Nicaraguan Minister Sentenced to 30 Years in Prison Over Woman’s Death From Fiery Exorcism

MANAGUA — A young Nicaraguan minister and four of his members have been sentenced to 30 years in prison after a woman died following an exorcism attempt that resulted in burns on more than 80 percent of her body.

“The suffering that Trujillo was subjected to is something no human being should go through,” said Judge Alfredo Silva Chamorro on Tuesday.

As previously reported, Juan Gregorio Rocha Romero, 23, claims that Vilma Trujillo Garcia, 25, threw herself in the fire during the February exorcism, but the woman’s husband asserts that it was Romero and others who stripped her naked and rolled her over into the flames.

“God told her He was going to remove that bad spirit from her, and asked us to start a fire because that’s where the spirit was going to be expelled,” Romero told reporters. “We were praying when we looked at her and saw she was on fire.”

Eneyda del Socorro Orozco Tellez, who was a part of the exorcism, made similar remarks.

“[God] told me to make a bonfire in the church patio, and said we should take Vilma and tie [her] up next to the flames and pray so that the devil left her sick body and threw itself on the fire,” he said.

However, Franklin Jarquin Hernandez contended that instead of the demon expelling itself into the fire, the evil spirit rather pushed Garcia into the blaze.

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“She had her life companion and committed an error with another man, and she was claiming to be a Christian and fasting, and I’m sure God punished her in that way and she became possessed by the devil,” he told the outlet La Prensa. “It was a bad spirit that pushed her and she fell on the fire.”

According to the Associated Press, some members had also thought that Garcia was possessed as she had allegedly attempted to attack people with a machete. But her husband says that there was no demon and instead “what they did to her was witchcraft.” He also believes his wife had not committed adultery but was rather raped.

“I went to confront the man I was told was responsible, but had to leave him alone because he was carrying a rifle,” he said.

Members of Romero’s congregation reportedly kept Garcia in the church building for over a week in seeking to cast demons out of her. Then, they said God told them to build a fire and the evil spirit would throw itself into it.

Garcia’s sister found her burned body in a ravine following the incident, and while she was taken to the hospital for medical care, she died days later.

Last Tuesday, Romero and three members—which include two of his brothers—were found guilty of murder by a five-member jury. Three of the men were also declared culpable of illegal detention, but as the maximum sentence is 30 years, additional time could not be added for the crime.

Garcia’s family members claimed during the trial that the woman had been beaten and deprived of food and water during the week-long ordeal.


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  • BuckeyePhysicist

    For a proper exorcism please call a Catholic priest. Spiritual warfare should not be left to amateurs.

    • Coach

      Catholic priest serve a false christ. The just live by faith in the only Mediator between God and man, the Man Christ Jesus.

      • BuckeyePhysicist

        That’s mean, not to mention wildly inaccurate.

        • Coach

          Anyone who trusts in their works, offers prayers to Mary, submits to the pope as the head of the church, and submits to a religion that anathemarizes real Christians is worshiping a false messiah.

          1 Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, 11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust.

          • BuckeyePhysicist

            You’re getting bad information, Coach! The Catholic Church isn’t works-based: We’re grace based! No one prays to the Blessed Mother: She prays for us.

          • Coach

            I’m sorry, where does it say in the Bible that Mary prays for you? Please explain how your grace works.

          • BuckeyePhysicist

            Firstly, we all agree on 1 Timothy 2:5 where Jesus is the only mediator? I hope so…

            …and we need to define mediation. Mediation is a TWO way function which only Jesus can do. The Father answers prayer through His Son. When you pray, I pray, or any saint around God’s Throne prays, we call this intercession. Intercession is a ONE way function.

            Only God can answer prayer through Jesus’ mediation but intercession can be done by anyone. The saints cannot answer prayer but they can pray. For Bible references, read Psalm 103, Psalm 148, Isaiah 6:3, Matthew 18:10, James 5:16, Revelation 4:1-8, and Revelation 8:3-4.

            Grace means salvation is 100% on Jesus and 0% on us. Faith and works are external evidence of Christ’s grace working within us.

            Please forgive my delayed response; I am an actual physicist and I was in the lab most of the day where personal ADP devices are not permitted.

          • Coach

            I disagree with intercession being one way in the fact that the Holy Spirit is needed to pray to God. As

          • Robert

            they say the rosery using its beads its easy to google.

          • BuckeyePhysicist

            I say the Rosary a lot myself.

    • Sharon_at_home

      Really? Catholics do exorcisms? Sorry, I had never heard of that.

      • BuckeyePhysicist

        You’re serious?

      • TheLastHonestLawyer

        You have to be kidding.

        • Sharon_at_home

          No I’m not. I’ve never been interested in exorcisms and had never heard anyone mention it. Also Catholic was like a bad word in our house for years because of the schools / churches my husband went to as a child. Unless I asked him a direct question, I would never hear it from him. So no, I truly didn’t know.
          BTW I try hard to never lie, so you can take my posts that way. 😀

          • Laurence Charles Ringo

            Really,Sharon? You’ve never seen the movie “The Exorcist”? How old are you?

    • Robert

      The ones that are successful follow the bibles instructions on exorcism . including faith in Christ alone and not some faith in their own works and some faith in Christ works. . no its complete faith in Christ alone.

      • BuckeyePhysicist

        Robert? Faith is good — but faith alone is a Luther invention.

  • kenster777

    No need for a Priest, Jesus has given all true believers the power and Authority over satan in his name.
    We have a High Priest in Christ Jesus Hebrews 9:11.

    • Robert

      Hebrews 9:11 screams don’t believe that just some ” special superior and super Christians ” have a in with God with whom he talks to… No do not believe that or your ripe fodder for another Jones town. !! we now have. All. The bible. There is no reason for God to do that now that we have all the bible ! But there is plenty of reasons you being one of them for Satan to pretend he is a angel of light. Just because he fools some preacher into thinking god is talking to them
      does not mean you have to be fooled to.

      • kenster777

        No a person who is of a humble and contrite spirit does God Hear Isaiah 66:2
        Nothing special or superior, just those that have have faith as a grain of mustard seed,
        Read Mark 16:15-18, the word also says God has set Apostles, Prophets, Teachers, in the Church for the perfecting of the saints. I Corinthians 12:28.
        Stop believing we don’t need the Holy Spirit and Faith today, because we need it as much today as they did then.
        Try the Spirits to see if they are from God.
        If it lines up to the word then you better take heed.

  • TheLastHonestLawyer

    It is 2017, and people are still dying because of a belief in evil spirits. Sickening.

    • Coach

      No, this woman died because her murderers were doing the work of Satan under a false guise of Christianity.
      These people weren’t Christians, true Christians know God speaks through His Word by the power of the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of God never contradicts the Word of God.

      • TheLastHonestLawyer

        Go look up the No True Scotsman fallacy.

        From the story:

        “[God] told me to make a bonfire in the church patio, and said we should take Vilma and tie [her] up next to the flames and pray so that the devil left her sick body and threw itself on the fire,” he said.

        Seems to me these people were listening to the Word of God, or so they claim. Why do you doubt them?

        • Coach

          Because anyone can claim God told them something, Muhammad(islam founder)Joseph Smith(mormonism founder, Sarah Young (author of Jesus Calling), and many others make the same claim. Those born of the Spirit of God follow His Word as revealed in the Bible.

          What they were doing is the same ideology as shaking a magic 8 ball, only worse, they used it as an excuse to murder this woman.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            OK, you almost have it . . . if Muhammad, Joseph Smith, et al, can all claim that God is telling them something, why couldn’t the authors of the New Testament do the exact same thing.

            What is your hard evidence that Muhammad was lying and Paul wasn’t.

          • Coach

            Explain to me hard evidence. What exactly are you asking for?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Testable, repeatable experiments with a clear methodology that show the existence of spirits. Experiments that can be reproduced anywhere in the world and show similar results. Results that can be subject to review by scientists who can examine the methods and results independently.

          • MCrow

            Alternatively, testable, repeatable evidence that the claims of the Bible are accurate. Be specific: no “it happens all the time!” It must be specific instances not explainable otherwise.

          • Sharon_at_home

            How about the people who receive the Holy Spirit in Apostolic or Baptist Churches. The speak languages unknown to the person when they are ‘in the spirit’. You can see it happening in UTube videos sometimes… I expect.
            Just curious about your view.

          • MCrow

            Speaking in tongues is testable, but I’ve yet to see someone actually test it. It would be simple: have people write or communicate to an impartial third party what they said or heard to verify. I’ve not seen anyone do so.

            The repeatable part is another aspect that is possible, but I don’t see happen. Usually a response of “do not put God to the test.” Ok, fair enough, but think for a moment how little sense that makes. You could bear witness to huge masses! You could reinforce the beliefs of those who doubt! Instead, we get the same answers as charletans and psychics.

            YouTube isn’t exactly reliable. Even 10 years ago, video editing was available. It could be staged. There’s no ability to question. Which, really, is my view: if something can’t deal with questioning and doubt, it’s probably not the truth

          • Sharon_at_home

            Then go to the churches yourself. I have seen people speak in tongue and afterwards they are quite different – calmer, more knowledgeable things like that. It even changed teenagers attitudes from one day getting the Holy Spirit to the next. they always obeyed their parents: they go immediately to their rooms after school to do their homework, they offer to do chores . That’s something working inside these people + I believe it is the Holy Spirit.
            I know for a fact that our church has never ‘staged’ something that happens naturally because it’s from God /is God. There are lots of people in my church that have it, and lots that don’t. I would think that is usually how Apostolic Churches are. I’m still learning God’s Word, but I am praying for it myself. I know that when God says it’s time, He will gift me with the Holy Spirit too. I’ve seen it happen, these are people I trust, and I believe in getting the Holy Spirit.
            I expect others have the same thing going on, although my Pastor has been going through the area helping other Churches with their ideas. If you go to a couple of services, if it doesn’t happen at the first one to someone in the church – whether they are getting the Holy Spirit, or already have it they move and talk what the spirit wants them to say. That part is actually amazing. You can tell they aren’t speaking for themselves.

          • MCrow

            Why do you assume I have not? I was raised Christian. I visited many apostolic and charismatic churches. I noticed when I became skeptical of speaking in tongues, any warmth in the room faded. It got rebounded on me as me not having enough faith. The sad thing is, I was an earnest believer, but I was always told I wasn’t good enough to be part of the community.

            As to the rest, I don’t doubt that children change. Children do that. As a teacher, I see many students go from obnoxious brats to earnest young adults. That doesn’t require God, just good child rearing. I also can’t help but notice you haven’t experienced this yourself, but you’re sure people are being truthful. I’m sure there is no shortage of people who believe, and some may even be sincere. But con men regularly get people to hand over their property through well placed lies and acting. People believe in them. I’m not saying your church is, I’m just pointing out that its not reliable

          • Sharon_at_home

            I’ve got some personal experience with it, I just haven’t received it yet, but I have felt the Holy Spirit touch me and I saw the way my body reacted to His touch. You do not know what you are talking about.
            I mentioned them because it didn’t sound like you had thought of the Apostolic Church.
            I can’t imagine a man that I respect and (so do a lot of others) as much as I respect my Pastor (who was a friend first) could look straight into my eyes and lie? I know what to look for when people lie for one thing, and for another, I believe in the Holy Spirit, and if you don’t well, that’s up to you.
            You are such a cynic! I doubt you’d believe me if i told you I did have it!
            I’ve known the people of the church for 8 years and my Pastor as a friend for at least 2 years before that. I think if they were lying I’d have worked it out by now, as would my husband.
            I’m on disability and my Pastor told me I didn’t have to pay tithes because God knows my situation. Does that sound like a greedy con man?
            Why can’t you just take my word for it? because you are set against it.
            I pray sir that the Lord God my Father will help you see what you are blind to and realize how much different your life would be. God Bless!

          • MCrow

            With regard to me not knowing, youre right. I don’t know what that feels like. If it grants you comfort, so be it, but telling me you had a feeling about something isn’t evidence.

            I take the title of cynic as something of a complement. It is something others value me for since I point out potential problems.

            With regard to church leaders, if I’m overly cynical, it’s because church leaders have taught me to be. My pastor in my church as a teenager cheated on his wife with a student. He left his wife and two sons. Later, a pastor I knew kicked his teenage son out of his house because he was gay. Still others I know were narcissists who cared more about their status than their flock.

            I accept that you believe the things you say. You’ll note I specifically said that your church isn’t necessarily filled with con artists, I was using it as an example of how people can fool themselves into thinking something is true when it isn’t. I am open to changing my mind if you have evidence, but again, testable and repeatable is important to me

          • kenster777

            Just to interject here To receive the Holy Spirit you must Look to what Jesus says in Luke 11:9-14.
            Ask and it shall be given you seek and you shall find, how much more shall the heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him.
            It takes Faith and I believe the desire to get on the cross Matthew 16:34.
            Jesus told his disciples to wait and tarry to they have been endued from on high.
            I usually don’t usually recommend to many books but Smith Wigglesworth book on the Holy Spirit is good edifying reading.

          • Sharon_at_home

            Yes that’s what we believe as well. It is belief of Jesus and of His Salvation. That The Son of God exists, and He is our way to being redeemed from our sins because He died on the cross to pay a ransom for our sins so we could be reconciled with God. I also believe that you can ask for anything and it will be given IF you believe it will be, and the Holy Spirit is worked by the same principle.

            Thanks for the book suggestion. I’ve written it down to see if I can get it to read. I appreciate it! God bless!

          • kenster777

            Most christian book stores will have it.
            But as with anything always make sure everything lines up with the word.
            Continue in the Faith in these last days.

          • Robert

            St Paul the only thing he cared about knowing was that Jesus was crucified for him. He majored in the major thing your church majors in minors. So its more than doubtful the Holy Spirit would go along with such majoring in such minor unimportant things. When the deciples also said that Most verse But we preach Christ crucified a stumbling block to the Jews. Mean while your church preach’s tongues and healings and they can’t prove either is true of their works.And Paul warned us in scriptiures about church’s !ike yours in the verses proceeding the love chapter.

          • Sharon_at_home

            Your attitude is very arrogant, and we were told that that is a sin.

            You obviously think that Jesus came only to die for our sins, and not to spread his Love. HE is the one to say to love everyone. HE is the one that said to treat others the way you want to be treated. HE is the one that said Love covers a multitude of sin.

            I’m sorry but just because you don’t agree with our methods does not make you our Lord. Jesus does not think everyone is going to need the same method of salvation. He knows each one of us inside and out. Not everyone – heck I don’t believe anyone – would turn to Jesus because someone hatefully said that they were going to hell for their sins. People do not want to be treated with hate, and Jesus knows that.

            Did you ever even consider that God is the one that directed our Church to be the way it is? He does that you know. He knows what is going on in this world and that there is already too much hate. Why wouldn’t he give us the ability to show His love instead?

            Just because you don’t believe we have people speaking in Tongues doesn’t mean it isn’t true. I did not mention healing at all, because it has not been done in our church. I personally have experienced healing by God and I know others who have too, including someone with Lung Cancer that disappeared after less than a year. Are you saying God does not heal people who are his children? You are so wrong, and I feel badly that you don’t believe in the Lord strongly enough to believe in that.

            “So its more than doubtful the Holy Spirit would go along with such majoring in such minor unimportant things.” So now you make decisions for God? Jesus was all about love and that is what we base it on. So you are saying Jesus did not talk about Love more than anything else. That his commandments don’t exist maybe because they are about love and treating others well. Yes he wants repentance, but he also knows that when they learn about Salvation and His love, that they will want to repent and He wants us to be willing to turn to him.

            “Mean while your church preach’s tongues and healings and they can’t prove either is true of their works.” Our church does not preach “tongues and healings” They preach God’s Word. They preach about repentance. They preach about how Jesus loved us all, and only want the best for us and that the offer of Salvation was about His love for us. Because that is what it is about. He loves us and He wants us to be the people He wanted His creation to be. He wants to us to want Salvation so much that we will repent by their own free will. Everything about Salvation is from his love, including the repentance of sin.

            I think your church is wrong to focus ONLY on the sins, and not about the fact that Jesus wants us to love each other and be good to each other. Jesus talked about His love for us way more than about how he ‘hates’ sin. Any time He spoke to the multitudes, did he speak about their sins, no he spoke of them about the way to behave with love. He wants us to repent but he knows that we have free will (because He gave it to us) and that we need to want to repent or it won’t be done in honesty.

            If you don’t spread the message of Love that Jesus wanted us to spread, then your church is not following Jesus’s directions at all.

            I don’t think the Lord wanted us to be condemning of the religions that are different than yours either. We as Christians are supposed to be together working to have all come to repentance and to Salvation. Not criticize a church that does follow Jesus’ ways, because yours doesn’t .

            You have your beliefs, and that’s fine with me even though I don’t agree with them. My church believes if it isn’t in the bible it is not truth. We Only go by what is in the scripture. So therefore we are doing God’s will and you are saying things against how the Lord told us how to be in the Gospel …. in the scriptures.

            I’d appreciate Chapter book and verse(s) to understand your “major” and “minor” since you never explained why you are teaching the Major while mine is teaching the minor. It would show you know what you are meaning so I could really answer your post. Saying “major” and “minor’ does not give any information at all without the scriptures to back it up.

            I’d also like you to point out where it says Jesus told us to show hate to people in any way. Telling people, the way a lot of Christians do, is not showing love but hate for the sin, it is showing hate of the person for their sin. The method needs to be changed if you want to show love to people and hate for their sin, because it does not sound like love to threaten them with Hell for their sin. That’s not about the sin, it’s about telling people they are the worse kind of person because of their sin. You don’t focus just on the sin, you focus on how the people are going to hell. That says nothing about love. Nothing. You have to tell people you love them and then tell them that Jesus wants them to repent for their sins and offer them salvation, not show them hate and expect them to ‘believe’ that it is done with love. People are not stupid and wont’ see the love if your behaviour does not show it.

            So please give me the scriptures that you mentioned in your post. I’d like to review them and if necessary talk to my Pastor about them for more understanding. Besides, using the words you have gives no indication about what you are really talking about. What is it that you feel is Major, while speaking and reflecting who Jesus was while he was on earth, is minor.

            And by the way, you shouldn’t criticize any Church that does God’s will, not matter how you yourself views it. You don’t know what God decided about our Church, but I guarantee that He wouldn’t want us to change the way we teach about Jesus’ love. Whether you agree or not, we prefer to listen to God, not to man.

            Thank you + have a nice day.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            They are babbling. Nonsense syllables that they later claim to be Aramaic or Hebrew.

          • Sharon_at_home

            No one in our church tries to decipher the words that I know of. Look, I know you don’t believe, but this is something I see a lot on Sundays. I can guarantee it isn’t set up. It can’t be because of the way it happens.
            What they are doing is – with the Holy Spirit’s help – they are talking to God. The words are not necessarily easy to hear unless you are close to their face. They usually fall to the ground when it’s moving in them for the first time. I’ve heard of a rabbi who was visiting a Apostolic Church and was stunned when he heard someone say something in Hebrew, and asked about it to the Pastor. No one in the Church spoke Hebrew. Those who speak in tongue don’t know themselves what they said.
            Obviously a non-believer won’t believe this either, and you won’t take videos for proof, so you flat out won’t ever believe what I believe. That’s fine, I don’t care if you believe it or not because it makes no difference to my belief. I have had experiences you obviously have not. Just like I know Jesus exists even today. Why would I lie about that, when I’ve lived without lying throughout my life? I wouldn’t. I don’t like lies. It is how I’ve always been. I think it’s because I was the youngest of 5 and I was blamed on many things because they lied. It also taught me to look at both sides of a situation. God bless!

          • Coach

            The graveyard is plenty proof, you know that it’s impossible for you to dig up the graves in a graveyard and bring those people back to life because their spirits have left there bodies, but put a new engine in a car that’s been dead for a hundred years and its cruising down the highway.
            So you worship the scientific method and you submit yourself to scientists because they are all knowing? Name one thing that you know to be absolutely true.

            You are saying you refuse to believe God because He has not submitted Himself to you, when you’re the one who needs to submit to Him, you’re the one who’s nature is corrupt and if whom every intent is only wickedness continually. Jesus Christ is Lord of all, through Him the world was made and all that is in it, by Him is everything sustained, salvation is through Him and apart from repentance of your rebellion against God, and believing in Jesus Christ, the only thing left for you is God’s holy hatred and eternal wrath poured out for all eternity.

            There will be no laughing on judgement day, no patting yourself on the back for skills in defending your rejection of God. God is love, but God’s love is holy, He hates all that isn’t conformed to His goodness, you harden your heart to the gospel and there’s no hope for you, younicest deeds can’t save you, even they are tainted by your sinful heart, you need regeneration, for God in His mercy to open your eyes, I could give you all the proof in the world, but it wouldn’t make you worship God, your problem isn’t that you lack proof, it’s that you love sin and want every excuse not to part with it.

            You’re like a man digging himself into a hole, digging deeper in a search to prove he’s not in a hole, dig on, but I’ve been pulled out of that hole by the mercy of Jesus Christ when my hands were too weak to climb out.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            1. Cars are machines. Not living organisms. False analogy.

            2. One thing? I am currently sitting 14 miles from the Loma Prieta fault line.

            3. I do not worship science. I accept science as the best method to explain the world around us. No one says scientists are all knowing, least of all scientists. Every answer found opens up more questions.

            4. No, I don’t believe in any gods because there is no evidence to support their existence.

            5. My relatives would say “There is no God but God, and Mohammad is His Prophet.” Can you prove that you are right and that they are wrong? What happens when a Hindu and a Zoroastrian join the argument?

            6. Ah, the old “I have all this proof, but I’m not going to bother.” deflection.

          • Coach

            You reject proof that God exists, where does truth come from?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Define truth.

          • Coach

            What you obviously reject

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Do you ever tire of personal attacks?

          • Coach

            Truth is that which is absolutely certain. For instance, it is absolutely wrong to commit rape.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            OK, so how do you react to the Biblical laws on rape? Or the commands God gave the Israelites to massacre their neighbors while taking the young women as prizes?

            Talk to the Soviet soldiers who took Berlin in 1945, and they’d tell you that raping German women was a just retribution for the horrors inflicted on the USSR by German troops.

    • Sisyphus

      She was burned, and wood burns; witches are made of wood. The minister should have seen if she floats first, because wood floats.

      • Bezukhov

        Did they check to see if she weighed the same as a duck?

        • Sisyphus

          She turned me into a newt.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Well, I didn’t expect a Spanish Inquisition!

          • Sisyphus

            Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.

          • Sharon_at_home

            A newt, you say?

    • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

      You mean like in Muslim exorcisms? Happens all the time.

      • TheLastHonestLawyer

        Yes, which is why I said “It is 2017, and people are still dying because of a belief in evil spirits. Sickening.”

        People, with no specific religion mentioned, because all of them have factions thaqt blame evil spirits for things like mental illness.

        But hey, keep being blinded by your hatred of Islam, and ignore the story about Christians killing a young woman in favor of bashing strawmen.

        • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

          There really are people who can cast out evil spirits, but the Bible distinguishes between that and lunacy (mental illness). This guy clearly was deceived because he didn’t follow anything out of the Bible on the topic nor did he have discernment or the power of God.

          I will continue to call out any and all false religions and anything that causes death, whether it be Islam or whether it be fake exorcisms.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Except, of course, for the complete lack of evidence for the existence of spirits, evil of otherwise.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Everything has a spirit. How can you not know that you have one?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Remember that I’m a stroke survivor. When a blood clot lodged in my left parietal lobe a couple of years ago, it did a great deal of physical damage to my brain.

            Which changed me. My short-term memory, for example, is shot. My monitor is covered with post-its reminding me of daily tasks, and I have multiple alarms set on my phone to remind me to take medications, eat, even telling me when to expect my wife and kids to come home, because I can’t remember their schedules.

            I’m also no longer allowed to deal with financial matters as my understanding of money is gone. I ask permission for any purchase, no matter how small, because I don’t grasp the basic concepts of savings and spending.

            My personality was also affected. I’m a bit quicker to anger these days. I developed a strong dislike of being touched. All because of physical damage to my brain.

            There is no independent spirit, just the software running on our brains. It’s well known that physical changes to the brain through damage or chemical imbalances can cause drastic changes in behavior. Look up Phineas Gage for one of the earliest documented cases of physical damage causing a complete change in personality.

            If there was some independent spirit, how could changing the brain affect it?

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Your personality isn’t your spirit. As you’ve mentioned, personalities can be affected by all sorts of things.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            OK, show me peer-reviewed evidence for the existence of spirits.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            What do you think a spirit is?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Depends on the usage. Spirit can refer to positive morale, high energy, and the like.

            In the context of the story we’re commenting on, it refers to invisible, intangible beings that exist only in people’s minds as an excuse for their failings.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Well, no, you’ve tried to define something by using your own bias, which isn’t a definition. It’s propaganda. I’m not talking about ghosts or anything. I’m talking about the spirit of each individual. Everyone has a spirit. Even animals have spirits. The Bible says, “Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?”

            You’re comprised of three components – body, soul, and spirit.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            OK, define your terms, then provide evidence – testable evidence – for the existence of a spirit and a soul.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Don’t you know that you have a soul and spirit?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Given that years of intensive medical treatment and no medical professional has even mentioned either, no. Do you understand what atheism means? We reject such concepts as mythology, since no one can show any evidence of such things actually existing.

            Let me ask you something… let’s say a loved one of yours has become ill. They are showing flu-like symptoms. Suddenly, this person gets much worse. Their fever spikes to above 104F, they are shaking uncontrollably, and unable to control their bladder or bowels.

            Do you:

            a) Yell at the evil spirts to get out of your loved one?

            b) Call 911 so an ambulance can get your loved one into the ER.

            Answer honestly.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Do you realize how many people die from medical error? Medicine doesn’t know everything. However, there have been neurological studies that suggest there is more to human beings than the physical function.

            Regarding the fever incident you cited, that’s clearly a febrile seizure and has to be treated medically. However, there are other incidents that are clearly spiritual manifestations and have to be treated as such. One needs spiritual discernment and wisdom.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            OK, define a “clearly spiritual manifestation.”

            Yeah, doctors make mistakes. But like any scientific endeavor, it’s equal; parts hard science and art form. I’m alive because medical science has advanced to the point where treating serious strokes is everyday work.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Have you ever talked to cops about trying to take down someone who’s not very large, not very strong, yet who is abnormally able to fight off an entire pack of cops and not touched by tasing, pepper spray, and sometimes even bullets?

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            It’s called adrenaline. Or PCP. I dealt personally with clients who, while under the influence of drugs, wrecked their bodies while resisting arrest.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Adrenaline doesn’t make you speak in different voices and languages.

          • TheLastHonestLawyer

            Actually, adrenaline can alter your speech. I’ve had it happen to me.

            Physical damage to the brain can alter your speech, even to the point of causing you to switch primary languages. It’s rare, but it happens.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Adrenaline can’t give a man a woman’s voice and a woman a man’s voice. Adrenaline can’t make you suddenly start speaking in another language that you’ve never studied before. That’s demon possession and there’s only one way to get rid of it, and that’s by the power of Jesus Christ. A Christian may have to fast and pray first, but only Christians can do it.

    • Denny

      No more delusional than men who claim they are women and insist on being treated as such.

      • TheLastHonestLawyer

        OK, a slight difference here. Allowing transgender people to live as the wish does not harm you, not deprive you of any rights.

        Killing someone because others believe they are possessed is murder.

  • Peter Leh

    I have read fellow christians state they would kill another person if “god told them to” just as they did in the bible.

    I think we can all condemn this man and those like him.

  • Trilemma

    A deadly trinity: ignorance, fear and religion.

  • michael louwe

    From NYPost; …….
    “Vilma Trujillo, 25, was abducted by Pastor Juan Gregorio Rocha Romero
    and four members of the Church of the Assembly of God in the
    northeastern village of El Cortezal, La Prensa newspaper said Wednesday.”

    Please avoid AOG(Pentecostal/Charismatic) Churches.

    • BuckeyePhysicist

      …and pray for them too. They need conversion.

    • Sharon_at_home

      I think it was this one church and not all in the same religion.
      Are Pentecostal/Charismatic Churches the huge churches that push the money more than they do God? If you mean that kind of Church I agree, stay away.

  • Trilemma

    Sounds like these people were practicing first century Christianity. How many successful exorcisms has this man performed or was this his first? Even the apostles failed at an exorcism.

  • Chet

    A horrible tragedy that did not have to occur…

  • J. Ernst

    There are pagan AND cristian (deliberate misspelling) idolator’s …. always has been….always will be.

    It’s called; ANIMAL MAGNETISM!!!
    These Central ameriKan (deliberate misspelling) peoples have SEVERAL millennia of recorded history of sacrificial angst and practices … katholik’s especially, believe in the “war” of satan and God….a TRUE fraud if there ever was one. “satan” is either a grain of sand or the ENTIRE beach depending upon OUR perception and BELIEF!!!

    We, the People, should expect and have witnessed these peoples, in OUR country, practicing their IGNORANCE at the behest of their IDEALS, to continue their “cultural behaviors” because their comfort zone is a hell in itself

    Thanks to the vatiKan and ALL of the fake and grant supported religions, WE are now inundated with these spiritually vacant peoples….all under the guise of friendship and love…. that they “should be granted a better existence” MELDING INTO OUR society.
    DEPORTATION is the only answer for these LUNATIC masses. And for “nations” that allow these peoples of animal propensities to thrive…let these cristian’s stay where they are and let THEIR “law enforcement” people deal with it..
    And Barry o-fck-wit-ohomo should be given citizenship to these Central ameriKan “nations”.

  • Dianne

    This is sadly what happens when people DO NOT use the proper teaching of scripture to bring about healing and deliverance. My prayers for her family as they mourn the loss of their loved one. I also hope that contrition will come from the perpetrators.

  • Robert

    They’re is a bible
    Verse against private interpetations. When the preacher says Go

    • kenster777

      If a Church is a Bible Believing and believes God’s word as it is written. I would recommend following it, The word says the truth will set you free if there not following after truth there not following God.
      But if they start handling snakes, and tell you to drink koolaide I would not recommend them.

  • Robert

    Every Christian has had a exorcism of Satan performed on them by Jesus. Exorcisms are not new to the christian church. Christian baptism is really a exorcism where Christ claims you for him self and kicks Satan out.