Merkel Votes Against Same-Sex ‘Marriage’ in Germany ‘Because Marriage is Between a Man and Woman’

(The Independent) — Angela Merkel has voted against same-sex marriage in Germany because she believes that “marriage is between a man and woman.”

Despite her opposition, the Bundestag voted to legalize equal marriage by 393 votes to 226, and the chancellor said she hoped the move would improve social cohesion.

“For me, marriage in German law is marriage between a man and a woman, and that is why I did not vote in favor of this bill today,” she told reporters moments after the historic vote.

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  • Reason2012

    the Bundestag voted to legalize equal marriage by 393 votes to 226

    Marriage was already “equal” – every single person already had the same right to marry a person of the opposite gender. Activists don’t want that right and push the lie that they were denied “equal rights” when instead it’s about the government forcing a special right, redefining the religious institution of marriage, passing laws to push this new State Religion on their citizens, and then use that law to then force feed homosexual behavior on everyone else’s kids and grandkids against the will of parents.

    • John Connor

      This has absolutely nothing to do with Islam or Christianity. You seem to be pushing a false narrative. This is about equality. Your comment marriage already being equal is off base. How much sense would it make for a gay person to marry someone they could never have those types of feelings for?

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        sad news is … not everything is equal ….. and life is unfair …… and mommies do not love all their children equally …… boo hoo ……….

        • John Connor

          No tears here troll.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            good ….. i see that you see reality ……… and again the troll throws out the troll charge ….. boo hoo ………

          • John Connor

            Call em as I see em

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            really …. you seem blind to me ……

    • james blue

      So in Sudan Mariam Yehya Ibrahim had equal rights, but was after “special rights” to be married to her Christian husband? I mean she had the same right to marry a Muslim man as every other woman….right?

      If gays can marry what “special right” do they get that you don’t have?

      • Reason2012

        Marriage is defined as one man and one woman. Sudan or Yehya do not have the right to marry someone of the opposite gender? Sure they do. You’re now speaking about those trying to restrict marriage between a man and a woman for other reasons. But no one has the right to marry someone of the opposite gender.

        Just like no one has the right as an 18 year old to marry their dad.

        Just like no one has the right to marry a 15 year old.

        But if an 18 year old who wanted to marry her dad started screaming “I want equal rights!”, it would be just as much of a farce.

        • james blue

          You didn’t answer the question.Did Mariam Yehya Ibrahim have equal rights, but was after “special rights” to be married to her Christian husband?

        • TheKingOfRhye

          “Just like no one has the right to marry a 15 year old.”

          But that’s actually not quite true. Just for the heck of it, I looked up minimum marriage age in the US. I didn’t realize it myself, but quite a few states allow 15 year olds to marry with either parental consent, and/or if they have a child or are pregnant. Some even have no minimum age.

          • Reason2012

            Wow go figure. In any event, even in the case of a person marrying someone of opposite gender, there are restrictions, and it’s not about “denying equal rights”.

            Not sure how they allow marriage at an age when you will also be arrested for having_sex with a minor of that same age in the same state.

        • John Connor

          Marriage is no longer defined as being between one man and one woman.

          • Reason2012

            Sure it is. Government has no authority to redefine what God defined, in effect creating a State Religion, then persecuting those who do not abandon their own religion on the matter and follow this new State Religion. They only offered contracts to deal with legal aspects of it after the fact.

          • John Connor

            Marriage doesn’t belong to your supernatural being. It has no religious prerequisites. There is no “state religion”. Good try though.

          • Sedagive

            If your god has a problem with the way the governments of the world are doing things, he can come down and let us know.

          • Reason2012

            He already let us know. He’ll remind us all when we face Him. Meanwhile those who claim to not believe in God typically tend to have the most hate towards Him and any who believe in Him, which shows their conscience knows the truth, and they’re spending hours a day to try silencing it.

          • Sedagive

            Can’t hate what we don’t believe exists.

        • Sedagive

          “marriage is defined as one man and one woman” – Actually, if you want to get technical, marriage is defined many different ways depending on where you are in the world.

    • TheKingOfRhye

      No one has a “special right” here. Sure, every person had the right to marry someone of the opposite sex. Now, every person has the right to marry someone of either sex. No one has any rights that anyone else doesn’t. Also, marriage is not strictly a religious institution. People can, and often do, get married without any church involvement whatsoever. If you want to get rid of that, that’s another issue, and well…that ship sailed a long time ago, really.

      And how on EARTH does same-sex marriage being legal “forcefeed homosexual behavior” on anyone??

      • Reason2012

        Sure, every person had the right to marry someone of the opposite sex.

        Thank you for unwittingly admitting they already had the same right. Yet the activists keep lying and claiming they want equal rights when really they want a new right – why is that?

        They want the government to redefine religious institutions and pass laws to establish this new State Religion, then persecute any who do not get on board with their support of this new State Religion instead of adhering to Christianity on the matter of marriage.

        • TheKingOfRhye

          “Thank you for unwittingly admitting they already had the same right”

          Only if you don’t count the right to marry someone that you would actually want to marry.

          As for the rest…how about responding to something I said instead of just repeating your rant? Civil marriage is not a “religious institution”. No “state religion” is being established. This is a SECULAR state, after all. That’s also why we don’t have to “adhere to Christianity” on marriage, or any other matter of law as well.

  • Charlene

    You go, girl!

    Isn’t this bizarre, that in 2017 stating something so obvious is considered a radical act? Too bad the last president and those 5 buffoons on the SCOTUS weren’t this sensible.

    • John Connor

      Equality for gays in marriage harms no one

      • Harry Oh!

        Spoken by a clueless wonder who has no concept of what principals and ethics guided western society to becoming the greatest place to live on earth.

        • John Connor

          Letting gay folks get married in no way harms society or our society. You’re just another individual who isn’t getting their way. Neither my marriage or my way of life has been affected in the least.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you lie to yourself … why should we believe you about this ………….

          • John Connor

            It’s my opinion. I don’t care if YOU believe me or not

        • zampogna

          How does homosexual marriage affect your life in any way?

        • zampogna

          Totally obnoxious answer.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        how is that koolaid going down BTW …..

        • John Connor

          So you’re unable to refute me…..

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you are not a christian …. you do not accept any refutation ….. you are just here to throw bombs …… you reject truth …. what would be the point ……… just keep drinking the koolaid ……..

          • John Connor

            Not throwing anything. Made a comment that you can’t refute

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            you do not accept the truth … what would be the point ……….

          • John Connor

            Funny that you think you’re the only one who knows the “truth”……

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            God is the only one with the truth ……… and it is written in scripture ….. is that a problem for you ………

          • John Connor

            No until it’s proven to be anything more than pure mythology

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            so your positive claim is “mythology” ….. what is your evidence …..

          • John Connor

            My evidence is that there is no evidence of its existence other than the bible

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            absence of evidence is not evidence of absence …… only that you are not looking in the right place …… or that you cannot see the evidence due to voluntary blindness ……… nice try …. fail …………

          • TheKingOfRhye

            “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence”

            True, but it isn’t proof of anything, either.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            it is especially not proof of a “mythology” ……….

          • TheKingOfRhye

            That’s kind of what I’m trying to say, actually. (though, I’m guessing you didn’t mean it that way) It’s not proof that Christianity, or any other religion, is more than mythology. That’s not a positive claim, either. Until I find evidence to believe in something, I’m not going to believe it, so why should I regard it as anything but mythology? The burden of proof is on the one making the claim, and that, in this situation, is you, no matter how many times you try to deny it.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            math and science both prove the existence of God …… as both were created by God ….. it is really that basic ……… what is 0 +0 ………. what is 0 times 1 quadrillion ………..

          • TheKingOfRhye

            That doesn’t make any sense. Math and science prove the existence of God, (the Christian God, too, right?), because they were created by God? No….that’s not proof, it’s just another claim. That would be like if I was trying to convince you that pink unicorns exist, for example. Would it make any sense for me to tell you “pink unicorns exist because they created rainbows”? No, you’d still want some sort of proof, some sort of evidence supporting my claim, before you stopped looking at me like I’d just escaped from a mental institution, or at least I hope you would.

            If that stuff about zero is supposed to be evidence, explain how it is.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            what is 0 +0 ………. what is 0 times 1 quadrillion ……….. what is 0/0 ….. what is 0 – 0 …………… answer please ………..

          • TheKingOfRhye

            0. PLEASE, tell me how that answer proves that God exists, or proves whatever you think it proves, anyway.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            very good ….. you get an A+ ….. you cannot get something from nothing …. or 0 ……….. no matter how much nothing you have … still nothing …. so where did you come from ……….. did you come from nothing ……

          • TheKingOfRhye

            Well, I guess if I went around claiming that I came from nothing, that just might be almost a valid point. Considering how I don’t do that, (and I’ve explained that multiple times now!) I don’t see how that proves anything. Even if I fully agree with what you’re saying, it doesn’t prove anything about what or who I came from. It certainly doesn’t prove that Christianity is correct. (and remember, that was what started this whole line of conversation, you trying to say that someone couldn’t disprove Christianity…and, apparently thinking that proves something)

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            good that you do not do that ….. so WHERE did you come from ……………

          • TheKingOfRhye

            I thought I’d explained my answer to that already. I guess I’ll give you the short version…

            I don’t know.

            It might seem odd to a theist, but I’m perfectly fine with leaving that question unanswered. Like I’ve said a million times before, I’m an agnostic atheist.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i am asking from the point of YOUR view ….. what is YOUR view about where you came from ….. and your answer is ¯_(ツ)_/¯ ………… seriously ………. ” I’m an agnostic atheist.” ….. yeah … contradiction in terms ……… what you are is intellectually dishonest …… you have an idea from where you came ……. you are just to cowardly to have to state it ……..

            put your big boy pants on and man up ……. where did you come from ……….

          • TheKingOfRhye

            Okay, you got me….I have to come out and admit it now.

            I have to confess….I truly believe we were created by the invisible, undetectable (and drunk at the time, which explains a lot) Flying Spaghetti Monster.

          • Bob Johnson

            Noodle that.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Millions Of Unbelievers Flock To Atheist Paradise Of North Korea
            July 4, 2017

          • TheKingOfRhye

            This is just as much for anyone else reading this as it a response to you. That’s from the “Babylon Bee”, which says (right on the first page, in fact!) that it is “your trusted source for Christian news satire”.

            Some of that’s actually kinda funny, like….

            “Trump Takes to Twitter To Viciously Attack White House Step He Stumbled Over”

            and my personal favorite….

            Report: Majority Of Christians Far More Concerned About Which Bathrooms Trans People Use Than Whether Or Not They Will Go To Heaven When They Die

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            yep ….. so what …………

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Trump Leads Aides On Wild Chase Through White House As They Attempt To Confiscate His Smartphone
            July 3, 2017

          • Bob Johnson

            Are millions of Christians flocking to Vatican City, home to more Christian theologians than any other country?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Vatican City is not a haven of christians ….. nor theologians …. it is a haven for RCC clergy only ….. and despite their pleas for open borders from every other country ….. THEIR walls remain thick and standing ………..

            VATICAN ROCKED BY REPORTS OF ‘GAY’ ORGY
            Police raid cardinal’s apartment, arrest occupants

            hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ………. not very christian nor even RCC …. a den on thieves ….

          • Sedagive

            Dude, you can’t divide anything by 0. It just doesn’t work.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You do realize that you’re debating something that Einstein claimed, right? So if you don’t like the argument, take it up with Einstein’s science, not Amos Moses.

          • TheKingOfRhye

            You’re saying Einstein said the Christian God created math and science, is that it? Give me a quote where he said that.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            About God. Neither Amos Moses nor Einstein specified “Christian God”. Einstein believed God made the universe and that He ordered everything mathematically and scientifically. Now Einstein was no theologian, but he did say those things.

          • TheKingOfRhye

            “Neither Amos Moses nor Einstein specified “Christian God”.

            You know darn well that’s what Amos meant. Anyway, though…OK, Einstein said those things? Then, like I asked before, give me a quote. I can give you some from Einstein myself if you want…

            “It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a
            lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a
            personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly.
            If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the
            unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our
            science can reveal it.”

            “”My position concerning God is that of an agnostic.
            I am convinced that a vivid consciousness of the primary importance of
            moral principles for the betterment and ennoblement of life does not
            need the idea of a law-giver, especially a law-giver who works on the
            basis of reward and punishment.”

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You got that from an atheist site which was put together to discredit anything about God. Look, if you’re going to quote mine, then quote all of it. Einstein believed in God. Einstein believed that math, science, art, literature, etc, all proved the existence of God. You can disagree with it, but that was Einstein’s view.

          • TheKingOfRhye

            Those were the full quotes as cited in the Wikipedia article on the “religious and philosophical views of Einstein.”. And I’ve read others before that indicate he was a pantheist at most. So, what he meant by “God” when he said things like “God does not play dice with the universe” was very different from what you mean by it.

            I’m still waiting for any quotes from him that would support what you said…

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Wiki isn’t reliable. Anyone can write anything on it, including you or me. Whoever posted that compilation of quotes you copied-and-pasted got it from an atheist site.

            You’ve just provided a good quote for Amos Moses’s argument. Thank you. 🙂 (And I’m sure he thanks you as well). Einstein said that in regards to mathematics and science, referring to the order of the universe and the fact that logic is behind it all. He believed in God. You can argue how Einstein viewed God, but you cannot dispute that he believed in God and in Intelligent Design.

            Here you go:

            “My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.”

            “I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the spectrum of this or that element. I want to know His thoughts; the rest are details.”

            “Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.”

            “The scientists’ religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.”

            “When the solution is simple, God is answering.”

            “God does not play dice with the universe.”

          • TheKingOfRhye

            “but you cannot dispute that he believed in God”

            Perhaps not, but by “God” he meant something very different than you would. Like I said before, he was really more or less a pantheist, which basically is the belief that God IS the universe. “Sexed-up atheism”, as Richard Dawkins called it.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Dude, Einstein said what Amos Moses said. That’s the gist of my post. You cannot dispute that no matter how hard you try.

          • TheKingOfRhye

            I’m not really disputing what he said, my point was that he meant something different than what you or Amos would mean when you say that, and I think that’s very relevant. It kind of relates to an idea I heard of a while ago, called ignosticism, and/or theological non-cognitivism. The point is, (though I’m probably way oversimplifying it here) what meaning does the word “God” even have, when you’re talking about two or more vastly different definitions of it? Sure, we are on a Christian site and all, and we’re generally going to be talking about the concept of God as presented in the Bible, but I bet even among Christians you’d find some different ideas of that….

            Oh, and Einstein believing in ID? Now THAT I can dispute. I really don’t see anything in the quotes you posted to support that.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            He and Amos Moses said the exact same thing.

          • Sedagive

            They do? Where’s the link to this study?

          • Lee Cumbie

            I’m not trying to rile you, honestly. But I do want to address a misconception you have. NOTHING can be proven,not even that you have a physical presence. Gravity – not proven. Sun – not proven. Scientists know this and that’s why we have axioms. Things that occur so regularly and without fail that we have FAITH they will continue to occur.
            My point is that everything you ‘know’ as ‘proven’ is based on faith based on either theory or empirical evidence and linked by logic. Thus, faith in God is based on the almost incomprehensible scientific improbability of the ordered nature yet tremendous variety of our universe. As Pascale elegantly pointed out, only a fool would bet against that likelihood and you don’t sound like a fool.

          • TheKingOfRhye

            Eh, you’re not getting me riled, people have said much more ‘rile-worthy’ things to me here. lol

            Maybe that’s right, we can’t prove anything, and after all, scientists don’t speak of theories, even the

          • TheKingOfRhye

            Accidentally cut myself off there somehow…..even the most well-supported theories aren’t spoken of as “proven”, though t.hey can be disproven. Also, I’m not really going around here saying I have proof food r this or that I have proof for that. I’m an atheist, but I don’t claim to know or to have proof that there is no god. I just don’t believe in any of them.

            “As Pascale elegantly pointed out…”

            Ugh, Pascal’s Wager? I hate that. For one thing, it doesn’t say anything about which god or version of god to believe or not believe in. So, really, Christians, or members of any other theistic religion, are “betting against” almost as many things (one less!) than atheists.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            well first you would have to explain how hedonism and debauchery is compatible with a stable society ………. then you would have to explain how that society does not affect your children as they grow up exposed to it …… then you would have to explain how you could do that to your children ………. and then explain how that child and all the other children are going to have a stable society in the face of that debauchery ………..

            and you cannot ……….. and so your position is a lie ……….

          • John Connor

            We have a stable society. Gays marrying haven’t affected my marriage or kids in the least. My kids are straight A students and respect people from all cultures. My kids have both gay and straight friends. It seems as though you’re the one pushing the lies.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and while that may be momentarily true ….. it does not answer even one of the questions ….. your unproven anecdotal observations are not evidence or answers ……….

          • John Connor

            No need to explain anything to them….they can make up their own minds. No indoctrination necessary

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            no … you need to explain a lot to prove it harms no one ……….. and the actions being taken ARE indoctrinating….. so the harm is not theoretical ….. it is real ……..

          • John Connor

            No indoctrination at all. They are old enough to make up their own minds. No harm at all. None. Show me where two people of the same sex being married has caused any harm.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            see …. denial ………

          • John Connor

            Nope

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            more denial …….. thnx for proving my point ……

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            but you have no proof ….. just your anecdotal assertions and claims ………..

          • Lady_Checkmate

            I used to be a hateful Christian like you, Amos, but I came around when I learned that there is a very good reason the rest of the world hates us so much. We need to confront our bigotry.

          • LadyInChrist♥BlessedBeTheLord

            The sad thing is that the Koolaid he drinks leads to death.

        • Helena Handbasket

          They like the lemon flavor.
          Guess why?

  • Grace Kwon

    The last normal generation. Humanism cannot get cured by normal means. The Germans need the Gospel of Jesus Christ to be saved and become moral.

    • Sedagive

      They had the gospel during World War II. How did that work out?

  • Jacob Burke Jr.

    This is probably the first thing I actually agree with Angela Merkel on.

  • InTheChurch

    Hitler would not be happy with his modern day Germany.
    A world leader with Biblical morals and standards, good for her.

    • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

      Uh no. She has no Biblical morals or standards. She did it to appease Islam.

      • John Connor

        Proof?

  • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

    Merkel only voted against same sex unions because that’s what Muslims do. She’s appeasing the Islamic crowd.

    • zampogna

      She is not appeasing the Islamic crowd.

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        They are the only ones she appeases.

        • zampogna

          For what reason would she do that?

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            For the same reason she’s flooding Germany with Muslims.

          • zampogna

            You know what you’re saying is crazy, right?

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You know Merkel herself says it, right? You really should read the news.

          • zampogna

            Let’s see a link.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            If you Google it yourself, you’ll see many links. Here are a few:

            dailystarDOTcoDOTuk/news/latest-news/589410/Angela-Merkel-more-refugees-Syria-Iraq-German-chancellor-terrorism-ISIS

            wwwDOTexpressDOTcoDOTuk/news/world/749793/Angela-Merkel-Chancellor-Germany-more-refugees-rest-EU

          • zampogna

            That is fake news. So are all the right wing alarmist ones you are referring to. I want to see a reputable source.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Those are actual quotes from her. Go to German news if you want it in the original German. No one disputes she said it.

          • zampogna

            Compare your statement to hers. They do not match.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            They do. I took my statement from her quote.

          • zampogna

            You did no such thing. You said flooding Germany with Muslims. She is talking about refugees. Very dishonest.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            The refugees are Muslim. Very dishonest of you to suggest otherwise.

          • zampogna

            You made the statement to be about Muslims, not refugees. That was a garbage move.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            The refugees are Muslims.

          • zampogna

            That isn’t why they’re being taken in. They’re fleeing the very violence and hate you are condemning them for. And they aren’t necessarily all Muslims. Her priority is the refugees. You have deliberately altered her purpose.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            I haven’t altered anything. I have merely posted about the facts. The facts remain that she is taking in Muslims at record rates.

            I have no idea why you’re following me around falsely accusing me of things, and asking the same questions and repeating the same statements over and over again.

          • zampogna

            I’m not “following you around”. I spotted you randomly saying something dishonest, trying to make Angela Merkel out to be something she isn’t. She’s doing something noble, and you’re making her out to be a person who shelters terrorists.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            I haven’t said anything dishonest. Again, you are falsely accusing me of things for some odd reason.

          • zampogna

            Whatever.

  • Craig Anderson

    Too bad she isn’t as outspoken against the open borders policy that has let an influx of Muslim rabble rousers that have created havoc in their country.

  • edgineer

    We simply have to stop the mentally deranged from imposing their psychotic agenda on normal people. 5% cannot set the norm for the 95%.