an A-theist ….. have NO BASIS in A-theism to say even one word about it ……. and you cannot and will not maintain your worldview CONSISTENTLY ………and yet YOU want and HAVE to steal from a christian worldview to do it ………

            STOP BEING A THIEF …………..

            and “empathy” …… you CANNOT EVEN ACCOUNT for it …… so why do you think you have ANY CLAIM ON IT whatsoever ……………

            A-theism, at its base, has to believe, that every human life, and all
            of human existence is basically a series of accidents. There is no
            Creator so there is no human being made in the Creators image, and even
            though we should understand the A-theist would clearly classify this
            murderous attack in Southerland Springs Texas as evil, they have no
            real ability to understand or to embrace the notion of evil with any
            coherence.

            Evil is essentially a theological catagory. Without theism, without
            belief in God, without theology, evil becomes simply the strongest word
            we have to describe something we wish had not happened. – Al Mohler

          • james blue

            Hypothetically- If it was shown without any doubt there was no God, would you think it okay to murder, rape, fornicate etc.? Would your mind change on the subjects?

          • Maxwell Edison

            What is this?

            Did the mods fall asleep?

            FLAGGED!

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            james blue loves to play his games with Christians on Christian sites.

          • Maxwell Edison

            I do not believe the endorsement and teaching of atheism belongs on a Christian website. Period.

            And it’s not about tolerance when we all know good and well if we did the same at JoeMyGod we would be banned on sight.

            And yet, my post objecting to James’s got deleted, while his still stands.

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            Not fair his is still there. I’m thinking about writing a letter to the site. Not sure if it would help but I want to try. Too many Christians are being harassed by too many Atheist on this site. Christians should be able to come here and not be harassed. I will keep praying for the Christians on this site to be protected from these Atheist.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sorry …. we dont do “hypotheticals” here …….. ridiculous question ….. but the fact is …. “EMPATHY” cannot be accounted for in the A-theist worldview …… NOR does it prevent anyone from doing what you suggest …..

          • james blue

            “we dont do “hypotheticals” here” Really?? have you read your own comment history?

            If your argument held water you’d simply say you would think murder etc. would be okay. However we both know that’s not what you’d think, so you won’t answer as you know it would refute your own argument.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            jimmy ….. you are playing in the deep end here …… and you are wearing water wings ….. and dont know how to swim ….. you are trying to make childish argumentation …. it is not really woth answering ….. the fact is God exists …. and YOU KNOW He exists ….. and the PRESUPPOSITION here is THAT HE DOES ………… so your childish attempt to say

          • james blue

            It’s not going to be “entertained” because you know I’m right.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            again … the PRESUPPOSITION here ……… GOD EXISTS …….. it does not need to be proven just as we are not going to entertain that gravity does not exist ……. you KNOW God exists ….. JUST as you know gravity exists …… and any one year old knows both of those things ….. your reasoning is infantile …………..

          • james blue

            And that’s the handy thing about “presumption”– you don’t have to look at the weakness of your argument. It’s the same with your strawman arguments- make up the stance of your “opponent” then you won’t have to actually argue what they actually said.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            the PRESUPPOSITION of A-theism ….. is THEISM ….. that GOD EXISTS ….. so the only straw man here is YOU ……………. YOU know God exists ……….. it is not debatable ……….

          • james blue

            Do you actually read what you write?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            your position is completely subsumed under the paradigm of THEISM ….. you have no position to even challenge the paradigm you are subsumed under ….. your position would not and CANNOT exist if it were not for THEISM …… your position is a FRAUD …… you have NOTHING with which to argue ……….

          • james blue

            Seriously, do you ever read what you write?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Gun-Controlled Chicago Nearing 600 Homicides for 2nd Time Since 2003

          • james blue

            What point do you think you are making?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i think the point is made ….. “gun control” ….. does not control the depraved human spirit if it is rebellion ……….. and it is ILLOGICAL to think otherwise ………

          • james blue

            What??? Seriously

          • mr goody two shoes

            If there was no God their would be no such thing as right or wrong. And Gods laws would not be written in the hearts of people..

          • james blue

            So you’d not view murder as wrong?

          • mr goody two shoes

            How could I if God did not exist ? There would be no conscience.

          • james blue

            Wow

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Makes me glad these people believe in God.

          • james blue

            I believe in God

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Cool.

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Sorry Amos, but Christians do not own empathy or compassion.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            AGAIN …… YOUR worldview CANNOT account for “empathy” …………. so for you to even assert it has anything to do with YOUR WORLDVIEW is fallacious …………

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Of course I can account for empathy. I exist and I perceive others who also exist. I see no reason to treat them worse than how I like to be treated.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “I exist and I perceive others who also exist. I see no reason to treat them worse than how I like to be treated.”

            so AGAIN ….. STEALING from a christian worldview …… “A-theism, at its base, has to believe, that every human life, and all of human existence is basically a series of accidents.” …. ACCIDENTS do not account for “empathy” ….. you have NO BASIS ……….

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Hogwash. The entire Christian morality is about avoiding punishment or expecting a reward.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            okay … ACCOUNT for empathy ….. from WHERE did it originate … in YOUR worldview ….. or are you all hat and no cowboy ………….

          • Tangent002 ✓

            I already did. Empathy originates from a recognition of sameness. Religion is all about creating artificial differences, which is why you have no true empathy.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “Empathy originates from a recognition of sameness”

            WHERE is your EVIDENCE ….. that does not even BEGIN to tell anyone the origin of “empathy” ………. that is just some garbage you and some other persons made up in your head ….. EVIDENCE ….. your position/worldview relies on EVIDENCE …… WHERE is your EVIDENCE for such a conclusion ….. and that is what it is ….. it is a CONCLUSION ….. it is not EVIDENCE of anything …. your worldview paradigm is completely upside-down and BACKWARDS ….. you do not begin at the conclusion …… you begin with YOUR EVIDENCE …..

            AGAIN ….. are you ALL HAT AND NO COWBOY …………

          • Tangent002 ✓

            The phrase is, “All hat, no cattle.”

            What evidence is there for any philosophy? I’m telling you how I derive empathy, I’m not trying to prove anything to you.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            so NO EVIDENCE ….. your position is not “philosophy” …… it is science and EVIDENCE …….. and you come here making blanket statements AS IF you had some morality derived from EMOTION ….. because THAT is all “empathy” is ….. EMOTION …… figures ….. you got the hat …….. but you are a cowboy who never roped a cow ….. just a HAT …. and NOTHING to back it up ……. all hat and NO COWBOY …………….

          • Tangent002 ✓

            You seem to be very threatened by someone whose morality does not require divine dogma. Why is that?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you seem very threatened by one who does require divine dogma …… why is that ….. and why do you feel a need to hang around those who do …………

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “The entire Christian morality is about avoiding punishment or expecting a reward.”

            classic ….. you do not know what you are talking about ………..

          • Tangent002 ✓

            It isn’t empathy if you require a God to tell you not to harm others. You’re just either avoiding punishment or expecting a reward.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            YOUR worldview CANNOT account for “empathy” …………. so for you to even assert it has anything to do with YOUR WORLDVIEW is fallacious …………

          • Tangent002 ✓

            You keep asserting that, but it is your worldview that lacks true empathy.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope ….. there is NO EMPATHY in your worldview …. you have no basis for it IF …. IF ….. IF …. YOU are going to be consistant in your worldview ….. and YOU NEVER ARE …… below is YOUR worldview ….. and no matter what happens in the world … no matter how heinous it may be ….. YOU have no basis for complaint in YOUR worldview ……….

            A-theism, at its base, has to believe, that every human life, and all
            of human existence is basically a series of accidents. There is no
            Creator so there is no human being made in the Creators image, and even
            though we should understand the A-theist would clearly classify this
            murderous attack in Sutherland Springs Texas as evil, they have no
            real ability to understand or to embrace the notion of evil with any
            coherence.

            Evil is essentially a theological catagory. Without theism, without
            belief in God, without theology, evil becomes simply the strongest word
            we have to describe something we wish had not happened. – Al Mohler

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        Oh come on. Atheists call for the killing and persecution of Christians all the time. Look at the Facebook pages he followed. Some of you guys promote them too. This is exactly what they wanted to happen.

        • Brand Strong

          Prove it! Show me a link to ANY ATHEIST who is calling for the death of ANY CHRISTIAN! Troll! As an atheist, I am only convinced that you people have no idea what being an atheist even means.

          • james blue

            It begins and ends with the denial of the existence of any God. Beyond that there is nothing connecting one atheist to another other than by coincidence…. Right?

            All political, social, scientific etc. beliefs are personal and not a tenet of Atheism as it begins and ends with the denial of the existence of any God.

          • Maxwell Edison

            Actually, we do. The Freedom From Religion Foundation is a glowing example of what it means: Relentlessly persecuting Christians for the disgusting crime of expressing and practicing their faith while being silent

          • Tangent002 ✓

            When has the FFRF called for the killing of Christians?

          • james blue

            Plus they go after Islam often, but it won’t matter how many times you tell him.

          • mr goody two shoes

            When we look around to other places in the world how they treat Christians .Were pretty spoiled Christians living where we live in the USA. And those worse places non of those Christians carry weapons to church they understand the gospel is worth dying for .

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            atheist on a christian forum calling christians trolls ….. hmmmmm ….. seems to me the definition should be applied to you …………..

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Dude, what do you think the atheist communists did? And just go read comments by atheists on other pages. They do it all the time. You can’t be sincere in what you’re posting, or else you are extremely ignorant of basic history.

        • Tangent002 ✓

          “Atheists call for the killing and persecution of Christians all the time.”

          I don’t.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You’ve supported Christian persecution on these very pages.

          • Tangent002 ✓

            Can you give me an example?

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Kim Davis.

          • Tangent002 ✓

            What about her? She failed to do her job. Religion is not a license to disobey the law. You seem to be confusing lack of preferential treatment with ‘persecution’.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            She did not fail to do her job. She was upholding Kentucky law which is why she was eventually exonerated.

          • Tangent002 ✓

            She was allowed to remove her name from all marriage licenses, but the county still has to issue them.

            You still haven’t explained how that is persecution of Christians on my part.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            She was following Kentucky law and was exonerated. You wanting her to be fired and jailed for keeping the law is exactly what Nazis did to Jews in the early stages of their persecution.

          • mr goody two shoes

            Kim Davis if she realy is oneness pentecostal, than she is not christian.

        • mr goody two shoes

          We all ready know this from what the bible says yet if God only saved people that deserved it .No one would be saved.

    • This style 10/6

      Atheists are as horrified by this crime as anyone. Atheists are folk who live the same kind of lives as anyone else apart from their non-belief in a god.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        then they are PHONEY A-theists …………. and LIARS ……… and stealing from a CHRISTIAN worldview …….. and if you really blocked me ….. i guess no rebuttal ….. not that you have one …………

        • MCrow

          How dare you? How dare you define another’s belief? How dare you tell us what we are supposed to feel? You are not God, Amos, despite what you seem to think.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i am not God ….. and all A-theists are LIARS ….. to themselves and to the world ….. and they STEAL from a christian worldview ………..

          • MCrow

            You are decreeing what people THINK, Amos. That is the height of arrogance, as only God can tell hearts. So unless you are claiming to be God, stop telling me what I think.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            NO …. i am TELLING them what they KNOW ….. and they DO KNOW ….. and you KNOW …… what they “think” is obvious ………… and i do not care what they think or “feel” or believe …… what they KNOW is what makes them and YOU a LIAR ……….

          • MCrow

            And since apparently you can read my own mind and I can’t, what is it that I ‘know?’

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you know God exists ………..

          • Worf

            Proverbs 6:16-19

            16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
            17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
            18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
            >>19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

            Seems to me you soweth discord and speaketh lies with a proud look and a lying tongue. From a Biblical perspective, you have repeatedly committed an abomination unto your god.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Worf the “CHERRY PICKER” …… and out of context …. that has to do with BELIEVERS ….. not NON-BELIEVERS ….. non-believers ARE NOT BRETHREN ….. non-believers are already in discord ….. and AGAIN ….. scripture says …. ALL MEN KNOW God exists …….

            Romans
            1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
            1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
            1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
            1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
            1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
            1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

          • Worf

            By demanding you know atheists thoughts better than they know their own, and telling lies that serve your divisive hatred of non-christians, you are bearing false witness. Is that not against one of the base rules of your religion?

            Does your god say its ok to spread discord by blatantly lying about non christians? Sounds just like Islam to me.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “By demanding you know atheists thoughts better than they know their own”

            NOPE …. GOD knows their thoughts …. it aint rocket surgery …… God told us ….. so wrong on point two ….. i do not hate anyone …. WRONG AGAIN ….. so NO FALSE WITNESS ….. and …. ummm ….. WRONG AGAIN …….. STRIKE FOUR …. you are OUTTA there ……………..

          • MCrow

            Amos, it’s honestly sad that you can’t accept this, but it is so indefensibly arrogant of you to presume that everyone, the whole world over, thinks just like you do and anyone who doesn’t admit it must be a liar. You can’t accept that people are different. I don’t believe in Yahweh anymore than I believe in Zeus, Ra, or Shiva. They are, to me, cultural myths and nothing more. They are important figures, but they don’t exist in any tangible or experiential way.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “but it is so indefensibly arrogant of you to presume that everyone, the whole world over, thinks just like you do”

            LOL! …. ummmm …. OBVIOUSLY ….. they do not …… that does not alter the truth of what was said ……… “anyone who doesn’t admit it must be a liar” ….. ANYONE who denies the existence of God is a liar to themselves first and then to the world ……… and since you have continually stated your thinking on the matter ….. IT IS NOT “indefensibly arrogant”or any “presumption” ….. as YOU ADMIT IT ……… it is very clear from all evidence and by every metric of reality ….. GOD EXISTS …. and you KNOW He exists ….. and to say otherwise makes anyone who says that a LIAR …………. and it is sad that they cannot get through a day without that lie ……….

          • MCrow

            Any time you say “you know god exists,” you are imposing your way of thinking on me and assuming that everyone must think the same way as you. The fact that you have to assume anyone who thinks differently is a liar is, again, just sad.

            I don’t. I see no evidence you claim is abundant. Again, Yahweh has no more proof than any of the countless deities that have existed in history, he’s just enjoying a period where he’s the most popular, but even that is on the decline in many places as information becomes more abundant and people are realizing that religion has a cemetery worth of skeletons in the closet

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “Any time you say “you know god exists,” you are imposing your way of thinking on me”

            nope …. that is the reality of it ….. and it is not “imposed on you” ….. any more than reality is “imposed on you” ….. it is the truth …….. and you reject it …….. man up ……….

          • MCrow

            If it’s the truth, it would be objectively provable instead of relying on stumbling across the right book. So again, you’re imposing your beliefs (for that’s all they are: no hard evidece) on me. C’mon, you’re not even trying at this point

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            again … YOU REJECT TRUTH …. even if it was shown to you …. YOU WOULD REJECT THE EVIDENCE …… denial is not a river in Afghanistan …….

          • MCrow

            …Egypt. A river in Egypt…I want to talk about the finer points of metaphysics, but you can’t even do geography right…

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            LOL! …… would you like another piece of cheese …….

          • MCrow

            And you call other people trolls? Sad, sad man

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            nope … for the most part i do not …….. i get called one frequently ………. as you just did ….. and my comment had nothing to do with “trolls” or “trolling” …… had to do with your inability to accept a little humor ……. in the form of a malapropism …… but that is your sad life …..

          • MCrow

            You got it wrong and are passing it off as a joke. Still sad

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sad you have no humor ……..

          • MCrow

            I do, I just don’t find you funny, save in the “what is wrong with you?” kind of way

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you are very good at lying to yourself …. so good at it ….. you believe your own lies ……. and why should i believe such an adept liar …………….

    • Croquet_Player

      Sorry to disappoint you. This was a horrific, appalling crime, and I’m utterly heartbroken for the victims and their families. They have my heartfelt deepest condolences, and all my sympathy, for their devastating losses. I do not need to share their religious beliefs to share in the grief for so many lives so violently and senselessly taken. It is a terrible, terrible tragedy, of staggering proportions. I only hope they can somehow recover and heal, and that they receive all the support they need to rebuild their lives as best they can.

    • 0pus

      I think that if atheists were honest (not a quality one associates with their ilk), they would admit that church shootings become an every-Sunday event. They are happy to see Christians being destroyed, and they figure that more gun violence will eventually lead to Second Amendment rights being taken away.

      I trust their tears the way I trust a crocodile’s tears. They are not sad about these shootings, they are ecstatic.

  • NCOriolesFan

    God bless the two heroes who chased the gunman to this own death. Too bad he didn’t take his life before murdering 26 innocents.

    • mr goody two shoes

      Church is only for sinners what we’re these 26 innocent people doing church in the first place?

      • NCOriolesFan

        Innocent by definition minding their own lives and worshipping their god before the gunman took their lives.

        • mr goody two shoes

          When your time of grace is up its up. That’s why faith in Christ is so important for all ages. God can use other sinners believers or unbelievers to take believers home. Gods permissive will is still his will. Christians have sinned and murdered people to.

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    Good Guy with a Gun: Stephen Willeford Named as Man Who Stopped Texas Shooter

  • mr goody two shoes

    Sorry I just don’t see the tragedy dying in church while listening to God’s word.

    • NCOriolesFan

      I see the glory of entering heaven despite the enormous tragedy that has practically destroyed this little church.

    • Nick Halflinger

      And if you are an atheist and see life as a brief moment, then it is a tragedy – lives full of hopes, desires, and plans cut short – lost forever. And so many families in pain and grief for the lost of their loved ones.

      And if you contemplated the tragic countless times this story plays out in America today, compared to say Australia or New Zealand, then you must wonder why these families have to pay this price.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        a brief moment in the life of bags of protoplasm and stardust remnants ….. that got a few holes punched into them ….. thats the A-Theist view …. SO WHAT …….

  • mr goody two shoes

    Sorry No Guns allowed in A confessional Lutheran church because of the gospel is always told in every service. What did Jesus tell Peter about his use of the sword when he tried to stop Jesus from his Gospel purpose?

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      this is what He told ALL of the disciples ……..

      Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
      Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

      “and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.”

      in other words ….. EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO GO NAKED …… be ARMED ……….

  • Keith Helldog

    It sounds to me like it is the plan of the Xtian God. Teach them to vote for Ted Cruz or ban reasonable gun legislation. SAD

    • Maxwell Edison

      I knew it was only a matter of time.

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        They’re positively chortling and salivating, aren’t they?

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      “Xtian God.”

      sorry ….. dont know who that is ……..

      • TheKingOfRhye

        You don’t know who the God of your own religion is? Weird.

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          i do not recognize the “Xtian” as anything ….. it is meaningless ……. so i do not know what “god” is being referred to ………….. or even if one is ………..

          • TheKingOfRhye

            The X is just an abbreviation for Christ. As in “Xmas”.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            again …. meaningless ……….

          • TheKingOfRhye

            The use of X for Christ goes back to the 16th century, it’s from “chi”, the first letter of Christ in Greek. Also there was the “chi rho” symbol way before that. So, if you think it’s meaningless, take it up with the 16th century, not me.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            improper usage …. not recognized ……..

  • mr goody two shoes

    LUTHERANS have devotions all the time on the bad church days Jesus had while preaching. Even in his home town they tried to kill him. Yet you never heard Jesus say we better start carting around weapons. That’s the government’s job protecting by weapons use not the church’s job.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
      Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

  • Sue Tuemler Boose

    Those poor Christians! They were killed because it was part of God’s plan.

    • Maxwell Edison

      Troll. Flagged.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      and so will you …. when He is ready for you to do so ….. He is the author and finisher of ALL our lives …… even poor non-believers ……..

    • Murder is never part of God’s plan.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        i have to disagree brother …….. God uses sin sinlessly ….. God curbed sin in this case as it could have been far worse ……. all our deaths are ordained and decreed by God and were before the foundation of the world was laid ….. and also our salvation as Christ also died for our sins before the foundation of the world was laid …. but this poor soul whose comment is now deleted thinks they are wise to point out something that only applies to christians when it applies to all …….

        bless you …….

        • That sounds like the doctrine of predestination. Is that where you are going?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            that doctrine is scripture ….. in Ephesians and John and Revelation and Romans and others …… the Elect are already known to God as God is omniscient and all knowing …….. so it is biblical doctrine ……..

          • God knows who and who will not accept Him but the offer of salvation is to everyone.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sure …. as that is the mechanism He uses to gather His sheep to Himself and gives those called to Christ …..

          • Sorry my friend but that is not scriptural. The call to salvation is for everyone as stated below.
            —————–

            John 3:16-17New King James Version (NKJV)

            16 For
            God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever
            believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            sorry …. but “the world” …. does not mean every person in the world ….. AND ….. the only ones who will believe “in Him should not perish but have everlasting life” are the Elect ….. so yes …. you are correct to point that out ….. but your giving it a meaning it does not have ….. “I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.”

            John
            17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
            17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
            17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

          • Apparently we will disagree on this my brother and we will praise God for His grace and mercy given to us through Christ Jesus.

  • barclaylin

    What ever happened to to Psalm 91?
    And whither the passage of scripture that begins “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood…”?

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
      Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

      “and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.”

      in other words ….. EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO GO NAKED …… be ARMED ……….

  • mr goody two shoes

    There was No permanent harm done to Gods people the murderer him self that’s the real tragedy since Christ died for him to.

  • HpO

    I got saved by Jesus through people like First Baptist Church

    The couple that got killed could’ve been the husband/wife team for the college & career back in the day

    It was even a small community town like this one

    But the kids – families – like my family then when I was a babe in Jesus

    Oh God there’s death in my family here

    2 nights – can’t stop crying for my born-again Christian brothers & sisters

  • mr goody two shoes

    You are allowed to weep if your going to do something about it Like Jesus did . its a lie when you die you can’t take important things with you. Tell some one important in your life about Jesus .

  • mr goody two shoes

    God could kill before hand people who do evil but then no one would be left.

  • Croquet_Player

    This was a horrifying and heartbreaking tragedy. Worse, there will be other terrible mass shootings, until we as a country decide to do something concrete about keeping weapons of war out reach of the general public.

  • NCOriolesFan

    Right, the developing baby human was murdered too.

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    If you understand that the majority of shooting events that are stopped are stopped by average citizens that are armed, then it should only follow that you should become one of those armed citizens ……………

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    CHURCH WARNS WOULD-BE MASS SHOOTERS: ‘WE ARE NOT A GUN-FREE ZONE’
    ‘If I don’t protect my people, I’m being complicit,’ says pastor
    Adan Salazar | Infowars com – NOVEMBER 10, 2017

  • Time for Christians to take to heart the following two passages:

    “Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword [or today’s equivalent in their hand; to execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people; to bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron; to execute upon them the judgment written: this honour have all his saints. Praise ye Yah.” (Psalm 149:6-9)

    “But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house [including spiritual and physical protection], he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.” (1 Timothy 5:8)

    For more, see free online article/tract “Firearms: Scripturally Defended.” Click on my name, then our website. Go tor our Online Books page and scroll down to title.