Parkland High School Shooting: At Least 17 Killed, Suspect in Custody

PARKLAND, Fla. (Fox News) — A shooting at a high school in Parkland, Florida, left at least 17 people dead, officials said Wednesday, and the suspect—believed to be a former student—was in custody.

The shooting suspect was identified as Nicolas Cruz, a U.S. official told The Associated Press.

Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School was under lockdown as police rushed to the scene.

The young man believed to be the suspect was wearing a maroon shirt as police led him off to a squad car in an area off school grounds. Video provided to WSVN appeared to show officers cuffing the suspect in the grass.

Continue reading this story >>


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  • Amos Moses – He>i

    it can happen when we least expect it …. Christ takes us to judgement …… no more chances to repent …… i hope these and any others were prepared …. i hope the rest come to repentance through Christ ……..

    • Amen my brother in Christ…..Amen.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        Doug …. how have you been lately ………….

        • Been under the weather off and on for the past couple of months. Had pneumonia but finally getting past it. How about You?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i have been fighting a cold ….. but it seems to be passing finally …… been doing a little hunting lately …… shooting varmints ……..

          • I grew up hunting and fishing but arthritis and COPD just won’t let me do it anymore.

            Getting old ain’t for sissies……LOL.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            LOL …. preach it brother …………

          • ROFL…..had I known then what I know now I woulda taken better care of myself!

    • Ganesha_akbar

      “But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!”
      [Matthew 18:6-7]

    • DrIndica

      Again with the threats of hell?

  • LynnRH

    Yep…..just another example of Satan and his angels on a rampage. My prayers are for comfort and healing for all those there. I pray that this will cause any of those not saved to turn their eyes upon Jesus and draw near to him.

    • Tim Matter

      Even if Satan is to blame for motivating this, our laws are to blame for the ability to carry it out so effectively.

      • LynnRH

        I do agree there needs to be stricter rules and guidelines. And I am a pro second amendment too.

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          The day after the heinous attack on Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, law enforcement officials indicated that alleged gunman Nikolas Cruz purchased his rifle legally.
          This means Cruz passed a background check to acquire the firearm.

          PIX 11 reports that Cruz purchased the gun “about a year ago.” Law enforcement officials speaking on condition of anonymity told the Associated Press that the purchase was made at a Broward County, Florida, gun store.

          USA Today reports that Cruz had “no criminal record” and, therefore, nothing to prevent him from passing a background check to acquire the gun.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        horse hockey to both those assertions ………. satan is not to blame ….. nor did the tool do anything …………

      • Ganesha_akbar

        uh… the Boston Marathon mass murderer made the Rolling Stone cover as a dreamy teen heart throb by weaponizing a pressure cooker.

        Our laws on pressure cookers had nothing to with it.

  • Tim Matter

    I grew up in a rural area and most males had a .22, a shotgun, and probably a high power bolt action deer rifle, but nobody had automatics. We even took them to school to refinish the stocks and blue the barrels in shop class.
    When I joined the Army (1983) and was stationed in El Paso I went to the gun shop and there were semi-automatic AR-15s and automatic pistols for sale. I wondered “What do city people need AR-15’s for?”
    35 years later and these automatics a big problem. Semi auto rifles are used in most of the mass slaughters and automatic handguns are used in most other killing including cop killings at traffic stops.
    I know we have the 2nd amendment, but why do we have to interpret the right to bear arms to be so absolute? Going back to the way it was 40 years ago would be denounced as communist, liberal, the slippery slope to taking all guns, etc, etc, but the bad guys back then mostly had bolt action rifles, 6 shot revolvers and maybe .45 automatic pistols with 7 round clips. Today we have 9mm’s with 16 round clips and AR-15s with 30 (or more) round magazines.
    “Nothing can be done about these shootings”…..said by the only first world country where these shootings regularly happen.

    • james blue

      I’m pro second. People have semi -autos because they like them, they may even find them “cool” and “fun”.

      The only reason they would need one would be if they wanted to kill everyone in the stadium.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        or to protect themselves from the that same person …………..

        • Tim Matter

          Those armed bodyguards sure stopped the shooting of Gabriel Giffords and the congressman at the ball game…….not.
          Also, if somebody had been armed inside Sutherland Springs Church they could have stopped the guy who was shooting through the building from the outside with a machine gun……probably not.
          And someone shooting back at the guy in Las Vegas who was shooting from the 32nd floor would have stopped him…….not.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            umm …. she was at a super market in Tucson …… and it WAS armed men in Arizona that caught him ….. as Arizona in an open carry state …………..

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      the second amendment is not about hunting or collecting or any other thing …… except to protect us from our so called protectors …… to keep the government in check …… we have three boxes to do that in this country …… the soap box ….. the ballot box …… and finally the cartridge box ……….. the box of last resort …………… and it is why we ARE a so called “first world country” ……………..

      • Tim Matter

        Good luck against an F-18, Predator drone, M-1 tank and artillery, unless you think we should be allowed to own them too. Even if we could, we still couldn’t afford to.

        • Amos Moses – He>i

          the people have a right to own those also ….. and history is replete with smaller less well armed forces beating up and throwing out bullies of all sorts ……..

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      When the people fear the government there is tyranny …… when the government fears the people there is liberty …………..

  • Ganesha_akbar

    This latest Democrat mass murderer is an ISIS wannabe with a fetish for guns, knives and bombs.

    Would gun grabbers be happier if this Democrat had weaponized a pressure cooker instead?

    Will his dad reprise the Pulse nightclub shooter and make a surprise audience appearance at the next Democrat campaign rally in Florida?

    • Croquet_Player

      Oh really, a “Democrat”? I’m curious to know how, within hours of the tragedy, unlike any other news source, or police and other officials’ spokespeople, you have managed to identify the shooter’s political party, ideological interests, and motivations? Because if you have such key information, which would be vital to their investigations, you should call the police in Broward County, Florida. They’d be very interested to hear from you.

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        The FBI Was Warned About A School Shooting Threat From A YouTube User Named Nikolas Cruz In September

        Buzzfeed ……

        The FBI Was Warned About A School Shooting Threat From A YouTube User Named Nikolas Cruz In September
        In September, a YouTube user named Nikolas Cruz left a comment on a video stating, “I’m going to be a professional school shooter.” The video’s creator alerted both the FBI and YouTube.

        • Croquet_Player

          Yes, and it’s alarming that even after posting such a direct claim, he was still able to purchase (or keep, if he already had it) the AR-15 he used to murder 17 people.

    • Tangent002 ✓

      It hasn’t been established that Cruz is a Democrat.

      • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        Yes it has. He’s a registered voter.

        • Croquet_Player

          Some people argued on social media that Cruz was actually a registered
          Democrat based on the voter registration of a Nicolas Cruz in Florida
          whose birthday is in May 1998. However, the Broward sheriff said in a
          press conference that the Nikolas Cruz accused of being the school
          shooter was born in September 1998, not in May. The accused school shooter’s name is spelled Nikolas, not Nicolas, although many in the news media initially went with the latter.

          • Ganesha_akbar

            You LIE!

          • Croquet_Player

            Well, no, I’m not lying, I’m relying upon the Broward County Police Department of Florida for his birth date, and the correct spelling of his name.

            It’s possible that I am wrong and you are right, or you are wrong and I am right, or that we both are wrong and neither of us are right, and the Broward County Police Department is wrong, or right, or they got some things right, and some things wrong.

            I would never accuse you of “lying” outright. You might be believing sources that are faulty. That doesn’t make you a “liar”. It makes you an honest reporter of the truth, who was presented with credible, yet false information. I would do the identical thing.

            May we shake hands and agree to pursue facts, and truth?

          • ♥LadyInChrist♥InGodITrust♥

            Lie. is all they know how to do.

          • Elca

            She is correct. try listening to other news source other than Fox.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            Thanks for the correction. I heard authorities say he was not affiliated with white supremacy either, another story the media ran with.

          • Croquet_Player

            Well, not exactly. It’s half true. A guy from some white supremacist group did actually claim the shooter had been a visitor or a participant in his group’s activities. But authorities say there is no evidence of that, and the white supremacist guy has since clammed up and blamed the (word I’m never going to use- a slur) media. He just wanted a bit of free press for his creepy group, and by golly, he got it.

            I know people want to point fingers and assign blame. We’re horrified and upset. We want to assign hateful motivations. He’s a republican! He’s a democrat! He’s a Christian! He’s a Muslim! He’s an atheist! He’s not “one of us”! I don’t know if you’re on Twitter, but in the last 24 hours I have seen the most ridiculous conspiracy theories put forth. He’s everything from the secret love child of Osama bin Laden and Kim Kardashian to an agent of, the Pope, the Kremlin, Mossad, the FBI, NATO, KKK, and…I think this one was my favorite – he’s a “vegan Wiccan man hating feminist”. That sure is one complicated guy.

            I think it’s far less complicated than that. He’s your average, garden-variety psychopath. His schoolmates had him pegged. He was creepy, angry, aggressive, obsessed with weapons, and tortured and killed small animals. All distinct hallmarks. Psychopaths may claim to be one religion or another, or claim allegiance to some political group, but that’s all a sham. They don’t really “care” about any of those things. They don’t have feelings and emotions like the rest of us. It’s a handy veneer they use for cloaking their desire to inflict pain and death.

            I think I’d like to focus on how we begin to reduce the staggering amount of mass gun deaths in this country. Other countries like us seem to be doing pretty well, and we’re doing really, really badly by comparison. What are we doing wrong?

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            The US has always had guns, but only recently, have had mass shootings. It’s not guns. It happened around the same time prayer and Bible study were taken out of school.

            I’m from Canada. Up until 2000, we had prayer and Bible reading in school. Now we no longer do. We have gun laws, but guess what? We still have gun crime, knife attacks, cross bow attacks, strangulation, etc. etc. In the UK, gun crime is up by 42%. So the problem isn’t really guns. It’s something deeper.

          • LynnRH

            As I’ve said before……..Satan and his angels are on a rampage because he knows the end is near.

          • Croquet_Player

            Prayer has not been “taken out of school”. Students have a constitutional right to pray at school, alone or in groups. They may bring religious texts to school. They may wear items like religious jewelry. School officials may not promote, or denigrate, a particular faith, or faiths, to students.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            That’s an insincere reply. Teachers and principals once led prayer in the mornings. Students were taught about God and allowed to have Bible studies and prayer openly in school. Those kinds of things have been shut down. Just read the pages here. Now the piper has to be paid.

          • Croquet_Player

            We may each question one another’s sincerity, but I doubt that will be helpful to the conversation. I hope and expect you are being sincere when you are writing to me here, and I extend you that courtesy as a matter of course in civil dialogue.

            It is true that teachers once led religious studies in public schools. However now there are many students, of all faiths, and no faith, who attend public schools. As they are required to be in school by law, they are also entitled to be free from any sort of poselytization, or denigration, of a particular faith, or no faith. This is why public schools must remain neutral in matters of faith (or non faith). You of course are free to teach you children whatever you like at home, send them to religious classes of your choosing, remove your children from public school entirely, etc., etc. But this law protects all students, and all parents too, from undue influences at school. Would you like your child being schooled in the rosary, if you are not Catholic? That is only one example, there are many.

            If you think school shootings are a direct result of neutrality on the matter of proselytization in schools, then you must show a direct result. For as we all know, correlation does not equal causation.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            All religions are not equal. All religions do not preach the same thing. Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, etc, all have an element of cruelty to them that Christianity does not. While Christianity was openly displayed in western schools, morality was prevalent. Crime did not reach the level that it has now. There is no longer any moral compass.

          • Croquet_Player

            Over the last quarter century, crime in the U.S., both violent crime and property crime, has fallen sharply. Please look up the Pew Research Center’s piece “5 facts about crime in the U.S.”. They used data provided by the FBI and the Bureau of Justice Statistics. From the article: “Using the FBI numbers, the violent crime rate fell 48% between 1993 and 2016. Using the BJS data, the rate fell 74% during that span.”

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            If that is so, why are you and others going for a gun grab? And what about the article titled “Violent Crime Rising in U.S. Cities Compared to 2015, Study Finds”? Could it also be that crime is being counted differently, with many crimes not even being acknowledged by law enforcement or government anymore?

          • Croquet_Player

            Who says I’m going for a “gun grab”? I’m a gun owner. I want to keep my gun. But I do want to keep guns, and in particular, AR-15 style, semi-automatic weaponry, out of the hands of would-be mass murderers. I could pass any background check or safety class requirements. I have no criminal record, of any kind. I have no record of any interactions with law enforcement. (Except once, 15 years ago when I reported we had been burgled. The police came, they were very nice, and took a report. Any by golly they caught the guy three weeks later. Yay, police, well done.) I have no history of psychiatric problems, or substance abuse. My gun is fully and safely secured. It’s not to much to ask that people who want to have guns demonstrate that they are able to meet the same requirements. I’m horrified and sickened by the mass murders, and endless gun violence, that happens in the U.S. Clearly something isn’t working, and it’s time to try some new approaches.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            The laws are in place, but they were not followed by the FBI, or local law agencies. That’s why the shooting happened. The purpose for the 2nd Amendment is to fight tyranny, not to shoot up schools. There is good reason why American citizens want powerful weapons at their disposal. Every time a government goes after its citizens’ weapons, bad things happen. Countries with the least amount of citizen weaponry still have mass murders, and the country with the largest amount of citizen weaponry (Israel) has the least amount of mass murders.

          • Croquet_Player

            The era has long passed since citizens of the US can take on the armed forces, even with dozens of AR-15 style weapons per person. Let’s put that long dead fantasy to rest. And Israel has some pretty tough gun laws. I’m in favor of strict, fair gun control. And I’ll be working for the campaigns and voting for those who share my views. We’ve had far too much bloodshed.

          • Guest✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            That’s nonsense. There is good reason why citizens need to be armed against tyranny and any other threat.

            The United States has tough gun laws. The problem is the libs in office who don’t want to enforce them, like Scott Israel. The areas that have the strictest gun laws in the US are the ones with the most gun crime. That’s what thugs do: they go where unarmed citizens are.

      • Ganesha_akbar

        You LIE!

        • Croquet_Player

          In the shooter’s (now removed) Instagram account, there is a photo of a person wearing a MAGA hat and a red white and blue face covering. It appears to be a “selfie” (a photo he took of himself).

          • Ganesha_akbar

            mass murdering Demonrat also tried to disguise himself as a student during the evacuation.

            Try harder to avoid defending the indefensible.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      What was Cruz’s family structure?–Cruz’s father died some years ago and his mother died around Thanksgiving 2017. The Washington Post reports that he was “living at a friend’s house” and that he was showing “signs of depression.” Was he receiving treatment for depression? – Brietbart

      my guess would be no ………..

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      GRAPHIC VIDEO: Islamic/Antifa links of Florida Mass Shooter;The mass murderer was immersed in Islamic and leftwing hate. ALL THE GOVERNMENT COVER UPS LEAD TO ONE CONCLUSION,THESE ARE ALL ORCHESTRATED TO TAKE AWAY THE GUNS-TOTAL DE-STABILIZATION! – SQ

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    The FBI Was Warned About A School Shooting Threat From A YouTube User Named Nikolas Cruz In SeptemberSQ;EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE INCIDENTS STAGED OR REAL, HAS PRIOR KNOWLEDGE BY FBI,YET NO INTERRUPTIONS?GUN CONTROL AGENDA

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    GRAPHIC VIDEO: Islamic/Antifa links of Florida Mass Shooter;The mass murderer was immersed in Islamic and leftwing hate.

    • Truth73

      Oh my. Check your sources. All evidence shows how the gun man was very active in the white supremacist movement. Pictures of him sportin’ the ugly MAGA hat too!

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        lots of disinformation out there ………… i do not see any difference in either group …… but if you are correct then all the victims were non-white …. is that correct ………..

        • Truth73

          Yes there is a lot of disinformation out there…where you visit apparently. Why pass it along? My information is correct, which is why I typed it. I would never consider causing outrage inappropriately. The color of the victims is irrelevant. Just passing along the correct information of the groups he hung with.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and if there is so much disinformation ….. then HOW DO YOU KNOW “My information is correct” ………….. “Just passing along the correct information of the groups he hung with.” again ….. on what basis is it “correct” ……… when his victims do not reflect such an assertion ………… “The color of the victims is irrelevant.” ….. NOT if you are going to claim he is a “racist” and “white supremacist” ………………..

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            A white nationalist group has an Hispanic as a member?

            I don’t think so!

          • Truth73

            Exactly. See how stupid it is when we disseminate misinformation? Point made. Maybe you should stop it too!

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i never said he was a member …………. YOU did ……….. so maybe you should take your own advice ………….

          • Truth73

            Yours was most definitely wrong. There is not evidence of antifa. Just as there is no evidence of militia and white supremacist connections (even though the leader of the latter claimed it). I am not being self-contradictory….just demonstrating how bad it is to claim you know something with no facts behind it.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            his social media pages show what i said ….. his statements about himself ……. so NOPE to your assertions …………

            gellerreport;com/2018/02/fla-schol-shooter-islamic-left.html/ – Replace the ; with a .

          • Truth73

            oh my. Geller? Really? Here you go – replay ; with a .
            https://www.snopes;com/florida-nikolas-cruz-isis/

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            SNOPES …. the guy who cheated on his wife and sent a couple of million dollars to offshore banks …….

            LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL ……

            you can not like the source all you want … the screen captures of his social media pages are there …… your problem … not mine …..Cruzs statements and pictures of himself …. which you cannot refute …..

          • Truth73

            “the guy who cheated on his wife and sent a couple of million dollars to offshore banks”
            Gosh for a minute there I thought you were talking about our Prez!! LOL But you are right the screen captures of his social media pages are there. And they do not support anything you said about antifa, leftist, etc.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            we are not talking about the prez ….. he did not shoot anyone ….. and i did not vote for him …… WHAT ELSE YOU GOT ……………

          • Truth73

            I was just saying. The similarity was funny! And you comment was classic ad hominem. The guy’s cheating has nothing to do with the credibility of the story.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            not ad hominem ….. that would be an attack on you ……. and FYI ….. you did the same to geller …… but be that as it may …… snopes has absolutely no credibility with me ….. not for that reason ……. but i have been there many times …. used to think it was credible …… but they have sold out there credibility to … oh i dont know …… but there stuff just does not align to the truth …………..

          • Truth73

            Nope. I correctly disregarded geller – nothing in the kid’s posts points to ISIS or antifa.

            You might not understand ad hominem. Ad hominem (as illustrated by your comment) is “You can’t believe that site’s analysis of the false story about ISIS and the shooter because the owner cheated on his wife”. It has nothing to do with who you direct it at lol.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            just everything there in his pictures does … as they all dress in the uniform he displays …….

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            FBI Statement on the Shooting in Parkland, Florida
            On January 5, 2018, a person close to Nikolas Cruz contacted the FBI’s Public Access Line (PAL) tipline to report concerns about him. The caller provided information about Cruz’s gun ownership, desire to kill people, erratic behavior, and disturbing social media posts, as well as the potential of him conducting a school shooting.

          • Truth73

            Yes, those disturbing social media posts…anything to do with antifa? Just checking.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            just look …. see the pictures …. see how he is dressed …… see his name …. see spot run …. run spot run …….

          • Truth73

            They definitely botched this case for sure! Agreed.

            As for the pictures…yeah….they support my initial theories more than yours LOL. Nothing antifa or isis about them!

  • Vince

    Here’s some irony: The people who claim that the Constitution prohibits praying in school are usually the same people who would gladly get rid of the Constitution’s guarantee of citizens’ right to arm themselves.

    No logic on the left. They are “Constitutionalists” only when it suits them.

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      hard to understand how an unwritten “civil right” somehow trumps the UNALIENABLE CONSTITUTIONAL rights that ARE written …………..

    • Croquet_Player

      Hold up there, my friend. I am a firm supporter of the constitution. The second amendment speaks of a “well regulated militia” in regard to gun ownership. Do you think this school shooter who murdered 17 people at his former school was part of a “well regulated militia”? The founding fathers were not stupid, and even they couched gun ownership in terms of being “regulated” (subject to rules). It’s unfortunate that at their time they were talking about guns that took quite some time to reload for one shot, and were held by their fellow rebels against oppressive government forces. (Most guns at the time were held together in town “armories” but that’s another discussion, well worth having.) I like to imagine they were smart enough to realize that the fact that any lunatic who can buy an AR-15 (the favored weapon of most modern day mass killers) might be something we should “regulate”.

      And before you call me some “anti-gun nut”, let me tell you I own a gun. It’s antique, passed down to me by my beloved late father. It is unloaded, there is no ammo, and no plans to buy any. And I would resent any effort to take it from me. Also, I deeply respect the rights of those who hunt for food, or live very far away from police help in an emergency. It’s kind of an antique idea that a musket, and you and your pals all have one, can protect you from government forces, in an age of nuclear weapons.

      And before you tell me “well you can kill people with knives”, let me say, that’s very true. But we all use knives in our kitchens every day, and we don’t all use guns to chop vegetables. Everyone needs a knife. Or an ax to chop wood, and so forth. But civilians don’t need an AR-15, or similar. I don’t imagine banning certain weapons, or strongly reduced access to certain weapons will stop all crime. But it will certainly lessen it. And isn’t that the point? It’s the same with laws. The fact that we have laws against murder, doesn’t stop murders. Should we just throw laws against murder out the window because “they don’t work”? Obviously not.

      I don’t like to mention these things because they tend to give certain people “ideas”. But you should look up the Bath School bombing of 1927.

      People can always find a way to kill people. It doesn’t mean we can’t try to make it a lot harder for them to do so.

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    ALLEGED SHOOTER “ON MEDS”: WHY SSRIS ARE SUICIDE MURDER PILLS
    Once again, a school shooter is on anti-depressants

    THERE IT IS …………….

    • Croquet_Player

      Well except there are millions of people taking anti-depressants who don’t go shoot up their workplace, family home, or in this case, former school. Or, kill themselves, alone. I don’t know how you draw a direct link between people who are on medication and mass shootings, but it’s pretty creepy that you try. Are you a psychiatrist? Anti-depressants have enabled many millions of people to lead healthy lives. What, exactly, are you suggesting?

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        these drugs are dangerous ….. and just because those who take them do not act on the feelings they get from them does not make them less so …. and if you look up the adverse reactions to SSRIs ….. it is right there in the package inserts …….. better living through chemistry is not the answer ……….. and the thing is they can be used to deliberately cause this condition where a person acts on the suicidal ideations caused by the medication ….. and almost every mass shooting of the past twenty years can be traced to people on SSRIs ……..

        • Croquet_Player

          I would imagine all people who commit crimes wear, or have at one point worn shoes too. Should we ban shoes? I’m sorry, but until you can provide a direct link between people on medication from their doctors, and a clear causality to show they commit more, or any, crimes as a direct result, we’re nowhere.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            we are not talking about shoes ….. we are talking about PSYCHOACTIVE DRUGS ………… so false conflation ……. it is not my job to do YOUR research ……….. and the direct link is here ….

            The killer at Northern Illinois University had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Virginia Tech had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Stockton had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Navy Yard had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Ft. Hood had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Isla Vista had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Paducah had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at UCC had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Aurora had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Tucson had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Tallahassee had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Kauhajoki had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Fresno had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Jokela had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Red Lion had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at Ikeda had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            The killer at El Cajon had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.
            Nikolas de Jesus Crux had been prescribed psychiatric drugs.

            SSRI’s make things worse, Joan Mathews-Larson, PhD
            youtu;be/TqGhZdZMIuk – Replace the ; with a .

          • Croquet_Player

            Yes, millions of unwell people have been prescribed all kinds of drugs. Some of them go on to do drugs of their own, too. My point is, are commonly prescribed anti-depressants A DIRECT CAUSE of people going on to do violence? To themselves, or others, or both? You don’t seem to see or understand the link between corollary and causation. For that you need science. Science shows that people on anti-depressants are LESS LIKELY to commit suicide (or kill others). I think we can agree that there’s certainly something mentally wrong with people who commit mass murder. The fact that many of them have been prescribed drugs is no surprise. You’re already dealing with an unwell population. I’m not prepared to do this experiment, but if we took all the mentally ill people OFF their drugs, then what? All the research shows they would do LESS WELL. Some people on anti-depressants still commit suicide. Some kill others, then themselves. And of course you’re ruling out the population of people who aren’t on any drugs at all, (even illicit ones) and still go on to commit horrific crimes.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            • Eric Harris age 17 (first on Zoloft then Luvox) and Dylan Klebold aged 18 (Columbine school shooting in Littleton, Colorado), killed 12 students and 1 teacher, and wounded 23 others, before killing themselves. Klebold’s medical records have never been made available to the public.

            • Jeff Weise, age 16, had been prescribed 60 mg/day of Prozac (three times the average starting dose for adults!) when he shot his grandfather, his grandfather’s girlfriend and many fellow students at Red Lake, Minnesota. He then shot himself. 10 dead, 12 wounded.

            • Cory Baadsgaard, age 16, Wahluke (Washington state) High School, was on Paxil (which caused him to have hallucinations) when he took a rifle to his high school and held 23 classmates hostage. He has no memory of the event.

            • Chris Fetters, age 13, killed his favorite aunt while taking Prozac.

            • Christopher Pittman, age 12, murdered both his grandparents while taking Zoloft.

            • Mathew Miller, age 13, hung himself in his bedroom closet after taking Zoloft for 6 days.

            • Kip Kinkel, age 15, (on Prozac and Ritalin) shot his parents while they slept then went to school and opened fire killing 2 classmates and injuring 22 shortly after beginning Prozac treatment.

            • Luke Woodham, age 16 (Prozac) killed his mother and then killed two students, wounding six others.

            • A boy in Pocatello, ID (Zoloft) in 1998 had a Zoloft-induced seizure that caused an armed stand off at his school.

            • Michael Carneal (Ritalin), age 14, opened fire on students at a high school prayer meeting in West Paducah, Kentucky. Three teenagers were killed, five others were wounded..

            • A young man in Huntsville, Alabama (Ritalin) went psychotic chopping up his parents with an ax and also killing one sibling and almost murdering another.

            • Andrew Golden, age 11, (Ritalin) and Mitchell Johnson, aged 14, (Ritalin) shot 15 people, killing four students, one teacher, and wounding 10 others.

            • TJ Solomon, age 15, (Ritalin) high school student in Conyers, Georgia opened fire on and wounded six of his class mates.

            • Rod Mathews, age 14, (Ritalin) beat a classmate to death with a bat.

            • James Wilson, age 19, (various psychiatric drugs) from Breenwood, South Carolina, took a .22 caliber revolver into an elementary school killing two young girls, and wounding seven other children and two teachers.

            • Elizabeth Bush, age 13, (Paxil) was responsible for a school shooting in Pennsylvania

            • Jason Hoffman (Effexor and Celexa) – school shooting in El Cajon, California

            • Jarred Viktor, age 15, (Paxil), after five days on Paxil he stabbed his grandmother 61 times.

            • Chris Shanahan, age 15 (Paxil) in Rigby, ID who out of the blue killed a woman.

            • Jeff Franklin (Prozac and Ritalin), Huntsville, AL, killed his parents as they came home from work using a sledge hammer, hatchet, butcher knife and mechanic’s file, then attacked his younger brothers and sister.

            • Neal Furrow (Prozac) in LA Jewish school shooting reported to have been court-ordered to be on Prozac along with several other medications.

            • Kevin Rider, age 14, was withdrawing from Prozac when he died from a gunshot wound to his head. Initially it was ruled a suicide, but two years later, the investigation into his death was opened as a possible homicide. The prime suspect, also age 14, had been taking Zoloft and other SSRI antidepressants.

            • Alex Kim, age 13, hung himself shortly after his Lexapro prescription had been doubled.

            • Diane Routhier was prescribed Welbutrin for gallstone problems. Six days later, after suffering many adverse effects of the drug, she shot herself.

            • Billy Willkomm, an accomplished wrestler and a University of Florida student, was prescribed Prozac at the age of 17. His family found him dead of suicide – hanging from a tall ladder at the family’s Gulf Shore Boulevard home in July 2002.

            • Kara Jaye Anne Fuller-Otter, age 12, was on Paxil when she hung herself from a hook in her closet. Kara’s parents said “…. the damn doctor wouldn’t take her off it and I asked him to when we went in on the second visit. I told him I thought she was having some sort of reaction to Paxil…”)

            • Gareth Christian, Vancouver, age 18, was on Paxil when he committed suicide in 2002, (Gareth’s father could not accept his son’s death and killed himself.)

            • Julie Woodward, age 17, was on Zoloft when she hung herself in her family’s detached garage.

            • Matthew Miller was 13 when he saw a psychiatrist because he was having difficulty at school. The psychiatrist gave him samples of Zoloft. Seven days later his mother found him dead, hanging by a belt from a laundry hook in his closet.

            • Kurt Danysh, age 18, and on Prozac, killed his father with a shotgun. He is now behind prison bars, and writes letters, trying to warn the world that SSRI drugs can kill.

            • Woody __, age 37, committed suicide while in his 5th week of taking Zoloft. Shortly before his death his physician suggested doubling the dose of the drug. He had seen his physician only for insomnia. He had never been depressed, nor did he have any history of any mental illness symptoms.

            • A boy from Houston, age 10, shot and killed his father after his Prozac dosage was increased.

            • Hammad Memon, age 15, shot and killed a fellow middle school student. He had been diagnosed with ADHD and depression and was taking Zoloft and “other drugs for the conditions.”

            • Matti Saari, a 22-year-old culinary student, shot and killed 9 students and a teacher, and wounded another student, before killing himself. Saari was taking an SSRI and a benzodiazapine.

            • Steven Kazmierczak, age 27, shot and killed five people and wounded 21 others before killing himself in a Northern Illinois University auditorium. According to his girlfriend, he had recently been taking Prozac, Xanax and Ambien. Toxicology results showed that he still had trace amounts of Xanax in his system.

            • Finnish gunman Pekka-Eric Auvinen, age 18, had been taking antidepressants before he killed eight people and wounded a dozen more at Jokela High School – then he committed suicide.

            • Asa Coon from Cleveland, age 14, shot and wounded four before taking his own life. Court records show Coon was on Trazodone.

            • Jon Romano, age 16, on medication for depression, fired a shotgun at a teacher in his New York high school.

            Missing from list… 3 of 4 known to have taken these same meds….

            • What drugs was Jared Lee Loughner on, age 21…… killed 6 people and injuring 14 others in Tuscon, Az?

            • What drugs was James Eagan Holmes on, age 24….. killed 12 people and injuring 59 others in Aurora Colorado?

            • What drugs was Jacob Tyler Roberts on, age 22, killed 2 injured 1, Clackamas Or?

            • What drugs was Adam Peter Lanza on, age 20, Killed 26 and wounded 2 in Newtown Ct?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Missing from list… 3 of 4 known to have taken these same meds….

            • What drugs was Jared Lee Loughner on, age 21…… killed 6 people and injuring 14 others in Tuscon, Az?

            • What drugs was James Eagan Holmes on, age 24….. killed 12 people and injuring 59 others in Aurora Colorado?

            • What drugs was Jacob Tyler Roberts on, age 22, killed 2 injured 1, Clackamas Or?

            • What drugs was Adam Peter Lanza on, age 20, Killed 26 and wounded 2 in Newtown Ct?

          • Croquet_Player

            Again, these were all deeply UNWELL PEOPLE to begin with. And drugs may mitigate, but do not change, the personality disorder known as “psychopathy”. Some humans, I’m sorry to inform you, are “psychopaths”. Their brains function differently. Most of us humans exhibit “revulsion” and “fright” responses to images of torture, gore, death, horror, etc. These are autonomic (involuntary, unconscious) responses, and they can be measured. Psychopaths DO NOT. You’ve just provided a (very short) list of psychopaths. Psychopaths are estimated to be 1% of the human population. 25% of people in prison are psychopaths. Sure, we can try to treat them with drugs and therapy, but there is no “cure” for psychopathy.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “Again, these were all deeply UNWELL PEOPLE to begin with. ”

            and they were given psychoactive drugs that made them MORE unwell …… and they killed people ………..

          • Croquet_Player

            NO. Until you can produce any studies that show that psychoactive drugs – and I’m talking about legally prescribed drugs, by a psychiatrist – directly INDUCE people to commit crimes, then no. Fun fact, you know what keeps psychopaths out of prison? Education, intelligence, and relative means. The smarter psychopaths function among us. They operate with no empathy or emotion, they just fake it. They often get their “thrills” from horror movies, and small, malevolent acts. The more impulsive ones do outright horrible things, and are usually caught.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and EVERYONE of them had them “legally prescribed” …….. and the science IS being done in a live population …. in real time ….. and you want to deny the truth … as is your usual …….

          • DrIndica

            40ish anecdotes culled from the millions taking the medications you mention is hardly statistically significant. You do understand correlation does not = causation. Ever thought of confounding factors or unknown variables?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            40 actual shootings and deaths …. are not “anecdotal” …….. do you understand that science is carried out in the field in real time and not confined to a sterile lab to be valid …….

          • DrIndica

            A PhD should not practice medicine, Joan, should stick to the discipline in which she is educated.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and just my guess … but that would be RESEARCH …. for which she is QUALIFIED ………..

          • DrIndica

            Her treatments for depression and addiction are simply quackery.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            in your opinion ….. SO WHAT ……….. SSRIs are not just quackery …… they are dangerous ……. they cause suicidal ideation …….. and the drug companys own literature and package inserts of adverse reactions says so ………….

          • DrIndica

            The side effects you mention are rare, and the same side effects are relevant to AEDs, but the slim possibility is a risk worth taking to control generalized tonic-clonic seizures. Cannabis helps with depression and epilepsy, as well, and that is a natural gift from nature.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            40 cases of “HOMICIDAL IDEATION” …… not anecdotal and not slim enough ……….. they are DANGEROUS drugs …………..

          • DrIndica

            Inductive reasoning (i.e. finding anecdotes to support a predetermined outcome to a hypothesis) is not science, or reasonably intelligent.

          • Elca

            And yet ALL had guns legally. Go figure the madness…

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            YUP … the dangers of living in a FREE society ……. either we are free or we are not …… and if you limit freedom for some …. it limits freedom for all …… there is no PEACE AND SAFETY ….. that is an illusion ……….

            1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

          • Elca

            “YUP … the dangers of living in a FREE society ……. either we are free or we are not…” I hope you can appreciate the hypocrisy in this comment, for you do not think a woman should be free to choose to abort her baby. ( I do not agree with her choice but is it not the same dangers of living in a FREE society”?)
            Secondly, are we also free to own Nukes? do you advocate for us to legally own Nukes?
            A free Society does not mean the absence of ” rules and regulation”.
            I am pleased that these students have focused on the need to ban these assault and semi-auto gun from our “Free Society”. It is a guaranteed that NO ONE will massacre kids in a FREE Society with those guns if NO ONE can get them.
            Yes, Moses, we are free, but you are NOT FREE to kill me or kids in school.

            “For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.” This is the context for v3. But this issue of mass shootings with guns isn’t a ” Sudden ” issue that visited us overnight. This has been an ongoing madness…with a society that clings to their guns and religion making an idol out of Guns and the GOP, having a form of godliness but denying the God of creation whose hearts are FAR from Him.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            God gave men a certain amount of freedom …. free to make bad choices …… are they free to make that choice …… sure ….. just as the choice murder any other person ….. there are consequences for all actions …… “choice but is it not the same dangers of living in a FREE society”?” … it surely is ….. when men live their free choices it affects all other men ……

            “I am pleased that these students have focused on the need to ban these assault and semi-auto gun from our “Free Society”. It is a guaranteed that NO ONE will massacre kids in a FREE Society with those guns if NO ONE can get them.”

            that genie is not going back in the bottle ……. it is no guarantee …. it is illusion and delusion ……………

        • DrIndica

          “better living through chemistry is not the answer”
          So, people with cancer, Parkinson’s or epilepsy, etc… should eschew chemical medication, and just “pray” instead?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            false conflation ……….. FAIL ……….. but there is nothing wrong with that option ……….

          • DrIndica

            So you decide the appropriate treatment? Where do you practice medicine?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            where do you ……… and would you like to demonstrate your supposed “Dr” by taking SSRIs or maybe some thalidomide ….. because drug companies are about making profit ….. and that would NEVER interfere ….. would it …………

          • DrIndica

            I’m not an MD, but I do listen to the people educated and trained in medicine.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            so you do not know of what you speak ….. do you have ANY medical experience …… other than as a patient …… i have a 20 plus year career in medicine ………………. trained and as a trainer ……….. WHAT YOU GOT ………… other than your opinion …………..

          • DrIndica

            I’m just guessing RE: your training and career, but homeopathy is not medicine. 🙂

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Nope … not “homeopahty” ………..

          • DrIndica

            Well, good on you. I survived septic shock about 4 years ago, and the ICU staff, literally saved my life. Keep up the good work!

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            God saved your life ….. for His purposes ….. He used the staff at that hospital to do it ….. He is sovereign ……..

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    Series Of Catastrophic FBI And Social Media Failures Have Enabled Mass Shooters To Slaughter Americans While They Pursued Fake Russia Collusion Narrative And Stifling Conservatives
    – Is FBI’s Deliberate Incompetence Part Of Their Gun Control Agenda?

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    PARKLAND, Fla. (INTELLIHUB) Stoneman High School student and Valentine’s Day shooting survivor Alexa Miednik told a reporter that she spoke with the alleged shooter Nikolas Cruz in the hallway just after shots rang out at the other end of the building and said she knows that there was definitely another shooter.

    It appears that the mainstream media and authorities have been actively covering up the fact that at least one other shooter was on the ground at the school Wednesday.

    The young lady said that she had just gotten back to her classroom after a bathroom break and was knocking on the classroom door when the fire bell rang which prompted the school’s principal to come over the loudspeaker and announce the evacuation.

    “[…] the fire alarm went off and the principal came on the speaker and just said ‘everyone needs to evacuate right now,’” she explained. “As I was going down the stairs I heard a couple of shots fired.”

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    UPDATE: Local law enforcement says NO TIES to white nationalist group…

    • Elca

      quote,“A representative of the Republic of Florida named Jacob Jered initially told multiple outlets that suspect Nikolas Cruz was a member, though later in the day Mr Jereb undercut his previous claim with a statement saying there had been a “misunderstanding” due to his group having multiple people with the same first name.” . The man is a LIAR…the initial response was the correct one.

    • Croquet_Player

      Thank you, Amos Moses, apparently what they actually said was “NO TIES” Yet. Here’s what I’m prepared to say at this point, and I mean it.

      “Let’s all get together and figure out a way so that fans of the 2nd amendment, can all stop looking like we’re murdering children.”

      • Amos Moses – He>i

        “……so that fans of the 2nd amendment, can all stop looking like we’re murdering children.””

        “…….so that fans of the 2nd amendment, call for a stop to portraying them like they’re murdering children.”

        see the difference ……. demonization of the innocent …… the 2nd amendment is an UNALIENABLE right …. no one has any right to place a LIEN on those rights …….. and despite the events that occur … and these events are really recent in their nature …… the right to self defense is integral to freedom …………….. and we should be asking why those who want that right removed ….. want it removed ……

        and it is interesting that most of those same people have no problem with killing a child in the womb …… and the thing that prevents them from killing the rest of us in a similar fashion …. is that armed people will fight back ………….

        • Croquet_Player

          Amos, what is your proposal to prevent or reduce mass shootings in the United States? I have mine, but I’d like to hear yours, and please do go first. If you wish, I’ll go first, your call, simple courtesy to you of course.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            i do not see anything to change except enforce the laws that we already have ……….. there is a company … Glock i think ….. they have had a camera on a locked and loaded weapon for over 25 years …… and guess what ….. it has yet to fire itself and harm anyone ….. ever …. in the entire 25 years …… we are not talking about a weapon problem ….. we are talking about a HEART problem ….. and the idea that human life is not special ….. and a secular worldview that all options are equally valid …… and a “what i think is what it is”and “I am the determiner of truth” post-modernism ….. and abandonment of truth ….. and unless and until that changes ……. nothing is going to change ………….

          • Croquet_Player

            So, you think a change is required “in peoples’ hearts”. And if we could change people from a “secular worldview” to a…whatever your particular religious view is, then that would reduce or eliminate gun crime.

            O.k., well thanks for your input. I’d say the same is true for me. If everyone had a change of heart and thought the way I did, there would be no gun crime at all.

            Well, now that we’ve solved gun crime…

            Amos my friend, we can’t legislate what’s in people’s hearts. No one can. And this is a free country, which means the government doesn’t even try. Do you have any other ideas? Concrete steps we can take?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “we can’t legislate what’s in people’s hearts”

            right … and legislation is not the answer … it has not been so far and it will not in the future ……. and the “god” of government is not the change nor the answer ……….

          • Croquet_Player

            So the other countries that are similar to us, the U.K., Australia, Canada, France, Spain, Norway, Sweden, Germany, Japan, Ireland, etc., etc, all of which have drastically – by the many thousands – lower gun crimes, have all made “a change in peoples’ hearts”. Is that really what did the trick for them? Seriously?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            “gun crime” lower ….. all other crime just the same or higher …… and at what expense …. freedom ….. and not one heart change …. as you so rightly pointed out but seem to have forgotten just minutes ago …… “we can’t legislate what’s in people’s hearts” ….. there have been terrific mass deaths in every one of those listed countries ….

            try again …………..

          • Croquet_Player

            Amos, you can’t just make up your own facts. All of those counties have massively lower gun deaths and gun crimes than we do. That is simply a fact. If you want to pretend that’s not true, then we’re done.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            and massively less freedom ….. how about the fact that they use knives or other weapons to accomplish the same thing and no guns make no difference …… as you say ….. “you can’t just make up your own facts” ………

            Japan knife attack: At least 19 dead – CNN – …… 2016
            “you can’t just make up your own facts” ………

            Child knife deaths in England and Wales set for nine-year peak ……. 2017
            “you can’t just make up your own facts” ………

            Germany: Surge in Stabbings and Knife Crimes – Gatestone Institute …. 2017
            “you can’t just make up your own facts” ………

          • Croquet_Player

            I’m curious, do you just copy and paste from right wing lunatic fringe websites? Yes, there are millions of ways to kill people, including knife attacks. But guns are the most effective, in terms of easy access, and low cost. And none of those countries have “less freedom”. Also, this “knife” parallel you’re attempting is ridiculous. We’re in a duel, pick a weapon, AR-15 or knife? You picked the knife? GREAT. I get the AR-15.

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            CNN is a “right wing lunatic fringe websites” …. REALLY …….. Canada Stats is a “right wing lunatic fringe websites” ….. REALLY ……. ” And none of those countries have “less freedom” …… they have no freedom to self protection from others …… “you can’t just make up your own facts” ……… “We’re in a duel, pick a weapon, AR-15 or knife? You picked the knife? GREAT. I get the AR-15.” … and how far away are you ……. because if you are within 10 feet ….. which if i had the knife and the element of surprise ….. i would …… your throat could be severed BEFORE you got a chance to aim and fire ACCURATELY ….. and you are just as dead ………… and that REALLY is a ridiculous analogy as you do not know what you are talking about …… or did you think the bayonet was not a knife and that it was not useful in hand to hand combat …………. and it has been an arm of war for centuries ….

            GREEEEAT ………….

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            Minnesota: More Guns, Less Violent Crime

            Minnesota is coming off a year of record-breaking background checks for gun sales coupled with statistics that show record low violent crime.

            CBS Minnesota reports that “the state set a new record for firearms background checks” in 2017. That record follows the issuance of a record number of Minnesota concealed carry permits–71,156–in 2016.

            Amid these gun purchases and concealed carry permit issuance records something else was happening–crime was falling. That state’s “violent crime rate hit a 50-year low in 2016.”

            ONE YEAR …….. WCCO …. rather liberal as i recall ………… and i think Mn is a cesspool ………………

          • Tenstron

            What changes to the law would you propose that would have prevented this shooting?

          • Croquet_Player

            “Extreme Risk Protection Order” Law. Persons close to an individual in crisis may ask a judge to temporarily remove that individual’s guns.

            Ban on assault-style weapons, and after-market “modification” kits.

            100% of gun sales must have background checks. (Currently only 60% do).

            Require gun buyers to take a safety course. Require gun owners to keep guns secured when not in use. Impose stiff penalties for those whose unsecured guns are used in shootings (for example when a toddler or child finds a gun, and uses it.)

            Impose stiff penalties on gun dealers and buyers who attempt to conceal identities or circumvent law in gun sales/purchases.

          • Tenstron

            1. How could it be determined that an individual was in crisis?
            2. What is an assault weapon? How would you define it?
            3. BS – where is your proof? Plus, the gun used was obtained legally and the offender did not have a background so irrelevant.
            4. Irrelevant – this wouldn’t prevent a crazy person from doing a mass shooting. How would you determine that a gun was unsecured?
            5. No proof that this is happening

          • Croquet_Player

            Those are my proposals, before we argue them, I’d like to hear yours.

          • Tenstron

            Put armed guards in all schools. Then these offenders wouldn’t dare.

          • Croquet_Player

            Metal detectors are a good idea. I live in San Francisco, and before the assassinations of Mayor George Moscone and Supervisor Harvey Milk, in November of 1978, we could all just walk into City Hall. Now, like an airport, we all have to wait in line to go through screening. It costs a lot of money, but I suppose that’s the price we pay. There are certainly armed guards all over Washington D.C., for all our higher public officials and rightly so. There are crazy people out there, (or not “crazy” but agents of foreign governments, or anti-government citizens) and government officials are targets. It’s a very, very serious matter.

            I wonder about “guards” however. Do we post armed guards at every school? Every movie theater? Every concert? Every farmers’ market? Does every school or public function require armed guards? I have had the great privilege of knowing a few Secret Service members. One of them, long past (may he rest in peace, a wonderful man) could never sit with his back to a door. (This caused a few dinner party seating conundrums for my mother at our California household.) As you may recall, President Reagan was shot, surrounded by the Secret Service. This was an utter nightmare for them. And I think the Secret Service are the best trained, and the best well armed guards in the world.

            So yes, I suppose we could now pay to post armed guards and metal detectors at every public school.

            Or as I proposed, we could enact some common sense gun laws.

            And, while I don’t have time right now, if you give me a day or so, I’d like to address your rebuttals to my proposals. I have family here, and I must put them first for the moment, as I’m sure you can understand.

          • Croquet_Player

            I will do my best to address your points one at a time.

            1. How could it be determined that an individual was in crisis?

            That matter would be ultimately up to a judge. Generally, they take into account testimony from “Social Services”, etc. I don’t know if you have ever dealt with a newly demented parent, but, and this is a terrible thing, at some point you have to take their car keys away. Because, while being a responsible model citizen all their lives, they can suddenly no longer drive. It happens pretty fast. Thank heavens my mother had a flat tire in her own garage. I’d show her the flat, and say “Mom dear, you can’t drive on that” And she say “Oh, of course not”, and then we’d go through the identical thing the next day, as if it was new information. This was not a person capable of driving. It took another six months to get her “declared” (a medical diagnosis) so I could officially take over all the poor woman’s business affairs. But I could see she did not have her usual wits about her, and I didn’t want her out on the road. Family members or friends are usually the first to spot “trouble”. If they are wrong, or lying, that’s were Social Services get involved.

            2. What is an assault weapon? How would you define it?

            Good question. I will refer you to “The Brady Campaign” They’re quite specific.

            Also, I am a gun owner myself, so I’d like to have these matters very clearly sorted. Because apparently they are not.

            3. BS – where is your proof? Plus, the gun used was obtained legally and the offender did not have a background so irrelevant.

            My proof is the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives Bureau’s data. Please look it up, one of us, or both, may be wrong or right. Well, the gun owner did in fact have a long history with law enforcement.

            4.
            Irrelevant – this wouldn’t prevent a crazy person from doing a mass
            shooting. How would you determine that a gun was unsecured?
            5. No proof that this is happening

          • Tenstron

            1. It seems that the mother had concerns about this boy but they were not heeded by law enforcement. Its a shame. They should have listened. However, if the gun had been taken from him, would his intent to cause harm be quelled? This I doubt. The trouble with criminals is that they will always find a way. Take France for example. A gun is not needed when you can get a truck and mow down 80 people in a crowd.

            2. Couldn’t find anything on their site about it

            3. If you could provide a link to that data I would be interested. Hard to find things on a govt website. Edit: what history did he have with law enforcement?

            4. Toddlers with guns? You lost me there. How could any parent be so stupid? You have my support on that one. Prosecute the parents without hesitation.

            5. You said apparently. I need to see proof. The old gun show loophole is an urban legend afaik

          • Croquet_Player

            I would ask you another thing. I have the first amendment right of free speech, do I not? But I clearly may not show up to your home and make direct threats, to you, your family, or your property. And quite rightly so. That would be a horrifying state of affairs. (Note: I’m sure you and your family are wonderful, lovely people, and that’s something I would never, ever do. Yikes!) So we “regulate” “free speech”. Why we may we not “regulate” gun ownership? What, in fact, is a “well regulated militia”?

          • Amos Moses – He>i

            PERSON CLOSE TO FL SHOOTER CONTACTED FBI LAST MONTH!

            WARNED OF BEHAVIOR, GUNS, DESIRE TO SHOOT UP SCHOOL

            ‘PROTOCOLS NOT FOLLOWED’ … ‘NO INVESTIGATION CONDUCTED’

            and the law not followed …… and people dead …… and the FBI is complicit ……… from FBI dot gov …………

            FBI Statement on the Shooting in Parkland, Florida
            On January 5, 2018, a person close to Nikolas Cruz contacted the FBI’s Public Access Line (PAL) tipline to report concerns about him. The caller provided information about Cruz’s gun ownership, desire to kill people, erratic behavior, and disturbing social media posts, as well as the potential of him conducting a school shooting.

            Under established protocols, the information provided by the caller should have been assessed as a potential threat to life. The information then should have been forwarded to the FBI Miami Field Office, where appropriate investigative steps would have been taken.

            We have determined that these protocols were not followed for the information received by the PAL on January 5. The information was not provided to the Miami Field Office, and no further investigation was conducted at that time.

            FBI Director Christopher Wray said:

            “We are still investigating the facts. I am committed to getting to the bottom of what happened in this particular matter, as well as reviewing our processes for responding to information that we receive from the public. It’s up to all Americans to be vigilant, and when members of the public contact us with concerns, we must act properly and quickly.

            “We have spoken with victims and families, and deeply regret the additional pain this causes all those affected by this horrific tragedy. All of the men and women of the FBI are dedicated to keeping the American people safe, and are relentlessly committed to improving all that we do and how we do it.”

  • Ganesha_akbar

    He’s all yours.

    You know.

    America knows it.

    • Croquet_Player

      “Mine, Yours, and Ours” (a charming movie, I recommend it to you). I understand how we all want to point fingers and blame people. We’re all angry, horrified, and heartbroken at this mass murder. Even if this young man did don a “MAGA” hat, I don’t think he represents all Trump supporters. Not at all.

      I don’t know what his “true” political affiliations were. I don’t know if he had the sense to know what they were either. I don’t know how sophisticated your political views were at 19. Mine weren’t all that well thought-through, and I’ve since revised a number of my opinions. Mind you, I’m not defending his actions, I’m just saying we all shouldn’t leap to painting this murderer as the sudden ideal nemesis of our own political views.

      President Trump said the shooter was “mentally ill”. I think that’s pretty obvious. Numerous classmates of his have reported how he was “obsessed with weapons” (guns and knives in particular), “killing small animals”, “cold”, “violent”, and so forth. They knew him well enough, and they identified him as “the guy most likely to shoot up the school”. And they were right. These are all the distinct hallmarks of a psychopath. Psychopaths might pick up a political ideology, or a “cause” here or there, in order to shroud themselves in a veneer of (at least some sort) of convenient “respectability”, but that’s not what they care about. They want to hurt and kill other people.

      You will note, I hope, how I didn’t say “shocked”, about the crime(s). While the crime is obviously “shocking”, it wasn’t “shocking” in the sense that we hadn’t seen it before, or it was vanishingly rare. School shootings happen a lot in this country. Obviously, even one should be considered “too many”.

      My heart breaks for all the victims of the shooting. All shootings. Parents, friends, coworkers, we are all changed for life. The question we must all ask ourselves, is “What must we do to prevent the next one?” I respectfully welcome your thoughts on the matter.

  • Elca

    What good is they ” prayers ” when these same people cling to their guns and religion more than Life itself? What good is that.
    But Cruz was a White Supremacist and yet none of these will prayer that groups like that be banned from our society. Why? does it have to do with Trump’s base? I think so…

    • Croquet_Player

      Sometimes thats’s the very best people have to offer. You must offer something different! I hear you’re upset. You are not alone. Do you listen to podcasts? May I recommend “Pod Save America”? Good luck, Elca!

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      a “white supremacist” Hispanic person …… RIIIGHT ……. i think NOT ………..

  • Croquet_Player

    I’ve read a lot of the responses here, and I am very moved indeed. People care. Thank you, to all.

    • Vince

      What a relief.
      We would just die without your approval.

      • Croquet_Player

        Really? I might not approve of you. Just kidding! 😉

  • If only the Coach who shielded students had been packing a gun, he and others would most likely still be alive.

    Another gun-free-zone shooting, thanks to the Second Amendment’s optional right as juxtaposed with the Biblical non-optional responsibility to bear arms in defense of ourselves, our families, and others?

    Which is more potent: 1) an optional right, or 2) a non-optional responsibility.

    Which is more likely to be legislated, licensed, and limited?

    Which did the pre-Second Amendment Americans look to as their authority for bearing arms?

    America was sold down the river when the 18th-century Enlightenment and Masonic founding fathers replaced Biblical responsibilities with Enlightenment rights, and nothing demonstrates it better than the Second Amendment.

    Think about it: The Amendment WITH the wording “shall not be infringed” is the MOST infringed, licensed, and limited Amendment of the entire twenty seven. Furthermore, a future generation of our posterity is likely to see the Second Amendment whittled away entirely or repealed altogether. This is inherent nature and danger of optional Enlightenment rights versus non-optional Biblical responsibilities, such as the following:

    “Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword [or today’s equivalent] in their hand … this honour have all his saints. Praise ye Yah.” (Psalm 149:6-9)

    “But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house [including spiritual and physical protection], he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.” (1 Timothy 5:8)

    For more, listen to “The Second Amendment: A Knife in a Gunfight,” delivered at the Springfield, Missouri Firearms and Freedom Symposium. Click on my name, then our website, and scroll about half way down our home page to our Featured Messages.

    At this same location, you will also find a radio interview Larry Pratt (Executive Director of Gun Owners of America) conducted with me on this same subject. I think you’ll find Mr. Pratt’s remarks especially interesting.

    If you prefer to read, see our blog article “The Second Amendment is Doomed.”

    • Amos Moses – He>i

      Unlike the liberals who control America, Israel actually protects its children by training and arming its teachers.

  • Amos Moses – He>i

    Mass Shootings Will Never Negate The Need For Gun Rights: Either you believe that people have an inherent right to self defense, or you don’t. All other arguments are a peripheral distraction.