T.D. Jakes Comes Out for ‘Gay Rights’ and ‘LGBT Churches,’ Says Position is ‘Evolving’

JakesMegachurch leader and author T.D. Jakes says that homosexuals should attend congregations that affirm their lifestyle and that politics do not need to reflect biblical ethics, adding that his position on homosexuality is both “evolved and evolving.”

During an interview with the Huffington Post on Monday, Jakes was asked by a viewer if he believes that homosexuals and the black church can co-exist.

“Absolutely… I think it is going to be diverse from church to church. Every church has a different opinion on the issue and every gay person is different,” he replied. “And I think that to speak that the church—the black church, the white church or any kind of church you wanna call it—are all the same, is totally not true.”

Jakes said that he thinks homosexuals should find congregations that affirm their lifestyle.

“LGBT’s of different types and sorts have to find a place of worship that reflects what your views are and what you believe like anyone else,” he outlined.

“The church should have the right to have its own convictions and values; if you don’t like those convictions and values [and] you totally disagree with it, don’t try to change my house, move into your own … and find somebody who gets what you get about faith,” Jakes added.

He said that the issue of homosexuality is “complex.”

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“Paul spends a lot of time wrestling back and forth, trying to understand should a woman wear a head covering, should you cut your hair,” Jakes stated. “I mean, they grappled back then and we’re grappling now because we’re humans and we are flawed and we’re not God.”

“Once you understand you’re not God, you leave yourself an ‘out’ clause to grow,” he said.

When asked if his position on homosexuality has “evolved,” Jakes agreed that it has.

“Evolved and evolving,” he replied. “I think that where I am is to better understand we, the church, bought into the myth that this is a Christian nation.”

Earlier this year, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that states must legalize same-sex “marriage,” igniting a battle between the Church and State over the issue. In his comments on Monday, Jakes advocated for the separation of Church and State, which would allow for “all types of people” to have whatever rights they desire despite biblical prohibitions. He said that politics don’t need to be based on Christianity.

“[O]nce you get past [thinking America is a Christian nation] … Once you begin to understand that democracy—that a republic actually—is designed to be an overarching system to protect our unique nuances, then we no longer look for public policy to reflect biblical ethics,” Jakes explained.

“If we can divide—or what you would call separation of Church and State—then we can dwell together more effectively because atheists, agnostics, Jews, all types of people, Muslims, pay into the government. The government then cannot reflect one particular view over another just because we’re the dominant group of religious people in [this] country because those numbers are changing every day,” he asserted. “We need a neutralized government that protects our right to disagree with one another and agree with one another.”

Jakes had visited the Huffington Post to discuss his new book on “destiny.” The interview focused on motivational subject matter in following one’s dreams and passions as opposed to the eternal destiny of the soul.


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  • ChaplainPeter

    You shall know them by their fruit. This is not the fruit ( character ) of the HOLY SPIRIT.

  • BarkingDawg

    “These are not the fruits you are looking for. You can go about your business, move along.”

  • http://biblewordstudy.org Adam in Christ

    Sounds like yet another Laodicea-esque televangelist who’s more invested in selling his latest book series than he is in preaching the Word of God.

    • Ruthe Tate

      Amen

    • Bill Charlton

      I believe (if he is being accurately quoted) that he is obviously guilty of apostasy by rejecting the authority of God’s Word in identifying homosexuality as the horrible sin that it is, but what is your basis for accusing him of greed?

      • GeneralDrake

        Apostasy? Really? Interesting that some people were literally preaching the gospel out of wrong motives and even as an attempt to do evil toward Paul yet he rejoiced that the gospel was still being preached and their case. He didn’t call them apostates he was thankful for the good work that they were still doing. TD Jakes is an awesome man of God and a wise man I’m not sure what he’s really trying to say or accomplish here. I respect his right to have an opinion different than mine. I think he’s trying to take a more realistic approach to the problem but I did not see him say homosexuality is not sin. Everyone seems to think their own opinion is so darn important.

        • Marty Haas

          When a preacher begins to call good evil and evil good, he is no longer preaching the gospel. Paul didn’t rejoice at those who were preaching a “perverted gospel” as he called it (Galatians 1). The gospel is the good news that God wants to forgive us our sins based upon the sacrifice of Christ in our place. But He’s not offering us a get-out-of-hell-free card. He’s offering to restore us to His family and kingdom. That requires repentance, and TD Jakes is now saying that there’s nothing here to repent of. Jesus died to pay the price for the sin of homosexual behavior. To now proclaim that it is not a sin is to disrespect the sacrifice of Christ.

          • jorgelm123

            Amen!

          • Antoinette Brass

            Absolutely right. It’s a mockery of the shed blood. How dare he?
            This man is followed by millions. This is nothing less than a betrayal to most of tthose following and a slap in the face of God.
            He should tread lightly. Very lightly.

        • jorgelm123

          Oh please…

        • 0Dash96

          Jakes is an “awesome man of God?” No. He’s as false as they come and pray those who have been led astray would recognize that.

      • Iamionis

        When we as christian’s get in our mind that all sin is horrible, and know that God say’s, in this instance I see Jesus kneeling down writing in the dirt saying he has no sin cast the 1st stone, if we didn’t spend so much time trying to uncover one another’s faults, and use the gift of LOVE that God has giving to each one trying to win lost souls over, we would be a more effective body of believers…If you know your word you will never see a time when JESUS pointed out a person sins he covered them, and when he was angry about the money changer he was upset about the situation and not the people as individuals…Put on the mind of Christ for goodness sake, God forbid we know you what your sin is you “Perfect People” we have to better SAINTS.

        • Watchman on the Wall

          I do know my word and you are wrong. Sin must be confronted when in the body of Christ. It must be done in love and due order. What you are doing here is allowing sin to grow by shaming anyone who recognizes it. That allows the cancer of sin to grow and rot the body from within.

          And just so you know, in the very example you gave, Christ wrote the sins down for everyone there to see. They weren’t hidden they were uncovered. Sin, hidden, grows and festers. Sin, exposed to the light, withers and dies.

        • McRay66

          You seem to forget that after he for gave them he told him to go and sin no more

    • Samuel F Waddell

      It does. There seems to be many these days!

  • Rebecca

    What a compromising fool he is. A Charlatan. A false teacher. It’s good to know God will deal with Mr. Jakes in His own time.

    • Sondra Cherry

      Tickling of the ears..end times prophecy being fulfilled more and more every day. Knowing the word of God warns us of people like TD. It’s still disheartening to see this happen.

    • jorgelm123

      I totally agree!

  • Pam Parizo

    Paul did not grapple over homosexuality. I think he stated it fairly clear in Romans chapter 1. We should have love for the sinner but that doesn’t mean accommodating their lifestyle.

  • Alien Attack

    So, basically people should develop their own theology, culture, and values based on their sinful desires and then themselves into a group with the label ‘church’? Got it.

    • DJ Salinger

      Uh yep. How else do you explain Catholicism, Baptism, Protestant, Dutch Reform, Lutheran, or any of the other 41,000 denominations out there—and that’s JUST for Christianity alone.

      There aren’t many essential doctrines that define what it means to be a Christian. So, how about you let this man be his type of Christian. You be yours. And let things be as they are.

      • Louise

        Or better yet, why don’t we let God’s word be the final authority on everything.

        • DJ Salinger

          That too. Either way, we’re certainly not going to get anywhere by arguing about gay people and who or what church accepts them. Let people be people. I don’t think they’re living in sin…but that’s me. I’m also not sitting here judging others like I’m some sort of self-righteous king of the universe.

          • Les Mcc

            That’s right…and let those adulterers and pedophiles alone too…why, they’re just “being themselves”..why should we judge them?!

          • DJ Salinger

            Oh cool, you brought the slippery slope argument into this. For a second there, I was worried nobody would do that. Lumping adulterers and paedophiles into the same category is a bit extreme, don’t you think?

          • Bishop Asuquo

            Your opinion, obviously, counts then. If you don’t judge the behavior of homosexuals as sin cos you ain’t qualified to, why call his statement being extreme when he said we should let pedophiles and adulterers be themselves. You judged him as being extreme consequently. I know we can’t help it. It just kicks in. Why do you think pedophiles and adulterers are living in sin? Besides, you are not “some self-righteous king”. You can’t possibly judge them as sinful.

          • DJ Salinger

            My opinion doesn’t count anymore than anyone else’s. I’m just not idiotic or self-righteous enough to think that I can judge others for doing what they do.

            Paedophiles and adulterers are completely different situations. Adultery is a violation of a person’s trust and marriage vows. Not against the law. It’s a moral issue. Paedophilia is not.

            Paedophilia is against the law. It also causes victims and damages families. It causes biological harm, especially if incest-based.

            Homosexuality does nothing of the sort to anyone involved and causes no societal or biological harm.

            So, no. I’m not judging anyone. I’m also not quick to lump all these things into the same category and treat them as if they are equals.

          • Kaleb Marshall

            Paedophilia is against whose law? And upon what is that law based, shifting, changing man, or eternal, unchangeable God?

          • DJ Salinger

            Uh … paedophilia is against every law on the books. In every state and on the national level. So it’s against OUR laws. Secular laws. Human laws. Which EVERYONE follows. Nobody is exempt from following national and state secular laws. People are exempt, however, from following religious laws—especially if they don’t prescribe to said religion. Let me guess … you’re a theocrat?

            Do what you want to do with your religious laws and doctrines—but they don’t belong in the public sphere of law and policy. Not everyone follows your God’s religious law and doctrine. If you want to discuss the merits of secular law and the legal ramifications of it, let’s do that. Using secular terms.

            If you wish to discuss the merits of religious law and the moral ramifications of it, let’s do that. Using religious terms. The two are mutually exclusive and should not be mixed together.

            It’s the only way to give a solid foundation on which a discussion can build. Using secular laws, developed by man.

          • Kaleb Marshall

            How can a “solid foundation” be provided when man’s views cannot remain consistent? You and I might agree that pedophilia is wrong… but a pedophile wouldn’t. 100 years ago, pretty much everybody agreed homosexuality is wrong… now it’s *maybe* 50/50 in the Western world.

            If consensus is how you build law, then what is wrong with slavery? What is wrong with putting someone down, based on their skin color?

          • DJ Salinger

            100 years ago, pretty much everybody agreed homosexuality is wrong? They did? Where’s your source for such a claim?

            If you do a bit of research, you’ll find that homosexuality has been present in humans since before Biblical times. As has people who are trans and other forms of gender/sexual fluidity.

            A paedophile may believe they aren’t doing anything wrong, but their actions cause harm towards others. There’s the difference. Mainly, those (young children) who cannot protect themselves against adult behavior are the ones harmed.

            There is ZERO empirical proof that homosexuality causes harm towards others. Both from a biological, societal and legal perspective. From your religious perspective? Sure. Ok. But again, your religious perspective doesn’t define someone’s life for them.

            Nice job on the slippery slope argument here in talking about slavery. Using that is ridiculous and is not a valid comparison. Owning another human being causes harm to someone. Homosexuals do not cause harm to other people at all … especially not in the same way as slavery or paedophilia does.

            I don’t know how I can make it simpler than that.

          • Kaleb Marshall

            “100 years ago, pretty much everybody agreed homosexuality is wrong? They did? Where’s your source for such a claim?”

            A), it’s common knowledge, B) check Wikipedia. Why were the Stonewall riots a notable event? Because homosexuality was (in 1969) a forbidden thing, as it had been all throughout the 20th century.

            Citing an example of ancient Greeks or Romans is no answer to a claim about 1916. However, it does allow me to try to bring this discussion back to its original place. Homosexuality was known in Biblical times, yes, and God’s word on it was clear and consistent: no. This is why TD Jakes’ situation is so sad. He’s saying the Bible is fuzzy, when on this issue, it’s very clear.

            Why is causing another person harm wrong? Why is it evil? Is it wrong to harm a person (by jailing them) if they have committed an egregious enough wrong (pedophilia)? If so, why?

            I think you may be a little eager to see a slippery slope argument in everything. Go back and read again: my argument was that man’s opinions change on what deeds are wrong. That’s not a slippery slope, it’s documented fact and history.

          • DJ Salinger

            Ok, so TD Jakes is wrong for interpreting the Bible to think one thing vs another. So it’s okay when Kings of England order the Bible to be reinterpreted and reworked according to their ways but one pastor can’t say “meh. the Bible’s kind of fuzzy on homosexuality.”??? Seems to make a ton of sense to me.

            I consider myself a moral relativist, so just so you know—that’s my angle here. Causing harm to another human creates a different feeling within a person. If a person doesn’t feel remorse for said harm, they have a chemical imbalance and should be dealt with appropriately.

            Laws come out of societal and social norms for the general good of all involved. I would hardly consider “jailing” a person as “harming” them. It’s an attempt to reform them so they can be members of society again. At least, that was the intent (I personally believe).

            If I had my way, every punishment would fit the crime. You rape? You get castrated. You kill? You get killed. You’re a paedophile? You get a lobotomy.

            Man’s opinions change. Yes. They have for centuries and they will continue to for centuries to come. You say the Bible does not change. Except for the literal thousands of times where it has. :-/

          • Kaleb Marshall

            “You say the Bible does not change. Except for the literal thousands of times where it has. :-/”

            Now I’m going to have to be the one to ask you to cite your sources. And by the way, I don’t care about changes within a translation– I want to see verifiable changes in the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek sources. (God never promised to make any and all translations pure.)

            It’s very obvious you’re a moral relativist. But I have to ask, relative to what? I don’t know of a single thing that is purely “relative”. The term itself infers another thing, a fixed point, by which navigation is possible.

            Also, how can we look at a different time and say “They shouldn’t have had slavery, it’s bad”, if our own judgments are fickle as the wind? It seemed OK to them; who are we to say it was wrong?

            How is hurting somebody bad? Why is it bad? I’m sorry, but “creating a different feeling” is a completely unsatisfactory answer. Why is it evil to create a bad feeling?

            I can answer these questions. It’s wrong to hurt somebody because an omnipotent, omniscient, loving, and holy being, known as God, said so. This God laid out the Golden Rule as law because it is an aspect of his nature. Bad feelings are an *effect*, not the source, of evil.

            And last, no, it’s not OK to try to rework the Bible to make it say something it doesn’t. If I “translate” Don Quixote so that Quixote chased after actual giants, rather than windmills, I’m ruining the story, aren’t I? And it’s much worse if we’re talking about what God has dictated, rather than a fictional story of man.

          • Clay

            See now, you have these things wrong, the Bible was not interpreted it was translated, there is a big difference. It has more original texts than any other writing known to man. It historic accuracy to mans evolution and history is undisputable.

          • Clay

            During the time of the Roman Empire, The Babylonian Empire, they were thought to indestructible. That they would rule forever. Egypt was a world power. But there were 3 things that these empires did that are distinct in each ones downfall and they are !.) A turning away from God’s Word, 2.) Political Corruptness. 3.) Sexual Immorality. These were the down fall to any nation and a reproach on any people.

          • DJ Salinger

            No. You’re wrong. Your first point is VERY wrong. Read a friggin history book. Here’s why you’re wrong on the turning away from God’s word:

            In case you forgot or are misremembering things: The ROMANS WERE NOT CHRISTIANS until it became the state religion in 380. Christianity ended centuries of persecution, sure, but the rise of another religion contributed to the fall of Rome. It shifted the current belief, that Roman emperors were divine and shifted the glory of the state to a sole deity (you call him God).

            Sexual immorality played ZERO role in the fall of Rome. The only thing you got correct there was the political corruptness. Here are a few other things that ACTUALLY contributed to Rome’s fall:

            1. The Germanic Tribe Invasions – Starting in the 300s and finally falling in 476, the barbaric tribes hit Rome with forces unseen before. Rome got comfortable. Let their guard down and had major issues defending the city from these barbarians.

            2. Economic troubles and slave labor – Oppressive taxation widened the gap between rich and poor. Given that the Romans weren’t conquering Europe as well as they used to, slave labor dried up. No conquered countries? No slaves. No labor.

            3. They also overextended their military efforts and all of their efforts to logistically control their lands failed miserably.

            4. Political Corruption (so … you got one thing right).

            5. The reliance on foreign mercenaries: The ranks of the legions filled with Germanic tribes and other barbarians. While these Germanic soldiers were good fighters, they also had little or no loyalty to the Empire, and their power-hungry officers often turned against their Roman employers. In fact, many of the barbarians who sacked the city of Rome and brought down the Western Empire had earned their military stripes while serving in the Roman legions.

            Next time you try to step up and prove something, open a history book.

          • Rob T

            Are you really claiming you have no god secular argument against pedophilia or slavery? That if your Bible didn’t say they were wrong, you’d have no problem with them? I have to doubt that.

          • Kaleb Marshall

            Why should I provide a defense of a false belief? Secularism cannot adequately deal with the problem of evil, so no, it cannot explain why pedophilia or slavery are wrong.

          • frybaby

            I think you guys need to back off, go to your own corner and keep this down Thank You

          • Kaleb Marshall

            I think if you look at the discussion, you’ll see it had already basically died off.

          • frybaby

            LOL Hi Kaleb I Noticed later lol I had no sleep

          • frybaby

            LOL Kaleb. I feel so silly now lol Thank you for pointing that out. I’m sitting here LOL.

          • Clay

            Just where do you think these laws that we have come from!! Do you study history and not just history but American history What do you think was the foundation to the Laws of this Land and where they came from??

          • DJ Salinger

            Well … since most of the Founding Fathers in America weren’t Christians — (they were escaping religious persecution and most of them were Deists) … I don’t know where they came from. They were brilliant men—possibly influenced by religious text but also influenced by what they experienced in England and the religious persecution they faced.

            Guess what though? The Constitution says your religion doesn’t get to dictate what other people do. And that’s my point the whole time on here. Now … can you answer me WHY your religion gets to tell people what they can do in the privacy of their own bedrooms and who they can or can’t have sex with?

            WHY? Just answer me that. WHY does YOUR religion get a say?

          • Clay

            WRONG!!!!!

          • DJ Salinger

            Man … you have so much proof in that statement.

          • Hal Taylor

            Homosexuality does harm! Who do you think brought aids into the country? Brother if you have to wash your hands after going to the bathroom because of germs in a restaurant then I sure hope you realize God didn’t intend a man to put his penis in a pile of poop and rub it inside and out! Yes it causes trust issues, yes it causes biological harm and the lifestyle at large is a very risqué and filthy lifestyle that affects the nature of society. Homosexuality was also against the law but democrats and progressives want to change what the world was and gain power through the anarchy! and most Americans are simply asleep in the light about it or they have their head up their_____! I guess both of them!

          • DJ Salinger

            You’re silly. Who brought AIDS to this country? Well, my sources say that it was likely a shared needle shipment from Haiti and not a single person, but ok. That’s a tired argument anyway. “Put his penis in a pile of poop” – wow. Aren’t you one for the potent analogies and experiences? Are you drawing from personal knowledge on this or something?

            You lose all credibility when you refer to homosexual behavior that way. You sound like a friggin child on the playground in 4th grade.

            It does not cause biological harm. It does not cause physical harm. It does not cause societal harm. Show me empirical and scientific data from legitimate sources.

            Homosexuality was not “against the law.” Sodomy was. But not homosexuality. You make it sound as though simply being a homosexual could get you arrested and thrown in jail. And so what? What’s it to you? Do you clamor on about someone committing any other crimes? Probably not.

            Let people do what they want to do and let them achieve their own form of personal liberty as long as you’re not impacting the rights of another or stopping another from achieving said liberty. What’s wrong with you, “brother?”

          • Hal Taylor

            I did because it is truly relevant in this discussion. I used to counsel young men at Grady Hospital in Atlanta who suffered with aids and their families. Don’t tell me that homosexuality does no harm. Sit and deal with the shattered families dealing with the anger and resentment that is found in the death of their loved one. The money that has been diverted to cure this disease with more than 39 million adults and children infected worldwide could have been used for other problems. This has caused problems in individual countries as well as world wide. HIV is one of the most devastating threats to human health. As a result of HIV’s ability to reproduce itself so readily in the blood now, where it creates slightly different strains with each reproductive cycle, a cure has eluded researchers since the epidemic was announced in 1981 by a Republican administration and further funded not by 8 years of the Clinton administration but two years after their leaving Washington another Republican gave money for the first time to Africa to begin an international fight against this. I disagree with homosexuality but to say it does no harm is intellectually dishonest or complete naïve!

            Yes it has been accepted for 40years that Gaetan Dugas a French-Canadian flight attendant brought it is the Americas. Yes needles and drug abusers from Haiti also contributed as well but it is still true today that by far in America those contracting the aids virus get it through homosexual activity or through sex with someone who has practiced anal sex.
            Yes the analogy of a fecal covered penis is not ridiculous. It is just like you guys on the left not admitting to the barbaric practice of partial birth abortion even after having it available to see on the web. You have no guts to watch the truth of something because you will have to admit to that truth or to your course indifference. I am sure by your words you would believe in evolution over creationism. If that is the case then your arguments fall short again. Men were created to fit into a woman and reproduce. It is a perfect fit and plan whether it be natural or super natural, but you want everyone to be so open minded but factless in their ideas. Look at all the evidence get off your sofa and get into the game. Admit the truth to yourself first then you will be able to do so to others as well! Good luck!

          • DJ Salinger

            I’m still not sure why you just spent 10 sentences discussing AIDS with me. I don’t care. It’s not relevant to the topic at hand.

            The topic at hand is: Your Bible and your religion doesn’t get to decide what is morally righteous or lawful for people in this country—especially when it involves something that is private and personal. How would you like it if I went around and told you that youwere going to hell because you went to church every Sunday and practice prayer in the privacy of your own home?

            Honestly. Answer it.It’s not rhetorical.

            Don’t lump me in with “you guys on the left.” I’m a Libertarian and a moral relativist. I think individual liberties [protected by the Constitution] should be of the utmost consideration, that we should limit the scope of the government when it comes to social welfare programs and you should let people do what they want to do as long as that action doesn’t infringe upon another person’s personal liberty to achieve the same. Why is that so difficultfor you to understand?

            Nice job dodging the question about showing me empirical and scientific data that proves homosexuality causes harm to people in the same way that paedophilia or incestous relationships do. I implore you to do some research. I also have no clue as to why you brought abortion to this discussion. It holds no bearing on what we were talking about and is a feeble attempt to detract from the crux of our conversation here.

            And yeah, I believe in evolution. But I also believe in a Deity higher than me who had some ideas in mind when the universe came into existence. There are some beautiful things in the way our DNA and the rest of our world is structured, that it’s impossible to not see the hand of a Deity in the mix of that. The world and our universe are very, very, very very old. We have been here (as homo sapiens) for a fraction of that time, and even that has been over 200,000 years. Evolution is a slow burn and there’s proof of it all around us. There is zero scientific proof to show anything but that.

            Now, all the other stuff? I couldn’t care less. Religion is a fool’s game and one that I don’t like playing. It’s divisive, exclusive and has been used throughout history to marginalize and oppress people—all in the name of “God.”

            It’s not your business to tell me what to do. So don’t tell me to “get off my sofa and get into the game.” I’m in the game and I’m very well educated and have plenty of thoughts about a lot of things if you want to discuss them.

          • astimemarcheson

            If someone believed I am going to hell for any reason I would allow them the right to their opinion, not seek take away their right to free speech. As a Christian, I hear nasty things said about Christianity and Christians every day. There is no human right “not to be offended”

          • DJ Salinger

            You don’t understand what “free speech” means. Also, oh boo hoo. Poor Christian in the majority. Your plight is so tough.

          • astimemarcheson

            LOl I am not one complaining about what others have to say, that would be you.
            . you said…”How would you like it if I went around and told you that you were going to hell because you went to church every Sunday and practice prayer in the privacy of your own home?”

          • DJ Salinger

            I’m not complaining about what others have to say. I’m complaining … rather countering the argument that someone’s religion can be used to justify mistreating another person for something of which they are not in control. Example here: their sexual orientation.

            And yes, I did say those words … as a retort to something the person said. Context matters you know.

          • astimemarcheson

            In the Christian faith, the sin is the activity not the “orientation”. A person who has sinful desires is called to overcome temptation and not fall into sin.

          • DJ Salinger

            In the Christian faith. There’s your kicker. It’s not your job to go around doling out opinions on people’s personal behaviors and livelihoods. You have zero obligation to anyone but yourself and your God to live your life how you so choose.

            Again, “in the Christian faith.” Great. Good for the Christian faith. Not everyone follows that though.

          • astimemarcheson

            This IS a discussion about a
            CHRISTIAN PASTOR and his position on homosexuality! So I think this is the place to express my opinions, which I have the same right to do as anyone else.

          • astimemarcheson

            Never mind the “harm” caused by anal sex, I guess you have not heard of the increase in throat cancer due to the HPV virus being spread by oral sex…

          • DJ Salinger

            People can do what they want. Who are you to say otherwise? And what “harm” by anal sex? You do realize that hetero couples have anal sex and oral sex just like homosexual couples do, right? You act as though those two acts are exclusively linked to homosexuality.

            They aren’t.

          • astimemarcheson

            I never said they could not . I am saying it is harmful to practice anal and oral sex, and yes it is harmful for homosexuals and heterosexuals. STIs are more easily transmitted by anal sex, such as HIV, and gonorrhea, According to the CDC STI’s are on the increase mostly among gay men. Then there is physical harm to the anal area by years of such activity resulting in fecal incontinence. To suggest that such abnormal practices are safe is ludicrous. There are reams of information available about the dangers of anal sex, educate yourself.

          • DJ Salinger

            But … I didn’t say anal sex wasn’t harmful. You somehow gleaned “this guy supports anal sex and therefore needs to know how harmful it is even though it’s not relevant to the conversation at all” from my exchange with the person above. That’s on you. You brought that to the discussion. Not me.

            Anal sex is harmful. Sure. For both heterosexual and homosexual couples. However, someone being homosexual is not harming anyone. Which was my original point. I said homosexuality causes no harm to anyone. Which is true.

            Again, you’re making the connection (mostly in your own mind it seems) that homosexuality automatically equals anal sex and therefore, since anal sex is harmful, homosexuality must be as well.

            Quite the leap.

          • ciyelceo1

            i’ve decided not to get involved in this.
            I’m going with what the word says about homosexuality, and i’ve decided love the sinner and hate the sin.
            Good evening.

          • DJ Salinger

            Love the sinner and hate the sin doesn’t work though. But ok. Good for you.

          • ciyelceo1

            ….its been working for me….¯_(ツ)_/¯

          • Dianne James

            I will do the same…make no more comments on the matter. Love and pray for the sinner.

          • Tree87

            The bible says do not dress like the opposite sex and do not lay down with the same sex! DJ, sounds like you are kicking that liberal Harvard trash. Homosexuality is a sin unto death in the bible and is the same in OT/NT, no excuses for willful sin and transgressing God’s laws.

          • DJ Salinger

            Uh … so when did the Bible get to dictate what people who don’t follow the Bible do with their lives? I guess I missed that part.

            FYI: Your religious text doesn’t determine how everyone should be living their lives, who they are sleeping next to, how they dress.

            “Transgressing God’s laws?” Get out of here with that. God’s laws only effect those who follow his doctrine. You don’t have the right to push that onto other people. Get it?

          • Tree87

            If you are an ATHEIST you should not even be here making any argument. You don’t believe in the spook god. You have said in your heart there is no God…

          • DJ Salinger

            Where did I say I was an Atheist? … You need to re-read my comment.

          • Clay

            No God’s Law is for God’s universe which this is. Whether you accept it or not is not the issue. It does not change its relevance. You see the God that you deny, also gave you the free will to deny him. But rest assured, “God is not mocked, for in due season you will reap what you sow. Just because you do not follow it has nothing to do with whether it is relevant or not.

          • DJ Salinger

            This isn’t God’s universe. It doesn’t have an owner and we are just a mere grain of sand in the desert of our universe. We are a mere MILLISECOND in the time of the universe and are lucky to even be here.

            And relevant to whom, exactly? Only His followers, right? Or those who believe. I’ll ask this again since NOBODY on this website seems to be able to answer it:

            Why is it YOUR place to tell other people who they can and can’t sleep with in the privacy of their own bedrooms? Why do you care? What does it matter to you?

          • Wayne Verret

            DJ – This is God’s universe. Colossians 1:15 He (Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. 18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. DJ – you must know that God does not discriminate against the homosexual : Paul speaks this in 1 Corinthians 6: 9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[a] nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. DJ – Notice here that Paul says that some of the Believers in the Corinthian Church were changed: 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. DJ – So while the entire list of people above were in sin, it is possible and quite honestly imperative that one changes his thinking and position on sin. I hope this helps DJ. God’s word challenges all of us on the earth, all the time. Blessings to you.

          • DJ Salinger

            Dude … ok. Fair enough from your standpoint … BUT—Please … PLEASE answer me this: Why is it your religion that gets to be the way of the world? Why is it Christianity that gets to dictate how I should live my life? You don’t have ANY say in what I do or how I live my life. Leave well enough alone and mind your own damn business.

            Nobody … and I mean NOBODY has answered that question for me. Why is it your responsibility to tell me how to live my life according to your standards?

          • Wayne Verret

            DJ – Sorry, Christian scripture does not order me to convince you. I can’t do that. All I am required to do is to share what the Bible says. If you don’t get it, not my problem. The Apostles asked Jesus why He spoke to many followers in parables. His answer was that “understanding” was give to some and not to others (Mathew 13:11-17) In fact, scripture says that none of us do good nor seek after God on our own. (Romans 3:10-11) And that we have all sinned (me too) and fall short of His standard (Romans 3:23) And for sinning we earn spiritual death – according to Christian scripture (Romans 6:23) As spiritually dead men, we can do nothing – according to Christian scripture. To become spiritually alive again, God the Father must first draw us near to Him, (John 6:44) since we can’t do that ourselves. He then must make us alive from spiritual death (Eph 2:1) and cause us to believe (John 6:29) since we will not on our own have faith (Romans 3:10-11). He then leads us to having changed thinking (Romans 2:4) since we will always be tempted to do wrong. The best news of all is that He who began all these good works in us, with be faithful to keep us until the end. (Philippians 1:6). The Father is very busy in Romans Chapter 9 making us either vessels unto honor or unto dishonor. DJ – let us get back to the article. Since TD Jakes is a “Christian” minister, he has to live by the “Christian” standard and the Bible. So, in the previous paragraph, my argument against TD’s statements, is that he is violating the Word of God (that he claims to follow) in 1 Corinthians 6:9-11. I am out DJ – good luck sir!

          • Mzs Pebbles

            Wayne I agree, why cast your peals to swines….we are in a world of lawlessness and everybody wants to do his and her own thing nobody wants to be accountable anymore and we are living prophecy where Good is considered bad and bad is considered good. We can only Pray for the lost for God said in his word that if he did not shorten the time that even the very elect would be fooled and we are seeing his people become fooled by this presents worlds way of doing things…..crazy nevertheless my brethen appreciate your words of wisdom…lets continue to pray for the lost.

          • Wayne Verret

            CALLING GOOD EVIL AND EVIL GOOD

            The only possessions we have and will last are kept above where
            neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break
            through nor steal (Mt 6:20). I agree with you that in this world we all
            naturally won’t do any good not seek after God (Rm 3:10-11). This is of course “spiritual” good. As for as “good” being called “bad” and “bad” “good”, consider the story of Joseph (Gen 37-50). We see his brothers doing an evil (bad) thing by selling Joseph into slavery and then lied about it to their father Jacob. (this is the nature of fallen man) You know the story. Later when his brothers come to Egypt because of the famine, Joseph eventually reveals himself to them. (the Lord
            kept Joseph’s integrity through the whole thing) Then they all move to Egypt. When their father Jacob dies, Joseph’s brothers are afraid that Joseph will now take revenge. The brothers seek mercy from Joseph. But Joseph says (Gen 50:19-21) “19…..“Do not be afraid, for am I in the place of God? 20 But as for you, you meant evil against me; but God meant it for good, in order to bring it about as it is this day, to save many people alive. 21 Now therefore, do not be afraid; I will provide for you and your little ones.” And he comforted them and spoke kindly to them. (what you meant for evil (bad) God meant it for good) In contrast, consider what Jesus said in Mathew 7:21-23 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’. WOW!! Prophesying, casting out demons, doing many wonders in His name – lawlessness??? What appears to be good is rejected by Christ, and considered bad! So, now whenever I see anything that appears to be
            good or bad, not only do I have to call it good or bad, but now have to ask the Lord if He is in it or not. I cannot lean on my own understanding as the scripture says in Proverbs 3:5, but must trust in the Lord with all my heart. The only reason the elect are not deceived is because we belong to Christ and are no longer our own (1 Cor 6:19). We have been bought with a price (1 Cor 6:20). That which Christ possesses will not be lost, but will be raised up at the last day (John 6:39). If there are some that are being fooled, then I would
            submit that they are not the possession of Christ. Whenever I hear someone, with my natural ears, cursing and blaspheming the name of God, I see someone, with my spiritual eyes, crying out for the need of God in their lives. Can the Lord use TD Jakes? He can do things in ways that we don’t understand (Isa 55:8). And finally, let’s pray for each other and the saved too! Remember, we can quote all the verses in the Bible from Genesis through Revelation. But if we have
            not the love of Christ in us first, it’s for nothing (1 Cor 13:1-3).

          • TruGalt

            What a complete fool you are.

          • DJ Salinger

            At least I don’t believe in fairy tales.

          • jorgelm123

            You will when you kneel before His throne one day!!

          • DJ Salinger

            Ok buddy. whatever you say.

          • bouncy

            Lovely well said

          • goldknight1

            shhhhh….stop using logic.

          • Dianne James

            Isn’t this what gay men do? so..if sodomy was against the law…..what’s the difference? Sodomy is generally anal or oral sex between people or sexual activity between a person and a non-human animal (bestiality), but may also include any non-procreative sexual activity. Originally the term sodomy, which is derived from the story of Sodom and Gomorrah in chapters 18 and 19 of the Book of Genesis in the Bible, was commonly restricted to anal sex.

          • DJ Salinger

            Gay men only engage in sodomy??? Yes. That must be it. And heterosexual couples only engage in penis-to-vagina sex—in the missionary position. Get out of here with that nonsense.

            Sodomy may have been against the law but so what? Why does it matter to you? Nobody’s forcing you to have sodomy with another person? Why are you SO concerned with what people do with their private parts?

          • Dianne James

            God wants His children to care about others and make moral judgements….actually, the Bible commands Christians to do this. The old testament tells us to warn those that practice wicked things to turn from their evil ways

          • Glenn Ward

            Not in the Muslim arena. Their

            Prophet

            was a pedophiliac

          • DJ Salinger

            Since religion does not equal law, your analogy makes zero sense. Paedophilia is against the law regardless of your religious preference.

          • FedUp

            Although adultery is a misdemeanor in most of the states with laws against it, some — including Michigan and Wisconsin — categorize the offense as a felony. Punishments vary widely by state. In Maryland, the penalty is a paltry $10 fine. But in Massachusetts, an adulterer could face up to three years in jail.Apr 17, 2014

          • DJ Salinger

            Uh … cool story. What’s your point?

          • Curt Diggs

            Matthew 19:4… 1 Corinthians 5:12-13. Why… you’d THINK Jesus was talking to YOU and ME! Does God’s Word, “evolve”? I speak this to YOUR Shame (1 Corinthians 15:34).

          • Watchman on the Wall

            It wasn’t to God. Check your scriptures.

          • Glenn Ward

            My sins I commit are no less or greater than the ones done by the LGBT or any sexual deviant people. I just don’t want everyone to ACCEPT or CELEBRATE my sins!

          • DJ Salinger

            It’s not your place to determine that those people are sinning though. You have absolutely ZERO say over what is a sin for those people. Your religion is not the religion of all and therefore not one that everyone needs to be following. We are not a theocracy.

          • Clay

            I am not saying what I say, I am telling you what God says. Will you deny that scripture states that homosexuality is an abomination before GOD???

          • DJ Salinger

            I won’t deny it … but again why does your Christian religion get to say what’s right or wrong for people? That’s the question I keep asking on here that NOBODY seems to want to answer.

            We are not a theocracy. All are not required to follow a certain religion endorsed by the government. So … I still fail to see how it’s YOUR place to tell others that they are living in sin. Worry about yourself.

          • sherry1053

            If you are living in sin…you better get right with God…or get saved first..then get right with God! We are all sinners saved by grace…if we live in sin…we are going to hell

          • AaTaRee

            If you don’t think a LGBT Christian is living in sin, consider reading Romans 1.

          • DJ Salinger

            If you think your religion gets to dictate how other people in the United States live their lives, you need to consult a history and government book.

          • Iamionis

            Amen!

          • Watchman on the Wall

            That’s an ineffective argument when you view it in light of the scriptures. We are to judge rightly peoples fruits. We are to bring believers under correction for sins within the body. The scriptures bear this out and even give us the process to do this. Too many people hiding behind the “judge not” quote without understanding its context. This live and let live attitude is what has opened the door to so much world getting into the body of Christ. It is almost impossible, now, to tell the difference between the world and the body of Christ in America. Why would any sinner want to be a part of a body that is just as riddled with sin as the world they are in.

          • DJ Salinger

            Nope. That’s not your “right” to do that. You don’t get to force your religious will onto another living person. Sorry. That’s not how it works.

      • bamaclt

        Maybe you should read Acts and Romans.

        • DJ Salinger

          Maybe you shouldn’t use your religious text to tell others what to do or how to live their lives.

          • bamaclt

            Your quarrel is with science, not religion. More specifically, XX and XY. Only when the two mate do we further the species. XX + XY = children. XX + XX and XY + XY = stalemate. If you want to live in a feelings first bubble, driven by emotion and fantasy, so be it. My religious beliefs do not agree, but my God also tells me to love my neighbors and enemies. So, have a blessed day.

          • DJ Salinger

            I think you totally misunderstand what I’m saying here. I don’t quarrel with science. You’re building up a nice straw man for yourself there though by mentioning the XX and XY nature of procreation—which I never said ANYTHING about.

  • MinisterKarl

    ALL the churches will be led by satan, it is foretold in scripture…. the church is spiritually the most dangerous places on earth. Trust your bible alone. Judgement has started in the churches, the ‘holy place’ spoken of. In matthew 24 GOD tells you they will preach of a counterfeit jesus,, in each and every church, to test believers. Trust GODs word the holy bible and stop worshipping the churches and their leaders…td jakes is no different… God says No church is spared by satan rule! The true church of God is invisible, it is the body of believers, the ones saved by Jesus Christ, Amen read more and join in fellowship at godsaveme2 com

  • Dude

    False prophet glutenous piece of trash right here folks

    • DJ Salinger

      How very tolerant and Christ-like of you to say that.

      • Dude

        Let’s see what Jesus Christ has to say on the matter ..

        Matthew 7:15-20

        15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

        • DJ Salinger

          Hmm … let’s see what Jesus Christ has to say on the matter …

          Matthew 7:1-5elpful Not Helpful

          “Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.

          James 4:11-12

          Do not speak evil against one another, brothers. The one who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, speaks evil against the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?

          • Dude

            I’m glad that you are reading The Bible ..It’s too bad you don’t understand It .

            Romans 16:17 — 17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

            John 7:24 — 24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

            1 Corinthians 6:2-3 — 1 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
            3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

            You see , I actually know what I’m talking about .. I didn’t have to run to google to find These Verses like you did ..

          • Bill Charlton

            Brother, you did provide valuable scriptural insight, but I would encourage a spirit of meekness and humility. If the Creator of the Universe could humble Himself before those He created, then certainly we could do the same before one another.

          • Dude

            You’re right . I need to work on that .pray for me

          • DJ Salinger

            Awww. Someone’s going to tough talk the Bible to me. Get real, dude.

            I actually know what I’m talking about, too. And bigotry and judgement is still bigotry and judgement regardless of what religion you assign it to.

          • Dude

            I’m marking false prophet heretics . I wont stop

          • beachcombert

            You can find individual verses of Scripture to support any type of hate and discrimination that you like. But if you read the Gospel as a whole (not just Paul’s very limited interpretation of it), you find Jesus telling the Pharisees and the rest of us to get over our self-righteousness and leave the judging to God. Pay attention to context. The Scriptures were written centuries before humans had any clear understanding of orientation, which exists on a spectrum — not simply gay, straight or bi. Very few of us are 100 percent gay or 100 percent straight. Ponder that and think about why God created us that way. Many of the once-powerful ex-gay ministries have now confessed that were mistaken and they injured people. Bishop Jakes seems to be “evolving” in the same direction. I pray more people repent of the hatred that they try to disguise as following God’s will. We have the Two Greatest Commandments and if we can focus on those, it won’t upset us if Adam and Steve fall in love, just as Jonathan and David loved each other.

          • Lee Miller

            While I believe love the sinner, hate the sin, You can not say some are half gay, some are all gay. We all were born into sin, saying that god made us this way( homosexual) is wrong! Its sin! Trying to cover it up will not work. Now the problem here is people trying to tell you, you are a sinner. That is not up to us. That is between you and God! Our place is to love all men, teach the word of God. Then let you decide should You go to heaven or hell! End of story, no evolution.

          • Bill Charlton

            Yes, these are good points that must be considered, but when a teacher of God’s Word begins teaching that something is okay that is very clearly sin, then we are to follow the Apostle’s instructions to Timothy to “…rebuke… with all longsuffering and teaching. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth…” (2 Timothy 4).

            BUT, as a warning to others, when a leader in the Church does begin denying the authority of God’s Word (even in just one area), it is a such serious matter as many people’s eternal live’s are at stake, so simply arrogantly casting condemnation upon them might make YOU feel superior, but it’s only aiding the enemy. How about humbly rebuking with spiritual correction and praying for him on a regular basis (I’ve just added him to my regular list)? He has a LOT of people in his audience, so you may be helping to save a LOT more people!

  • DJ Salinger

    One look at this comment section and it’s quite clear not a single person on here is following the prescribed guidelines above.

    “engage in reasonable discussion about matters affecting our nation and our world” Oh yeah. Full of reasonable discussion.

    “Laodicea-esque televangelist who’s more invested in selling his latest book series”
    “What a compromising fool he is. A Charlatan. A false teacher.”
    “False prophet glutenous piece of trash right here folks”

    • AckbarSays

      It is perfectly reasonable to call a charlatan a charlatan.

    • Peter Coburn

      That’s because the “prescribed guidelines” above are heretical for Christians, let me spell it out for you DJ, homosexuality is “an abomination” (sin) to God. (his own words, not merely an opinion) TD Jakes or any other mortal man has NO RIGHT to defy the immortal immutable almighty GOD of the universe. There’s a Biblical precedent set by the Lord Jesus Christ, he was always under the authority of the Father, you must be under authority to have the authority of Heaven. TD Jakes just relinquished all authority (if he ever had any) to speak for God by choosing another master to be his LORD. He chose public opinion to be his LORD, not Jesus Christ.

  • AckbarSays

    TD Jakes, you ARE the weakest link. Goodbye!

  • storie

    If he really said all that, in that context, then I’m afraid I can’t listen to him anymore. That is scary.

  • Penal prince

    Luv Jakes but can’t agree with that position. Evolving or not.

  • Apostle Sam Martin

    This nation was not created for the Christian values or views but Christianity was brought here. It was not in perfection that Christianity came other wise people would have fought for there to never to have had slavery, that’s not Christian. This nation have become a place of freedom and everyone has their right to exist but with respect of their neighbors regardless what they may be. To the church; Bro. Thomas is right, let them worship where they might be comfortable. It might not be my house or his but somewhere there is a preacher that has lived that lifestyle, & he will not pass judgement on them & treat them fairly bc he understands the fight they face. What a nation does is not what a church or God does. I do differ with the notion, of what the church is. The church is & should be a portal of the Kingdom of God where His citizens come to learn & gain that we might support one another h learn of the mercies of our Father from the leadership & elders entrusted to teach those that desire to be of his way & be acceptable citizens of His Kingdom even as we live in this realm. Our Father who art in heaven does not live here on this earth yet he does live in us that have proclaimed his son as Lord and him a Jehovah as Father their father. Politically, I agree with Bro. Thomas, that we should not elect officials based on religious values, because I doubt that we would have elected our fore-fathers to office had it been based on religion. I respect my neighbor that is Muslim or Catholic or whatever even the separatists that dislike me because I’m black. I’m not a bad person because I’m black & if one was drowning I would save him that he in his twisted & from my view demented perspectives would be enlighten that his upbringing & teachings have been significantly flawed. Maybe he will se the Jesus in me & change his tormenting ways bUT he is as worth life as long as he isn’t trying 2 take one. Yes the world is changing but in this change good can come. Even though I myself am not gay by sexuality I am happy to meet those that are & I don’t hate them nor do I preach wagging a bible to make them turn from there ways, I try to do that with my life. I hope to be a living example of Christ that they will want & convert from what they have converted to. None of use have lived a perfect life & noneof us are without being fairly stoned but if we walk right & talk right &life what we walk & talk then maybe someone will follow you out of where they are or have been. Gays do things that are distasteful to me but so do some of my Black people, Asians, Whites & Latin fellow citizens. No of use are perfect, from the front of the church to the back. None are without a past, neither is Christianity, neither am I nor are you. We all that were not Jews disn’t hAve a chance at everlastinglife, until, Jesus died for us ALL. We were to be slaughtered because, we did have an advocate. So, the path of hope we have we a killer of us, considered heathens, unholy & unrighteousness & unworthy. So go figure. I don’t agree with Bro. Jakes because of who he is but because he is right about the things that he is right on. Jehovah is not about to take him down, just because some of you don’t agree with him. If you stop supporting him a thousand will replace you because he speaks truth & life to the lifeless & hope to those without hope & helps those that feel helpless. He ministers to them that need what he believes. As his views change with greater wisdom so will the hearts of those that esteem his teaching. He is a great man from awesome struggles of his own. Don’t judge him judge yourself & maybe some day they will interview you with something worth hearing. You are some body now, but what does your some body do for somebody looking for hope. If your cursing him your cursing yourself; because you didn’t make him nor did you put him where he is. I hope there is something to be learned from all this harsh talk about a man that hope greater for you than you do for yourself…

  • mjdubb0811

    “The church should have the right to have its own convictions and values; if you don’t like those convictions and values [and] you totally disagree with it, don’t try to change my house, move into your own … and find somebody who gets what you get about faith.” Based on that statement It’s like he’s saying go find a church that believes and affirms your gay life style because you won’t find it at the Potters House.

  • Min Terrance Powell

    If those are the things that Jakes said, then he actually spoke what God has said in the word. The world will do what it wants even if it against His wishes. I agree that Homosexuals should go to where their lifestyle is accepted. BECAUSE THE ONE TRUE LIVING GOD ISN’T THE ONE!!!1

  • http://www.mconcernedsmanifesto.com/ msconcerned

    He said, “The church should have the right to have its own convictions and values…” Hmm, I’m thinking the church should align itself with the Word, or consider changing the name to – I May or May Not Have a Problem, If I Do I’m ok With it Anonymous. Where Fluffer Nutter is served on Sundays.

  • Roxy Wade

    He has been a FALSE teacher for a long time!!! NOTHING has changed!!! Godless false teaching!!!

  • Sandra Greer Phillips

    Gays ought to be able to attend churches where they are not treated like pariahs. They should be able to deal with their sins on their own in the confines of the church like anyone else. They should not feel unworthy to hear the word of God nor should the word of God be altered to accommodate them.

    • Les Mcc

      why don’t we just say “sinners ought to be able to attend churches where they are not treated like pariahs”!? because that’s what we all are. maybe the difference is that some of us are sorry for our sin-not running around flaunting it and celebrating it. If the church starts doing that…God help us.

  • chiboy773

    An people still listen to this fool. Folks worship their pastor and not the bible

  • Nick25

    We are in The Great Falling Away. There is not ONE place in the bible that even hints homosexuality is acceptable. God does not “evolve.” His truths are everlasting and universal. TD will have a lot to answer for at his death- he’ll be responsible for many, many souls ending up in hell.

    This is terrible.

    • DJ Salinger

      God doesn’t evolve. Except for the thousands of times where the Bible was reinterpreted and re-written by mankind. But yeah, definitely has never evolved.

      • Nick25

        God does not change- The Bible is the inerrant word of God. That’s a fact.

        • matthew

          That’s an interpretation of a belief.

          • Nick25

            It’s a fact.

          • matthew

            Thanks for clarifying

          • Nick25

            No problem- it’s my job 🙂

      • Amos Moses

        Dramatically, when the Bible manuscripts are compared to other ancient writings, they stand alone as the best-preserved literary works of all antiquity. Remarkably, there are thousands of existing Old Testament manuscripts and fragments copied throughout the Middle East, Mediterranean and European regions that agree phenomenally with each other. In addition, these texts substantially agree with the Septuagint version of the Old Testament, which was translated from Hebrew to Greek some time during the 3rd century BC. The Dead Sea Scrolls, discovered in Israel in the 1940’s and 50’s, also provide astounding evidence for the reliability of the ancient transmission of the Jewish Scriptures (Old Testament) in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd centuries BC.

        The manuscript evidence for the “New Testament” is also dramatic, with nearly 25,000 ancient manuscripts discovered and archived so far, at least 5,600 of which are copies and fragments in the original Greek. 4 Some manuscript texts date to the early second and third centuries, with the time between the original autographs and our earliest existing fragment being a remarkably short 40-60 years.

        Interestingly, this manuscript evidence far surpasses the manuscript reliability of other ancient writings that we trust as authentic every day. Look at these comparisons: Julius Caesar’s The Gallic Wars (10 manuscripts remain, with the earliest one dating to 1,000 years after the original autograph); Pliny the Younger’s Natural History (7 manuscripts; 750 years elapsed); Thucydides’ History (8 manuscripts; 1,300 years elapsed); Herodotus’ History (8 manuscripts; 1,350 years elapsed); Plato (7 manuscripts; 1,300 years); and Tacitus’ Annals (20 manuscripts; 1,000 years).

  • mariner

    He is the epitamy of 2 tim 4:1-4 a false teacher tickling the ears of those that can’t endure sound doctrine. There will be a speacial place in hell for this man.

  • Joan Rogers

    We Born Again Believers abiding in Christ are the Church/Bride of Christ. God is Holy and He warns not to add to His Word or take away from His Word.
    If a Pastor has his own set of beliefs and values apart from God’s Word..He does not know God or His Word. Is not led of Holy Spirit.
    I agree that all sinners go to church, but to learn the truth of the Word of God and to receive Christ as Lord,
    Repenting and confessing to God , being forgiven by God, To Repent Luke13:3 is to turn away from sin to God Once God forgives you, you do not go back and commit the sin again.
    Let me say this…Christ is coming for a pure and spotless Bride not a whore.
    No sin abides in Christ. We saints of God abide in Christ (2 masters God and the devil 1John3:6-10)
    This is Apostasy, rejecting the authority of the Word of God. Putting oneself above God and His Word.
    We are in the last days…You either are with God or against God. Either you are Hot or Cold, the Hot is with Our Lord, the cold are going to hell. the lukewarm…they believe but do not obey the Word of God and God will spew them out. beware…tickling the ears of lost sinners , you grieve Holy Spirit.
    The Church is not about color, Race. It is spiritual. What gospel is he teachubg? Seer JoanR

  • Ron Townson

    Just another ignorant nygar showing his stupidity. Kinda ugly too!

    • DJ Salinger

      Just another so-called Christian showing their tolerance. Speaking of ugly, someone should smack the doctor who delivered you.

  • tolive

    The Word of God is clear, it doesn’t progress or evolve. When you hear those two words you pretty much know where an indevidual is going.

    • DJ Salinger

      The word of God doesn’t evolve. Except for the thousands of times where the Bible was reinterpreted, commissioned, and rewritten. You’re right. No progression or evolution at all.

  • http://www.erictangumonkem.com Eric Tangumonkem

    The Bible is the final standard and no Bishop even Jakes can change God’s word. SIN is sin and nobody is exempt. The wages of sin is death and every soul that sins will die. It is a pity that this generation does not believe in the power of the gospel in transforming our lives. When you come to Christ you are Born Again. You become a new creature in Christ. You are expected to bear the fruit of the Holy Spirit. One of this is self-control. You are dead to sin and sin is no longer a master over you. Sodomy has been declared a sin just like many other sins in the Bible.

  • Samuel F Waddell

    His house. I thought that the TRUE CHURCH, all who are born-again were CHRIST’S and not the local pastor’s? The BIBLE Is plain on homosexuality. We cannot add too or take from there is no EVOLUTION with CHRIST. HE is the same yesterday, today and forever Hebrews 13:8. By the way Hebrews 13:4 states that God will judge fornicator and adulterer and that only marriage between a man and woman qualifies people to have sex, in God’s sight.

    • Amos Moses

      What are we to expect from a modalist who does not believe in the trinity?

  • Roxy Wade

    Romans 1:26-32 (SEE 1:18-32 FOR FULL CONTEXT)

    26 For this reason God gave them up to vile [VILE] passions. For even their women exchanged the natural [NATURAL] use for what is against [AGAINST] nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural [NATURAL] use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful [SHAMEFUL], and receiving in themselves the penalty [PENALTY] of their error [ERROR] which was due.

    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased [DEBASED] mind, to do those things which are not [NOT] fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness [UNRIGHTEOUSNESS], sexual immorality [SEXUAL IMMORALITY], wickedness [WICKEDNESS], covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness [EVIL-MINDEDNESS]; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God [HATERS OF GOD], violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil [EVIL] things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; 32 who, knowing [KNOWING] the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are [ARE] deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve [BUT ALSO APPROVE] of those who practice them.

  • Samuel F Waddell

    The True Church can only have THE CONVICTIONS OF GOD’S WORD. JESUS is the head of the church not TD Jakes. It is not his house but CHRIST’S. This may be the problem maybe it is his house and not CHRIST’S? Will famous mega-church preachers cause many to stray from God and avoid true salvation or will they FOLLOW JESUS and PREACH HIS WORD, seeing PEOPLE SAVED AND TRANSFORMED? It seems, at this point, that many are doing the former rather than the latter! All people should be invited to hear GOD’S WORD but they should truly hear GOD’S WORD and not have their ears tickled by false teaching. JESUS never considered those who refuse to REPENT as being saved. It is plain in Scripture Luke 13:1-5 Unless you repent you will all likewise perish. This is true for me, for Jakes and for all. IT IS THE WORD OF THE LORD!

  • matthew

    Correct me if this is an incorrect position but the way I am interpreting the Christian faith is this:

    If you don’t believe what I believe, then screw you! You’re a horrible person who should just shut up! I’m right because GOD JUDGES ALL.

    Gays are the worst thing that I can possible think of! I want to make their life on earth as horrific as possible because they’re going to go to hell to suffer for eternity!

    The Bible is flawless. My excuses for not following it are valid! Your excuses for not following it are meaningless and you will suffer for eternity!

    Love thy neighbor and the good works that the book of James talks about is only for select people. God made it the most important commandment because he wants me to be nice to people when I actually practice Christianity: occasionally on Sunday before the NFL begins, and on the occasional religious holiday.

    Man. I hope I’m wrong.

    • Nick25

      Let me correct you.

      God created everything. Man fell because of pride. God rectified everything by sending a Savior. All we have to do is accept that free gift, if we don’t we die in our sins. It’s really quite simple. If you accept it your saved, if you reject it your not saved. Why is that so difficult?

      We were created to glorify God, our creator— everything else is nothing.

      • matthew

        I’ve always thought the salvation piece had a charming ring to it, it’s the people who tell me I need it that turns me off. Why do I want to go to an eternity with people who are so preachy all the time?

        • Nick25

          You were high in bible school, weren’t you lol. I’m not going to tell you what you need- you know what you need.

          And an eternity with preachy people? Your view is warped, but even if it’s not it a HELL of a lot better than the alternative (pun intended 🙂 ).

  • frybaby

    Im so very disappointed in Jakes

  • sherry1053

    Yea..his son is queer..and on his way to hell
    This so called man of God is Evil.

  • Say what?

    Seen this coming a mile away,glad I never followed him.

  • Rick

    1 Peter 1:14-16 As obedient children, do not be conformed to the former lusts which were yours in your ignorance, 15but like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior; 16because it is written, “YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY.”
    There is a great falling away from the faith that Jesus founded 2000 years ago, the obedience that Abraham displayed over 4100 years ago and the purity that Noah showed over 5100 years before.
    The people of God must come out from among them. Be separate, not associate with such or even talk about these lifestyles that defile God’s order for creation.

  • Adrienne

    Ugh…….he’s off my Christmas list.

  • TaKisha R Hudson

    His words were completely taken out of context.

    “My comment on HuffPo TV drifted into issues of the Supreme Court ruling and changing the world through public policy verses personal witness. Further, I have come to respect that I can’t force my beliefs on others by controlling public policy for taxpayers and other U.S. citizens.

    Jesus never sought to change the world through public policy but rather through personal transformation. All people didn’t embrace Him either. That’s what I said and what I meant … Nothing more and nothing less.

    Just because a so-called Christian publication chooses to misconstrue my words using lazy journalistic tactics to further their own agenda and draw attention to their site does not make their statements an accurate depiction of what I said or meant.

    Investigate.

    Do not take everything you read online or hear repeated as truth. When asked about the “black church” and its role in ministering to gay people, I briefly mentioned (we were running out of time) the word “evolved and evolving” regarding my approach over the 39 years of my ministry to gay people who choose to come to our services.

    I simply meant that my method is evolving—not my message. I was shocked to read that this was manipulated in a subsequent article to say I endorsed same-sex marriage! My position on the subject has been steadfast and rooted in Scripture.

    For the record, I do not endorse same-sex marriage, but I respect the rights that this country affords those that disagree with me.”

  • Brian Ssempebwa

    Before any one points a finger at the man OF God, find out, what is sin? Just thinking of doing any sin you have sinned.

  • Dio Jones

    The apostasy and falling away is happening before our eyes…

    Always be a light that is shininginthedark.

  • bamaclt

    Matthew 7:15. It will only get worse from here.

  • Bishop Sam Wherry

    T D JAKES HERE: Like the majority of the Great Chosen of the Almighty God who gone into Service and Mission of God in the Old Testament and today in the New Testament relinquish from retaining God in their knowledge and take position with The World (Society) defying Revelation 22: 18 I testify and warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book [its predictions, consolations, and admonitions]: if anyone adds [anything] to them, God will add to him the plagues (afflictions, calamities) which are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from or distorts the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away [from that one] his share from the tree of life and from the holy city (new Jerusalem), which are written in this book.

    Here it is clearly is in contradiction to Genesis 2: 20b but for Adam there was not found a helper [that was] suitable (a companion) for him. 21 So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam; and while he slept, He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place. 22 And the rib which the Lord God had taken from the man He made (fashioned, formed) into a woman, and He brought her and presented her to the man. 23 Then Adam said,

    “This is now bone of my bones, And flesh of my flesh; She shall be called Woman, Because she was taken out of Man.”

    24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and shall be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both naked and were not ashamed or embarrassed.

    God through Jesus Christ here gives validity to choosing the secular over his Statue/Ordinance for Man/Woman: Romans 1 Unbelief and Its Consequences

    18 For [God does not overlook sin and] the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who in their wickedness suppress and stifle the truth, 19 because that which is known about God is evident within them [in their inner consciousness], for God made it evident to them. 20 For ever since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through His workmanship [all His creation, the wonderful things that He has made], so that they [who fail to believe and trust in Him] are without excuse and without defense. 21 For even though [d]they knew God [as the Creator], they did not [e]honor Him as God or give thanks [for His wondrous creation]. On the contrary, they became worthless in their thinking [godless, with pointless reasonings, and silly speculations], and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory and majesty and excellence of the immortal God for [f]an image [worthless idols] in the shape of mortal man and birds and four-footed animals and reptiles.

    24 Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their own hearts to [sexual] impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them [abandoning them to the degrading power of sin], 25 because [by choice] they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

    26 For this reason God gave them over to degrading and vile passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural [a function contrary to nature], 27 and in the same way also the men turned away from the natural function of the woman and were consumed with their desire toward one another, men with men committing shameful acts and in return receiving in their own bodies the inevitable and appropriate penalty for their wrongdoing.

    28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God or consider Him worth knowing [as their Creator], God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do things which are improper and repulsive, 29 until they were filled (permeated, saturated) with every kind of unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice and mean-spiritedness. They are gossips [spreading rumors], 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors [of new forms] of evil, disobedient and disrespectful to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful [without pity]. 32 Although they know God’s righteous decree and His judgment, that those who do such things deserve death, yet they not only do them, but they even [enthusiastically] approve and tolerate others who practice them.

    Again; Revelation 22: 18 I testify and warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book [its predictions, consolations, and admonitions]: if anyone adds [anything] to them, God will add to him the plagues (afflictions, calamities) which are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from or distorts the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away [from that one] his share from the tree of life and from the holy city (new Jerusalem), which are written in this book.

    I stand firmly as one of the Called/Chosen of Elomin (God) under the Reign and Lordship of Jesus Christ immovable and steadfast as all or commissioned in Isiah 6: Isaiah’s Commission

    8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, “Whom shall I send, and who will go for Us?” Then I said, “Here am I. Send me!” 9 And He said, “Go, and tell this people:‘Keep on listening, but do not understand;

    Keep on looking, but do not comprehend.’

    10 “Make the heart of this people insensitive, Their ears dull, And their eyes dim, Otherwise they might see with their eyes, Hear with their ears, Understand with their hearts, And return and be healed.”

    THAT IS THE MESSAGE NOT INCLUSION. THE MESSAGE RETURN AND BE HEALED TO GENESIS 2: 18-25 LGBT (BE HEALED) AND 1 JOHN 1: 8 If we say we have no sin [refusing to admit that we are sinners], we delude ourselves and the truth is not in us. [His word does not live in our hearts.] 9 If we [freely] admit that we have sinned and confess our sins, He is faithful and just [true to His own nature and promises], and will forgive our sins and cleanse us continually from all unrighteousness [our wrongdoing, everything not in conformity with His will and purpose].

    10 If we say that we have not sinned [refusing to admit acts of sin], we make Him [out to be] a liar [by contradicting Him] and His word is not in us. SO IT BE!

  • Janice Mack

    Righteousness, not religion, exalteth a nation but sin is a reproach to any people.

  • Dick Size

    I’m sure he doesn’t have a horse in this race :/

  • JD Beavers

    The subject is not complicated and is pretty straight forward. The answer is actually quite simple but it is people that refuse to want to hear the truth that cry it is complicated. The answer does not need to evolve due to cultural views. Cultural views has nothing to do with the truth but everything to do with people wanting to try to split hairs with sin. Like it or not the Bible is clear on this subject. As far as going to churches that support that life style it is no different than anyone else pulling out of any church and going somewhere else that will say what they want to hear. That benefits no one for then there is no need to change and the conscience is ignored and seared and the Holy Spirit grieved because the Word of God no longer holds precedence or authority over the issue. I’m afraid that is the sad state of affairs the American church has found itself to be in. There are some true believers out there but they are often marginalized, criticized and ridiculed for the Biblical stance in which they take. It is popular now to stand against and question biblical authority on any moral issue. That is why we need those with a voice to take a stand for righteousness, holiness, and truth. Other wise we will become as stated in 2 Timothy 4:2-4 (KJV)

    2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.

    3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

    4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

    And that is a sad state of affairs for any church to find itself in for then it may find it is no longer effective as a soul winner and becomes no different than any other social group simply trying to provide a social service or agenda. It may provide a good works mentality and deeds but as a soul winner it comes up far too short of that purpose and goal. It is so sad many can not find true peace while this argument continues. There are those who love to stir up divisions in the body of Christ (the church) and try to muddy the Spiritual waters and keep the church focused on the issue in order to divide and cause chaos. I will say that it is highly unlikely you will change anyones view on this issue here. Most are closed to hear or listen, but I challenge you to listen not to me but the Word as the final authority for in the end that is what you will be judged by. Do I hate gays? No. Am I homophobic? No, no more than I’m a drunk-a-phobe, adultr-a-phobe, or sin-a-phobe for all need salvation and Jesus in their hearts for the bible says in Acts 4:12-13

    12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

    13 Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marveled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus.
    We just need some people to get in touch with Jesus. God will take care of the rest.

  • KellyKAFIR

    Absolute heresy! These so called pastors will stand in God’s judgment and even moreso for leading people astray from the word of God. They would be better off to tie a millstone around their neck and throw themselves into the sea…. Well the Bible does say only a remnant will remain.

  • TruGalt

    Narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Homosexuals should come to church and repent from sin.

  • USMC71

    Mr Jakes, does not matter what we puny humans think about what the Lord has commanded. Our is to do – DUTY – and not straining God’s clear principles and precepts through the grid of popular culture. You are forsaking your first love, sir, and embracing the bosom of a foreigner.

  • Bill

    I always thought he was a double talking con man, now I know it

  • Gerardo Jerry Grado

    So…either huff post lied or Christian news lied. In none of this is the bishop saying homosexuality is acceptable

  • Owen Nlekwuwa

    There is nothing complex about the homosexual issue. The word of God is clear and straight on it. The complexity is introduced by people of God who want to be “politically correct,” whatever that means, and will not take a stand with God.

  • David J Hawke

    In the church you find people that gossip, over-eat, cuss, commit adultery, do not walk by faith (whatsoever is not of faith is sin Rom 14;23), live in fear, (first sin listed in Rev) and we smile and shake hands with them. The Bible identifies all of those things as sin. Some don’t pay their taxes , some speak about their Pastor behind his back, and some treat their wives badly. Why can they come to church and someone seeking God but struggling with their sexuality may not? Isn’t church the non judgemental place where people get a chance to see Jesus and receive forgiveness and healing?

  • Edwingts Mompremier

    Throughout times, God has always been looking for men who were not afraid to call sin, sin. Yes He loves the sinner but He hates the sin. All He wants is for the sinner to repent. We are all sinners and fall short. Once someone starts compromising with what God says is sin, then you’re of the devil, period. That’s basically the same thing that he has done to Eve when he told her that she will not die when God clearly told them they will. There is nothing complex regarding homosexuality for it is a sin before God.

  • ladybug

    Read your history. Homosexuality is a sign of the last stages of a decaying society such as the fall of Rome.

  • Olatunji Mwamba

    I wonder what Bible T.D. Snakes, oops, I means Jakes is reading from? I guess he’s never read Genesis 19:1-29, Leviticus 18:22-24, Leviticus 20:13, Romans 1:27 & 32, 1st Corinthians 6:9, 1st John 3:4, and Matthew 5:17-20?

  • http://mczwzthinks.blogspot.com/ MCzwz

    Sad that this “evolving” does not include following the Word of God. I hope this gentleman realizes what it means to sell one’s soul the Devil, but hey — if he of all people does not know that, he deserves the “reward” he will eventually receive for his duplicity.

    Very sad.

  • Renee Solis

    He is a false teacher, and he calls the bldg that he preaches in “his house,” that in itself is blasphemy, it is “Gods house”

  • FedUp

    Repost of Jakes statement on this article

    Late last night, Jakes issued a statement on Facebook, which is reprinted below in its entirety.

    My comment on HuffPo TV drifted into issues of the Supreme Court ruling and changing the world through public policy verses personal witness. Further, I have come to respect that I can’t force my beliefs on others by controlling public policy for taxpayers and other U.S. citizens.

    Jesus never sought to change the world through public policy but rather through personal transformation. All people didn’t embrace Him either. That’s what I said and what I meant … Nothing more and nothing less.

    Just because a so-called Christian publication chooses to misconstrue my words using lazy journalistic tactics to further their own agenda and draw attention to their site does not make their statements an accurate depiction of what I said or meant.

    Investigate.

    Do not take everything you read online or hear repeated as truth. When asked about the “black church” and its role in ministering to gay people, I briefly mentioned (we were running out of time) the word “evolved and evolving” regarding my approach over the 39 years of my ministry to gay people who choose to come to our services.

    I simply meant that my method is evolving—not my message. I was shocked to read that this was manipulated in a subsequent article to say I endorsed same-sex marriage! My position on the subject has been steadfast and rooted in Scripture.

    For the record, I do not endorse same-sex marriage, but I respect the rights that this country affords those that disagree with me.

    Michael Brown, though, still wants Jakes to offer more clarification. What’s your take? Are you relieved? Does Jakes need to be clearer or is it now crystal to you where he stands?

  • Michael Falsia

    Here is a man sitting in the lap of Antichrist! Do we need any further proof that this man is a false prophet. When you can do an interview with the enemy of truth and righteousness and have it go smoothly with no virulent resistance you know your Christianity is not worth anything and the Holy Spirit is non existent. This only confirms what anyone with any discernment already knew about TD Jakes!

  • Jay Nation

    Jesus is love and accepts us all as we are. We are like filthy rags in his sight — no matter how good we do. It’s refreshing to hear a Bishop remind us all that the church should be called the house of prayer for all people, regardless of the blemishes or challenges that we face. Too often, non Christian are turned away from our God because we are judgmental and refuse to acknowledge that we too sin just like those who we choose to refer to as sinners. I’ve learned that I have to run to the same fountain of grace as my next brother or sister that might be gay, homosexual, lesbian, confused, transgendered or other.

  • Eric Lee

    Bishop said his position is evolving. God’s position isn’t! There is no salvation in man! You will know the tree by the fruit it produces. Be careful Bishop when your views are in conflict with the Word.

  • Watchman on the Wall

    I have lost ALL respect for the man. He has sold he soul to the god of this world. I pray that he comes to his senses before its too late.

  • Christian Patriot

    We were never a Christian nation in the truist sense, rather we have been a nation of predominately Christian people, with a system of laws loosley based in biblical and natural laws.
    To be a Christian nation, we would have to be a theocracy, not a republic. And there was never any clause calling for a separation of church & state.
    But, TD is out in sodom’s left field with his “evolving” stance on matters of moralityand sin.